Nick M wrote on Jul 6, 2007 12:57 AM:Leave our boys alone. Unless you can pick up a rifle and join them in Iraq you are NOT to judge them for their actions. Only soldiers can understand the thought process and mentality of war and only they should be left with the their actions amongst them selve to be judged and found with or with out guilt. So all of you couch Captains go salute a rock and leave this war to the soldiers.

USA way wrote on Jul 6, 2007 7:42 AM:Nick, can you say, "1st Amendment?" Hmmmmmmm .... did I say first? Why would they make it first? Hmmmmmm?

RGP wrote on Jul 6, 2007 11:01 AM:Nick must be a religious republican. Do what ever you want regardless of the rule of law. Then go to church on Sunday. Crimnal what they've done to our country.

To Nick wrote on Jul 6, 2007 11:25 AM:I wonder, would feel the same if the USA were invaded and occupied and the enemy soldiers were indiscriminately raping and murdering civilians? I don't think that being a soldier makes anyone free to disobey rules of engagement and kill anyone they want to kill.

Regardless wrote on Jul 6, 2007 12:15 PM:RGP, wow you must really be uncomfortable in your own skin. It is always obvious when you bring religion into it. Sorry you feel you must attack others to further your own beliefs. Oh, sorry - what beliefs?

Concerned-1 wrote on Jul 6, 2007 12:33 PM:Again Mark Walker follows the trail of a story that will surely A. help is career, B. undermine the armed services, C. sell newspapers, and D. keep our country sliding down the slippery slope of political correctness.

Concerned-1 wrote on Jul 6, 2007 12:34 PM:As for To Nick: Just keep selling the Marines out and your little scenario just may become reality. After all, we certainly can't defend ourselves with all the politcally correct bleeding heart idiots running the show. Arrrg!

To Nick wrote on Jul 6, 2007 1:10 PM:The article is about maries, not Soldiers.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 6, 2007 2:32 PM:This war is a ridiculous disaster that our military is incapable of controlling. We need to get out now

Realist wrote on Jul 6, 2007 2:40 PM:I am with Nick on this one. Though I have not had the privilege of serving in the Armed Forces you must keep in mind that "war is hell". You should not judge others unless you are in that predicament and endured the same experiences.

chris to Nick wrote on Jul 6, 2007 3:13 PM:Gee, I guess that if you were around at the time you would be one of those who supported the murder of the indian women and children. I am so glad that we have people like Nick that place no value on human life.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 6, 2007 4:28 PM:Since USA mentioned the 1st Amendment I'll try posting a comment again. I asked how we got from a polygraph for a job interview with the Secret Service to an NCIS investigation. It's like they have radar or satellite to seek every negative word our troops utter, and wait like vultures to pounce, regardless of the context. There's nothing new about our troops feeling they were involved in what NCIS wants to call "wrongful deaths". How was the question presented? Not all things are black and white. What do they expect from a guy who has been through a battle like Fallujah in 2004? Ten years ago Marine Corps General Charles Krulak wrote on Warfighting philosophy. He ordered all Marines to read it and act upon it. He said that "all" actions in war will be based on incomplete, inaccurate, or even contradictory information. He said it required leaders with a penchant for boldness and initiative "down to the lowest levels". He also said that we must realize errors by junior leaders stemming from over boldness are a "necessary part of learning". The part that the Corps seems to have forgotten was: "We should deal with such errors leniently: there must be no 'zero defects' mentality. Abolishing 'zero defects' means that we do NOT stifle boldness or initiative THROUGH THE THREAT OF PUNISHMENT." For goodness sake, make up your minds. Stop training Marines with a certain mindset and then persecuting them when they act upon it. It was reported by embeds all during the fighting in Iraq that the enemy would leave their weapons and run to the next site where they had more weapons stashed. What were these Marines to do in Fallujah; turn their backs during one of the worst battles ever and allow the insurgents to grab weapons they possibly had hidden? The Marines used boldness and initiative during the fog of war. Go figure! Why in the everlovin' world is this military so eager to persecute their own? Why does NCIS have a "zero defects" mentality? Whatever the reason; it's a tremendous example of one organization's abuse of power.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 6, 2007 4:35 PM:Well, looks like the ... who has no life is back. The comment at 2:32PM was not made by me. I feel so popular. By the way...CHRIS, how's it goin'? I notice you're back nibbling at Nick again with idiotic, insulting comments. Reminds me of someone who said he was going to change his blog name. Is it possible that You need to get a life. Coincidence???

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 6, 2007 6:45 PM:What's wrong with the word jerk? I've been called worse. The three dots make it look like it was something worse than the word jerk; If'n ya know what I mean. Just curious.

Major x wrote on Jul 6, 2007 6:59 PM:What is important to remember that this is not a fight of good against evil. "The line between good and evil runs not between us and them, but through the heart of every person." We can consider ourselves on the side of good ONLY if we DO good. If we do evil (starting wars, violating the laws of war, killing civilians, torturing people,etc.) than we are no longer on the side of good. That is why it is so critical that some people in the military, despite the best efforts of Cheney/Rumsfeld/Wolfowitz, have continued to hold the military to the highest possible standards. They can't control whether they go to war, but they have control over how we wage it. -a former USAF officer.

To Major X wrote on Jul 6, 2007 8:52 PM:I thought I was reading the post of a 60's hippie. A former USAF officer would not write such dribble. Not a fight between good and evil? Then what is it? Who is flying airplanes into our twin towers? Who is blowing up innocent people in a market or in a resturant having a meal? T/Sgt USAF retired.

To Major X wrote on Jul 6, 2007 9:08 PM:You sound like a phony-, not an Officer. Could be you are a wanna-be! But, not qualified for militry service.

Chris to AWrcryinoutloud wrote on Jul 6, 2007 9:13 PM:Well let's see. My problem with Nick is, what seems to me, his utter hatred of a people who have done nothing to us. If our troops commit cold blooded murder then we just look the other way. I just love how you military worshipers equate kiking in somebodys door then raping a fourteen year old girl and then killing her and her parents and five year old sister with killing someone in a firefight. Many of Nick's blogs display such hatred of a people who's country we destroyed. If my disgust is idiotic and insulting then so be it. It's going pretty good and I don't remember talking about changing my blog name besides I want you to recognize my blog when it appears. See you next time.

A Soldiar in Nam once said wrote on Jul 6, 2007 10:08 PM:"Ask not the butcher how he slaughters the pig, for he too has an unpleasant task."

To t/Sgt USAF wrote on Jul 6, 2007 11:43 PM:A hand full of Saudis fly airplanes into a building and that justfies killing hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and displacing millions as well as destroying a culture that took many decades to build. But then war gives you purpose, doesn't it. As a taxpayer I am disgusted with people that have your attitude.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 7, 2007 11:54 AM:To 'To' t/Sgt USAF: Please stop trying to rewrite history. "WE have NOT killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. Ever hear of insurgents, or terrorists, or Islamic Nut-cases? Saddam is the one with the huge numbers of dead to his credit. The insurgents are the ones with the huge numbers to their credit. OUR troops are NOT the ones. How about you go over there and speak to the "beheaders" and ask "them" to back off. Then, and only then, will the killing stop. If not for the haters and beheaders there would be No killing. There would be no Iraqis displaced. For cryinoutloud man. Our government pays "any" one who loses a relative in battle. Our government doesn't even verify whether the person they pay may be the enemy, yet takes it for granted that our troops are guilty of something just because an Iraqi says so, or just because the media says so, or just because a politician with his own agenda says so. So, Please do our troops a favor and go to Iraq, Iran, Syria, and other countries involved in the killing of innocent Iraqis and do your whining. Tell THEM to stop the killing and get off the backs of OUR own honorable, dedicated members of the Marine Corps, Army, Navy, and the Air Force; to whom you owe an apology. Hell, you owe an apology to all of them.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 7, 2007 12:50 PM:To Chris: NO! The problem is your attitude. Whether you realize it or not you pretty much shot yourself in the foot with that below the belt comment to Nick about Indian women and children. If I remember correctly, Nick is the proud Native American who I came to respect. He never uttered anything that represented hate. You interpret what one says in disagreement with your views as hate. Your pattern of below the belt comments such as tellng someone he places no value on human life is so over the top and out of the realm of reality. You see, Chris; not all of us place the 'most' value on the lives of Iraqis. We place the 'most' value on the lives of Americans, on the lives of our troops. That doesn't mean we don't care about Iraqis, but when it comes to taking someone's word...American every time!...Marine every time. When it comes to defending anyone...American every time. Marine every time. If you place your value on Iraqis more than your own then perhaps you might consider missionary work in Iraq. Take your work and your good deeds where your allegiance lies and leave those of us who defend our own in peace. Is there a pun in there somewhere?

Chris to AW4 cryinoutlaoud wrote on Jul 7, 2007 2:46 PM:I guess you don't read Nick's blogs because you can see by his total dismissal of the cold blooded murder of Iraqis that there is hatred toward the Iraqis even though he tries to justify it by giving carte blanche to the Marines. My point is that we know what we did to the Indians and our government and military are of the same ilk as the people who did those crimes, so I would think that Nick would be against the butchery of the Iraqis because of what his people went through. But lately I have been reading about the trail of tears and was struck at how a number of indians helped the long knives (whites) kill members of other tribes. So I am curious why Nick is so supportive of the long knives when they do to others as they have done to the indians. I aslo suggest that you learn to grasp where people are comming from by reading their writings. Many times they don't come out and say what their real feelings are but with the violent defence of our military it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out not only where Nick is comming from but also where these other people are comming from that so violently defend our troops.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 7, 2007 11:46 PM:To Chris: Mercy me! This is so amusing. Now I know where the media got the word "spin". Chris; you spin things so much that I'm getting dizzy. Gads! I hope Nick doesn't mind me jumpin' in again but this is just too much. It's really great for a chuckle though so thanks for making me laugh. Spin #1: Who ya trying to fool Chris? You know I've read Nick's blogs, or the three of us wouldn't have caused poor NCT to use up all their ink on us on the Sheehan story. Spin #2: "Your" interpretation (spin) Chris, of Nick dismissing Iraqi deaths..."deaths" Chris; Not murders. You do believe in proof do you not? Being the caring person you are, certainly you must believe in fair trials and all that legal, constitutionally guaranteed silly stuff. Spin #3: Oh No you don't! Can't let that one slide. You said you guessed Nick "would be one of those who supported the murder of the Indian women and children. It's obvious that "you" are the one who wasn't reading Nick's blogs or you'd have remembered that he most certainly would NOT, ever, for no reason, feel the way you suggested. Dizzy! Dizzy! Spin #4: The Trail of Tears. I heard of that. Gee! Imagine all those different tribes with different beliefs or goals actually fighting one another. WOW! Do "WE" have a book about "US" called Trail of Tears? Ever read about the Civil War? Spin #5: I don't know how you missed it but Nick was very articulate and honest about his feelings. So am I. I don't have to "learn to grasp" anything. In fact, at this very moment I am "grasping" exactly where "you" are coming from and I don't care much for it. As for "other people" "violently" defending our troops, let me help you out and just go ahead and include myself in that group and save you the trouble of trying to get me to "grasp" it. I think your use of the word "violently" is absurd. We are not violent Chris. We are "passionate" about defending our troops. OH! Sorry! That last remark I made was a polite reply to Spin #6.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 8, 2007 1:12 PM:To Chris: I was just re-reading your 2:46PM comment about our government and military in relation to its history with the American Indians. Maybe I should have listed that one as Spin #1. You accuse our military of being of the same ilk as the military of the 1800's? Haven't you noticed that times have changed? Pull your head out of the past and come to the present where we have the best fighting force on the planet. What about the troops who have "given" their lives to protect Iraqi women and children? I commented before how I taped embedded news video from the beginning of this war and continued for months. I have tape of an Iraqi child horrificly injured. Marines are on the ground all around him, holding him and trying to save him. One Marine is crying his heart out. I have seen more gentleness and compassion from our troops than I ever could have imagined, which was educating for me as a female because I always thought that "we" were the nurturing, compassionate gender. There are so many incidents like that one Chris. We've lost precious American lives because Iraqi children were used as pawns "by the enemy" to kill our troops. You do a great disservice to all who have served honorably, to those who have given their lives, and to those who stand accused of something that has yet to be Proven. You expect Utopia. It doesn't exist.

Chris to AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 8, 2007 9:17 PM:Talk about spin, you take the cake. I just love how you gloss over the fact that it was our troops that have killed or injured many thousands of women and children by saying our troops have given their lives to protect women and children. It is our troops that they needed protection from. I guess that those cruise missiles and bombs were gifts from Santa. I am sure that those reports from the embedded reporters, that were censored by the military, showed what was really going on. The only thing that has changed in the military is the weaponry. That child you talk about wouldn't have been wounded if we hadn't invaded. My God! Are you that naive or are you just putting me on?

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Jul 8, 2007 11:46 PM:To Chris: Why don't you go sit on the President's doorstep and gripe to him. Then when you're done drive or take a bus over to Capitol Hill and gripe to all those Congessmen, and women, who could care less what you and I think, and who could care less about what happens to the Marines in the Brig or the ones soon to join them. Then when you're done with that, go to Iraq and suck up to those you seem to care about more than Americans. I can't, and won't, deal with anyone who constantly belittles our troops. If you don't like it, go gripe to another blogger who will listen. I quit! I'm beginning to believe that you may be a politician incognito. If not; you've missed your calling.