jvc wrote on Sep 18, 2007 3:55 AM:Teaching to master tests is absurd by using students to do nothing but increasing expected data that ultimately proves nothing. One cannot measure effectiveness of instruction on a class as a whole but the progress of each individual student! Then the progress of each student is added to get the progress of the class as a whole!

Vistan wrote on Sep 18, 2007 4:46 AM:Oh no, a school district besides VUSD having a bit of teacher, administration problems! Good Luck to Mr. Shore in his efforts to affect change with the teachers union standing firmly in the way!

tk wrote on Sep 18, 2007 7:09 AM:Thats the problem with No Child Left Behind, poeple. Who cares if they learn anything! Make sure they pass that test!-

Up with people, not percentiles wrote on Sep 18, 2007 8:05 AM:In an age where computers could be used to administer individual diagnostic instructional tests galore, the current U.S. administration is bent on using expensive group standardized tests that do NOTHING to improve teaching and learning. The scores are cudgels over the heads of teachers and excuses for withholding funds from schools that desperately need them. They keep the poor, poor.

Modern wrote on Sep 18, 2007 8:23 AM:One of the problems with the LEUSD is that they have spanish kids who barely speak english. And when they take these tests, they don't do very well. Case in point, Machado Elementary has a demographic that is mainly spanish speaking kids. They have the lowest state test scores in LEUSD. What is the answer? Not sure.

thenewguy wrote on Sep 18, 2007 8:41 AM:I may be wrong, but I believe that higher scores on tests lead to more funding for the schools?

perhaps this will help... wrote on Sep 18, 2007 8:56 AM:I think that in this particular area, we need to have more emphasis on the language being spoken, & then their learning abilities will also improve. I know from having my children, English speaking, in classrooms filled with mostly Spanish speaking, that their is definitely a language barrior between alot of teachers & students, but I do not feel that an American school should have to teach bilingual classes in public school, afterall, this is America, speak English. If those who speak Spanish as their #1 language want to be in a public classroom it should be up to their parents to either enter them in special classes which are designed to teach the English language prior to their enrollment in a public school, or enter them in a private school that teaches through their own language. I know as a child growing up, in order for us to speak Greek, we had to attend a private school, it was not offered to us through the public school system, then when we were competent enough to speak both langauges it was up to our parents whether we continued our education in private or public education systems. I know that having these bilingual classes is taking away from my English speaking student, as the teachers are spending most of their time with the non English speaking trying to get them to understand. I do not feel that this is right for my student nor is it fair to the non speaking English student as well, it creates a resentment from other students that they get all the attention from the teacher. I know alot of folks will not agree, but I spend alot of time helping out in the school system & if they did, they would see it too...all I want to see is fairness for all involved...speak English in the American school system, get much higher testing scores & a lot more performance in & out of the classrooms. Afterall, if we, Americans were in Mexico or any other country, we would be required to learn their language in order to take advantage of any priveledge their country had to offer, isn't it only fair they do the same for us.

Sparkplug wrote on Sep 18, 2007 9:06 AM:As a parent; "I'm left out of the process of educating." The education system is so overly unionized that non-members (Parents) aren't proactivly involved unless "court-ordered" (by another union) The kids aren't "members" either, so they are treated like the "product". If we involve the community to participate then we won't have the common mistake of mentally assuming that, "It takes a village (school districts) to raise a child." It takes parents who are truly interested in raising their children, and less interested in "paying for material things" by working for others as opposed to doing their parenting obligations.

your right wrote on Sep 18, 2007 10:56 AM:Modern is correct. The test scores at Machado are the lowest in LEUSD because of the demographic. Rice Elementary, Tuscany Hills, Canyon Hills, and Wildomar schools do well. Not too many spanish kids there. The test scores were published here a few weeks ago. The answer may be to give the test in spanish. But that wouldn't be my choice.

Reardon wrote on Sep 18, 2007 11:36 AM:To Sparkplug: You must have read the quote by Teacher's Union leader, Albert Shanker: "?When school children start paying union dues, that 's when I'll start representing the interests of school children.? (Shanker was the former President of the American Federation of Teachers.)-

Dan wrote on Sep 18, 2007 3:26 PM:The scores are going to go up

Sparkplug wrote on Sep 18, 2007 4:06 PM:To Reardon, I was not familiar with Shanker till you mentioned it. I formed my opinion based on "the future of education" speach I saw on Rudy Guiliani's website, and the fact that Ms. Clinton DOES NOT REPRESENT ME as a parent. I'm irritated that the schools mandate with absolute analysis paralysis and see the stress they put on the teachers

all to familar wrote on Sep 18, 2007 4:30 PM:I agree "with perhaps this will help". I have seen first hand the frustrations of the english speaking students getting put on the back burner in class so a teacher can try to explain to an english challenged student what is going on. I am tired of getting mail,letters,and phone calls in English and Spanish. This is a waste of time and money. When I was younger we never saw any of that. Quit wasting money on tutors,2 language communications and we might have some money to bring back band,pe,field trips. Now theres a concept...

Reardon wrote on Sep 18, 2007 4:44 PM:To Sparkplug: We will not have good education until we reform the system. Pay starting teachers $100,000 a year to get the same quality at Teachers Colleges that we get at Engineering Schools. In return we should demand that Teachers abandon tenure, and get graded just like every other person in the workforce. When we demand the best of our teachers, we will get the best for our students and our students will perform to the standards. Right now we have low standards for our teachers, and we get low standards in our students. High-performing teachers must live a life of utter frustration with some of their low-performing associates -- but the union protects the lowest common denominator.

once again, I do believe... wrote on Sep 18, 2007 5:02 PM:if we stop doing this whole bilingual thing then children will begin to speak English in a country where it is the language of choice & therefore, once again, be able to teach our children as they should be taught. At one point during my son's education process here with the LEUSD, more than one of his teachers used him to help the other English speaking kids in class while she taught the Spanish speaking ones...now we are talking elementary school here & yes, at the time my son was a member of the G.A.T.E. program & he did do exceptionally well on his work, but I do remember as he got older (fifth/sixth grade) coming to me & asking me why he had to teach the other kids in class, they were starting to make fun of him...teachers pet, etc...I quickly put a halt to this taking place & later found out if I hadn't been able to do so, that he was going to stop doing his work so that his teacher wouldn't ask him to help...needless to say, I was fortunate enough to catch this before it got out of control futher damage to my son's education happened, but it makes me wonder to this day, does this still occur...I sure hope not, as I know there is still a big problem with the learning abilities amongst the language challenged students...once again, I hope that test scores will increase within our school system, but not at the price of having the test done in Spanis, this is an English speaking country & we must not make it a war upon words leaving out many other cultures who speak foreign languages but are not given test in their languages...point being...when in America speak English, it is the language of our heritage...keep it in our schools too...

not a bright idea wrote on Sep 18, 2007 5:32 PM:As a product of the LEUSD system, TCHS grad 06, we got to learn things not to pass standardized tests. If you teach only what is required to do well on the STAR tests, then you will have a poor student overall. Most of those tests were a joke, which really didn't require critical thinking. Sure federal funding is great, but hasn't anyone thought is it flawed? I know many teachers and admins that despise the No Child Left Behind Act because even if the school does well, even with an influx of Spanish speaking students, they may still be reprimanded. It all comes down to politics and money, however if we stick to this idea the future students will not have a broad and firm realization on life and its problems. Also this is why we need stricter immigration laws; these illegal immigrants having kids here which puts a strain on everything we have here: education, health care, traffic, law enforcement, etc. Not to be mean, but that is the truth, how can a student answer an english literature question if they don't even know basic English.

Jim wrote on Sep 18, 2007 5:51 PM:Unfortunately, what is not stated in this piece is the fact that the lowest achieving students are being deprived of courses and programs which engage them in the learning process. Courses such as science, art, music and other electives are abandoned in favor of greater and greater numbers of remedial classes. No matter how hard teachers work, the kids in the remedial classes feel dumb, and are relegated to attend classes for which there is little hope of success. This will lead to increases in test scores in the short run for simple rudimentary skills, but in the long run will lead to more drop-outs and a greater achievement and income gap.

huh? wrote on Sep 18, 2007 9:08 PM:I have been led to understand by the LEUSD Superintendent that the student test scores in the LEUSD are significantly improving. This has been touted as proof that the LEUSD deserved a better reputation than many of us in the community have allowed. If the LEUSD teachers are doing such a great job why are LEUSD administrators bashing their teachers?

Ruth wrote on Sep 20, 2007 9:01 AM:Earl Shore's comment ,"Dinosaurs out, the Crayola Curriculum is out." is condescedning and insulting. "...sharing is out," is absurd. These comments indicates a lack of respect for teachers by the district and a complete lack of knowledge about elementary learning by Mr. Shore. He might as well have said, "Fill in the bubbles, kids. Don't learn to speak, read, or write." It is unfortunate that LEUSD district continues to bash its teachers! LEUSD elementary teachers deserve better! More importantly, the students deserve better! Put Mr. Shore in a first grade clasroom at Machado, give him 36 students, and let's see "his" test scores. Real learning involves so much more than filling in the bubbles, and luckily, the parents in Lake Elsinore realize this. Too bad the district doesn't!

why not giving it a try? wrote on Sep 20, 2007 11:15 AM:Let's give it a try. If we all work together and try out new positive implementations, there is no doubt that we will see change for good in all schools, regardless whether improvement was needed or not. Come on, Lake Elsinore, you can do it!!!!!!

Art wrote on Sep 20, 2007 1:27 PM:Earl Shore has denounced not only the teachers of the Lake Elsinore Unified School District but also the Administration, the Board of Education and the citizens of Lake Elsinore. I would hope that the board of education would fire this individual who seems to put himself before all others in the public education system, especially the children and the teachers who work so very hard each and every day teaching to the state standards and the nuances of the misnamed federal law No Child Left Behind.

someone who knows wrote on Sep 20, 2007 3:03 PM:To Reardon; Obviously you have never spent anytime in an elementary classroom with 35 kids with half that don't speak english. The demands placed on teachers today is overwhelming and higher than most other professions. The standards that NCLB places on students is so high, that teachers are forced to teach to a test and make good test takers rather than intill the joys of learning and produce well-rounded students.

Reardon wrote on Sep 20, 2007 8:29 PM:To Someone Who Knows: Gosh, I don't know much about stress -- I only served a decade on diesel submarines, but I do know a little about teaching because I spent more than a decade teaching teachers at a university. And, yes, teaching a classroom where half the students do not speak English is stressful, but that is a choice -- and the choice is made by Administrators who want the ADA that comes from bodies, ANYBODY that occupies a chair. I have read my entire life about "Teachers' Strikes" and have NEVER, NOT ONCE read about a teachers strike for ANYTHING except more pay. Never a teachers strike for more academic classroom time, or better books, and NEVER a teachers strike to report illegal aliens to the proper authorities! If you want less stress, get your VERY POWERFUL TEACHERS UNION to make demands to report illegal aliens to ICE, or failing that, make all students who do not speak English, take only English immersion classes BEFORE they enter the regular classrooms to add stress to teachers and degrade citizen students' learning! There is no more powerful union in this nation than the combined NEA and AFT -- they can solve your problem, but they won't. If all of the illegal alien students were out of the classroom, we would need thousands of fewer teachers, and that means thousands of fewer union dues. (Follow the money.)

huh? wrote on Sep 20, 2007 10:20 PM:Reardon, are you saying that teacher unions should organize teachers to strike in order to force school districts to violate state law by not allowing students that are learning English to go to public schools? I thought you said you were a university professor.

Ruth wrote on Sep 21, 2007 9:02 AM:As I think about Mr. Shore's philosophy and statements, I came to the conclusion that perhaps he is just sadly misinformed. Here is some suggested reading: 1) The Reading/Language Arts Framework For California Public Schools 2) Preschool English Learners: Practices To Promote Language, Literacy, and Learning 3) The Fred Factor 4) Tuesdays With Morrie There is always room for improvement in education. LEUSD teachers want to improve however they can. Insulting them is NOT the way to effect change. Art is right. The teachers of Lake Elsinore deserve an apology from Mr. Shore for his approach.

Phil wrote on Sep 21, 2007 9:37 AM:From reading the article there seems to be a lot of double talk as to how students should be taught. First we read, "Dinosaurs are out, the Crayola curriculum is out." then we read, "Shore said he isn't about taking the fun out of learning, and wants teachers to be as creative and fun as they can be." Students will learn in an enviroment which they are comfortable in. Within this last year all I have seen and heard is the LEUSD putting pressure on the teachers to teach to the standards test, so they the administrators can look good. Set aside all the other true life knowledge skills, just get those math and english scores up. At a 160,000.00+ salary you would think Mr Shore would be a little more sure of himself. The LEUSD should have spent that money to assist the teachers they already have at the 5 Schools (out of 25) who showed a decline in the Growth Academic Performance Index Report scores for the 2006-2007 school year which was published by the state. Istead they elected to waste money on a smoke screen to hide the adminstrative blunders they are commiting. Mr Shore watch your back, when they make more adminstrative blunders they will use you as the scape goat and discard you like a worn out dish rag. -

Someone who knows wrote on Sep 21, 2007 1:22 PM:To Reardon: LEUSD teachers have NEVER been on strike!! It is illegal for the schools to ask if a person is illegal or not. Even if it was reported, who is going to do anything about it? You say you have been a University professor, but did any of your students NOT speak english? You OBVIOUSLY have issues with unions. Maybe you should become a part of one and fix all of their misguided ways. Then I am sure the public school system will be perfect. Maybe you are the answer to it all!

MrsDragonfly wrote on Sep 21, 2007 9:48 PM:Our LEUSD teachers are the BEST!!!!! Mr.Dino himself needs to start saying sorry to all thoses outstanding teachers who teach all of our kids!!

Kids First wrote on Sep 22, 2007 10:09 AM:Mr. Shore needs to publicly apologize to all the hard working LEUSD teachers for his teacher bashing remarks. The kids are the ones who suffer most when the community distrusts the teachers that spend every day with their children. Mr. Shore's comments did nothing to build up public support and parent involvement in the schools. Appreciation for committed teachers encourages more creativity and inspiring lessons than beating teachers down.

Ed wrote on Sep 22, 2007 10:38 AM:Once again I read an article regarding my childs education and the ridiculous philosophy the Lake Elsinore BOE Superintendent Passarella has bought in to. When is enough going to be enough. It's no wonder parents and teachers at Ronald Reagan Elementary School have taken matters in to their own hands and have taken the steps to turn this school in to a Charter School, which would give them the opportunity to not have to deal with this type of Psycho-babble. Yes we want are children to learn, but we want them to also be taught to be well rounded members of our society. Keep up the good work BOE and let me know when the next book burning takes place!

Teacher wrote on Sep 25, 2007 7:12 AM:I had the pleasure of reading the article the day it was printed. I hadn't read the comments on this page until today. First, I want to tell you, as a teacher in this district, I proudly educate ALL my students, regardless of their primary language, regardless of socioeconomics, regardless of this school districts administration! I love teaching, I have never gone on strike and infact, am willing to spend my own money to provide the things that our district will not - such as ART, SCIENCE, SOCIAL STUDIES. If you want our district to change their tune, I suggest changing the BOE. There will be an election Nov. '08 - run for the position, VOTE for someone that cares about children -not the almight dollar they bring. BE AT EVERY BOARD MEETING!! Let them know you are listening, watching and remembering and YOU WILL VOTE!! Show up to the public hearing for RRE on Oct. 12 @4pm - those teachers are taking a stand against this ridiculous regime!!

Attendance wrote on Sep 25, 2007 10:29 AM:I can't believe what an uproar there is to Mr. Shore's article!! Sometimes the truth hurts...Teachers need to wake up and always be searching for new ways and ideas to help the kids "get it!" The teachers who are burned out need to retire and get out of the school system and make room for new inspired teachers and staff. All kids can learn, so why don't they find a way instead of complaining. All of America's establishments need to be brought up to the 21st century and it definitely includes education!!! So why do the teachers be quite and do what it takes! They are in the profession of teaching the kids not saving their own butts! Have you seen the movie Freedom Writers; watch and be inspired!!!

4thekids wrote on Sep 25, 2007 1:42 PM:Although Mr. Shore has been given a directive to pull LEUSD up and out of federally mandated program improvement status, I find it disheartening and highly unprofessional that he would choose to use such disparaging and polarizing remarks about teachers in his quest to improve student achievement. I left industry holding a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Engineering to become a teacher. I consider it to be a great privilege to teach in Lake Elsinore. By and large, the quality and dedication the teaching staff has toward their students is second to none. Sure - there are a few disgruntled individuals who have burned out and hold inappropriate attitudes toward students – burn out exists in every profession; but they few and far between. Mr. Shore has painted a bleak picture of rampant teacher indifference bordering on prejudice that simply does not exist. LEUSD is staffed with innovative, intelligent, creative professional educators who honestly take the needs of every student into account and design lessons and activities for student achievement and success. As Mr. Shore encourages teachers to look at the grade level standards and encourages collaborative and innovative development of student centered learning opportunities, I encourage him to remember that without the goodwill and support of the staff, all of his good intentions will be lost. You can not push a rope, Mr. Shore. I suggest, sir, with all due respect, you take a moment. You need to mend more than a fence or two.

Concerned Parents wrote on Sep 25, 2007 8:05 PM:To Attendance; Did you read the article or are you just a BOE political pawn. The article gives no lee-way for creative learning. Teachers with creative learning techniques such as having children assimilate knowledge with what they know are taboo or, "out" as Mr Shore says. according to the article it's Mr Shore's way or no way. Go ahead teach a theory against the BOE, or Mr Shore way and see where it gets you. Find a way that shows a growth or improvement that isn't accepted by Mr Shore or the BOE and see what it gets you? I know three elementary school principals who can give you the answer to that question. As for your question, "Why the teachers be quiet and do what it takes," the answer is simple economics they have to eat! P.S. my child only gets one chance in life to get it right, no script no re-takes no cutting room editor! Who's living in th Fantasy land now!

Marie wrote on Sep 25, 2007 8:53 PM:To Attendance; Did you read the article. The article gives no lee-way for creative learning. Teachers with creative learning techniques such as having children assimilate knowledge with what they know are taboo or, "out" as Mr Shore says. according to the article it's Mr Shore's way or no way. Go ahead teach a theory against the philosophy of Mr Shore and see where it gets you. Find a way that shows a growth or improvement that isn't accepted by Mr Shore and see what it gets you? I know three elementary school principals who can give you the answer to that question. As for your question, "Why the teachers be quiet and do what it takes," the answer is simple economics they have to eat! P.S. my child only gets one chance in life to get it right, no script no re-takes no cutting room editor! Who's living in the Fantasy land now!

curious wrote on Sep 25, 2007 9:47 PM:I'm just curious as to what Mr. Shore means by "Dinosaurs and sharing are out". Does he mean don't teach about dinosaurs, or don't decorate with dinosaurs, or maybe dinosaurs mean old, outdated things? Is sharing old and outdated? When a child stands in front of 20 or 30 classmates and has to explain what something is and express why it is important to him, don't some mental processes take place that are useful in life? What is a "Crayola curriculum" and why is it better than a dinosaur? There is a difference between helping teachers with new ideas and micromanaging their classrooms.

Sam (Vistan 2) wrote on Sep 26, 2007 10:33 AM:In a recent, similar situation in Vista, BOE member Stephen Guffanti wrote to the newspaper in defense of Vista teachers. Why doesn't the LEUSD BOE weigh in on this issue? Is the teacher-bashing coming from the top?

Teacher wrote on Sep 28, 2007 7:49 AM:I am an elementary teacher and particularly offended by Mr. Shore's "dinosaurs are out, crayola curriculum is out, sharing is out" attitude. Fortunately, I am not in a grade that "tests" and therefore have received far less "heat" than my colleagues, however, this mentallity is not beneficial to the entire learning process. If I can't put dinosaurs in my classroom, I may not reach that ONE child that is facinated with only dinosaurs right now. That could close the only door to becoming a life-long learner for that child.....how sad is that? If my uniquely artistic child ONLY wants to learn about crayola right now, how will she develop a love of learning if I force her to read about how "the fat cat sat"? THEY ARE CHILDREN - NOT DOLLAR SIGNS! We are in business of educating human beings, not assembly products. How do they develop speaking skills if the don't share out in a group? How do they develop a sense of community if they can't SHARE their thoughts, feeling and things that are important to them with their peers? We want a better society: compassionate people that can collaboratively solve problems peacefully - not a society carbon copies.-

Rambo wrote on Sep 28, 2007 10:24 AM:I got an indecent education when I was a student. It didn't hold me back because I became a millionaire selling bunkbeds on the mean streets of Hibbing. My teachers were to busy reading newspapers instead of helping me get smarter. The honorable and eraseable Mr. Shore tells it like it is and the teachers just cannot take the truth. I remember drawing with crayons and coloring dinosaurs--that was a waste of time when I could have been learning about how they make crayons and dinosaurs. Mr. Shore is are only hope to educate are kids of the future. We need more like him in education to help pick up are kids by the bootstraps.

Teacher wrote on Sep 28, 2007 7:29 PM:Dear Rambo, I am very in touch with the truth and never too busy to educate my students. I don't feel that being proactive in my field and future is wasting time. I am truly sorry that you did not have a wonderful educational experience. Your comments lead me to believe that you would have enjoyed learning about dinosaurs and how crayons are made, in your case, it sounds like geometry and economics might have been interesting to you and spelling and grammar may not have been....sadly, what Mr. Shore is telling us is that it will help "kids" learn if they check off the standards that have been "covered"....I don't "cover" standards, I teach them. We don't need to check it off like a grocery list, we need to go beyond what's on the list and ensure that students have a firm understanding. This is not fiction, Rambo, this is our future and I don't want citizens that can't cooperate, reason, question and think running our nation in the future. By the way, children do not need to be "picked up by the bootstraps"...they are very positively motivated when they are interested and engaged - just as I'm sure you are in your business.