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Vibrant Downtown Medical Village At Risk
By: WALLY GUTIERREZ and ROBROY R. FAWCETT - Commentary | ∞
Wally Gutierrez, left, and Robroy R. Fawcett are residents of Escondido.
The vibrant, downtown medical village promised to the residents of Escondido is withering away.
Once again, politicians and government bureaucrats lose their resolve after having convinced taxpayers to part with their hard-earned money. Best efforts are now being wasted on a cynical blame game as politicians and bureaucrats fail to deliver on their promises. Communications lack substantive information and overflow with vague promises. What is sorely needed is a joint workshop, with ample public input, to salvage the downtown medical village.
Palomar Pomerado Health, a government hospital district, promised to invest $73 million in renovating Palomar Medical Center in downtown Escondido if voters passed a $496 million bond to be repaid, with interest, by taxpayers. After the bond passed, the Escondido City Council opposed construction of a new hospital in a prime industrial park for fear of blighting the struggling downtown business district.
As a result PPH suggested a three-phase project to create the downtown medical village. The City Council agreed to the new hospital location on the condition that PPH commit to its promises, in writing, to create the village. The result was a memorandum of understanding between PPH and the city.
In Phase I of the downtown medical village, PPH committed to make an offer, by April 2007, on the properties needed to build a new 50,000-square-foot class-A, premier office building. This office building was to become the new corporate offices and headquarters for PPH, housing about six executives and 222 employees with a combined annual payroll of about $16 million. PPH has yet to make offers to purchase all of the needed properties, leaving Phase I at least eight months behind schedule.
In disturbing moves, PPH revealed plans to house only a portion of its administrative staff in an existing 10,000-square-foot downtown office building and to house the remainder in a building purchased near the distant new hospital location.
Also, PPH has emphasized that Phase I of the Downtown Medical Village has always been dependent on developer participation and financing. In short, PPH would provide the land, and a developer would provide the financing. To date, PPH has not secured a developer for Phase I, and the current downturn in the real estate and financial markets are creating a bleak outlook.
In support of Phase I, the city has allocated $2.5 million over the next two years for closing Valley Boulevard, giving the land to PPH, and reconfiguring Ivy to handle the crossover traffic now handled by Valley Boulevard. Until PPH secures a developer and financing for the new office building and headquarters, we doubt that the city will close Valley Boulevard and hand the land over to PPH.
In Phase II of the Downtown Medical Village, PPH promised to renovate the existing downtown hospital buildings. At the time, PPH was brandishing a $93 million renovation budget and visualizing a start date in 2011 and a completion date in 2014. Now PPH has cut the renovation budget to $3 million, and delayed those measly renovations until no sooner than 2015. Where did the $90 million go? PPH diverted the $90 million to cover expected cost overruns on the new hospital.
Palomar Pomerado is now committing to finance the remaining Phase II renovations with revenue bonds after it refinances or pays off existing revenue bonds, issued in 1999. One report places the financing event in 2017.
We are extremely skeptical of such promises. It appears that only about $60 million may become available. The unfunded portion of Pomerado Hospital, and the unfunded buildings at the new hospital, will have a higher funding priority when that money becomes available. The memorandum of understanding expires on Feb. 8, 2020. Also, politicians and bureaucrats have a hard enough time delivering on their own promises, let alone the promises of past characters.
Phase III of the Downtown Medical Village was originally scheduled to take place between 2014 and 2019. PPH was to acquire properties along Fig and East Valley Parkway, and the city was to close a block of Pennsylvania and give the land to PPH.
With developer participation, PPH was to construct housing, nursing facilities and offices. With the delays and difficulties with Phases I and II, we believe that Phase III is dead because the memorandum of understanding will expire long before Phase III can be brought to fruition.
Both PPH and the city are maneuvering to avoid blame. PPH talks of delays and promises financing in the distant future, after the present cast has left the scene, hoping the city refuses to close Valley Boulevard. The city acts ready to spend $2.5 million to close Valley Boulevard. However, only $500,000 of that money is actually committed. The remaining $2 million is merely an expectation. The city hopes PPH will admit that Phase I lacks funding, before it has to agree to close Valley Boulevard.
The CEO of PPH was expected to appear before the City Council on Oct. 24 to give a report on the Downtown Medical Village. That appearance has never materialized. However, the CEO has appeared before the respective boards of the East Valley Association and the Downtown Business Association, and is scheduled to soon appear before the Escondido Rotary Club. Unfortunately, PPH can ignore the City Council because the memorandum of understanding is full of loopholes. Most of PPH's commitments for the Downtown Medical Village are covered by the language "best efforts," "shall consider" and "good faith."
The city and PPH need to admit that the financial picture for the Downtown Medical Village has changed. Most importantly, the atmosphere of mistrust between the city and PPH must end. The PPH board does not trust the City Council, and the City Council does not trust PPH. Most communications have occurred through dueling letters, commentary and opinions published in the predominant local newspapers.
Instead, the City Council and PPH board need to have joint public workshops until the funding priorities can be understood and a realistic and cost-effective Downtown Medical Village has been secured.
Wally Gutierrez and Robroy R. Fawcett are residents of Escondido.
The vibrant, downtown medical village promised to the residents of Escondido is withering away.
Once again, politicians and government bureaucrats lose their resolve after having convinced taxpayers to part with their hard-earned money. Best efforts are now being wasted on a cynical blame game as politicians and bureaucrats fail to deliver on their promises. Communications lack substantive information and overflow with vague promises. What is sorely needed is a joint workshop, with ample public input, to salvage the downtown medical village.
Palomar Pomerado Health, a government hospital district, promised to invest $73 million dollars in renovating Palomar Medical Center in downtown Escondido if voters passed $496 million bond to be repaid, with interest, by taxpayers. After the bond passed, the Escondido City Council opposed construction of a new hospital in a prime industrial park for fear of blighting the struggling downtown business district.
As a result PPH suggested a three-phase project to create the downtown medical village. The city council agreed to the new hospital location on the condition that PPH commit to its promises, in writing, to create the village. The result was a memorandum of understanding between PPH and the city.
In Phase I of the downtown medical village, PPH committed to make an offer, by April 2007, on the properties needed to build a new 50,000 square foot class-A, premier office building. This office building was to become the new corporate offices and headquarters for PPH, housing about 6 executives and 222 employees with a combined annual payroll of about $16 million. PPH has yet to make offers to purchase all of the needed properties, leaving Phase I at least 8 months behind schedule.
In disturbing moves, PPH revealed plans to house only a portion of its administrative staff in an existing 10,000 square foot downtown office building, and to house the remainder in a building purchased near the distant new hospital location.
Also, PPH has emphasized that Phase I of the Downtown Medical Village has always been dependent on developer participation and financing. In short, PPH would provide the land, and a developer would provide the financing. To date, PPH has not secured a developer for Phase I, and the current downturn in the real estate and financial markets are creating a bleak outlook.
In support of Phase I, the City has allocated $2.5 million over the next two years for closing Valley Boulevard, giving the land to PPH, and reconfiguring Ivy to handle the crossover traffic now handled by Valley Boulevard. Until PPH secures a developer and financing for the new office building and headquarters, we doubt that the City will close Valley Boulevard and hand the land over to PPH.
In Phase II of the Downtown Medical Village, PPH promised to renovate the existing downtown hospital buildings. At the time, PPH was brandishing a $93 million renovation budget, and visualizing a start date in 2011 and a completion date in 2014. Now PPH has cut the renovation budget to $3 million, and delayed those measly renovations until no sooner than 2015. Where did the $90 million go? PPH diverted the $90 million to cover expected cost overruns on the new hospital.
Palomar Pomerado is now committing to finance the remaining Phase II renovations with revenue bonds after it refinances or pays off existing revenue bonds, issued in 1999. One report places the financing event in 2017.
We are extremely skeptical of such promises. It appears that only about $60 million may become available. The unfunded portion of Pomerado Hospital, and the unfunded buildings at the new hospital, will have a higher funding priority when that money becomes available. The memorandum of understanding expires on Feb. 8, 2020. Also, politicians and bureaucrats have a hard enough time delivering on their own promises, let alone the promises of past characters.
Phase III of the Downtown Medical Village was originally scheduled to take place between 2014 and 2019. PPH was to acquire properties along Fig and East Valley Parkway, and the city was to close a block of Pennsylvania and give the land to PPH.
With developer participation, PPH was to construct housing, nursing facilities, and offices. With the delays and difficulties with Phases I and II, we believe that Phase III is dead because the memorandum of understanding will expire long before Phase III can be brought to fruition.
Both PPH and the city are maneuvering to avoid blame. PPH talks of delays and promises financing in the distant future, after the present cast has left the scene, hoping the city refuses to close Valley Boulevard. The city acts ready to spend $2.5 million to close Valley Boulevard. However, only $500,000 of that money is actually committed. The remaining $2 million is merely an expectation. The city hopes PPH will admit that Phase I lacks funding, before it has to agree to close Valley Boulevard.
The CEO of PPH was expected to appear before the City Council on Oct. 24 to give a report on the Downtown Medical Village. That appearance has never materialized. However, the CEO has appeared before the respective boards of the East Valley Association and the Downtown Business Association, and is scheduled to soon appear before the Escondido Rotary Club. Unfortunately, PPH can ignore the City Council because the memorandum of understanding is full of loopholes. Most of PPH's commitments for the Downtown Medical Village are covered by the language, "best efforts," "shall consider" and "good faith."
The city and PPH need to admit that the financial picture for the Downtown Medical Village has changed. Most importantly, the atmosphere of mistrust between the city and PPH must end. The PPH board does not trust the City Council, and the City Council does not trust PPH. Most communications have occurred through dueling letters, commentary and opinions published in the predominant local newspapers.
Instead, the City Council and PPH board need to have joint public workshops until the funding priorities can be understood and a realistic and cost-effective Downtown Medical Village has been secured.
Wally Gutierrez and Robroy R. Fawcett are residents of Escondido.
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PPH and the City wrote on Jan 27, 2008 12:20 AM:Both PPH and the city are maneuvering to avoid blame. But we all now know the truth. "PLEASE" Less talk and more action.
What a mess wrote on Jan 27, 2008 12:33 AM:What a mess and us Taxpayers are paying for their mess up. Fire CEO Covert and the PPH Board
Escondido tax payers wrote on Jan 27, 2008 3:49 AM:were duped by the politicians and the PPH organization. Is there some way that we (taxpayers) can render Prop BB null and void since the "promise" to build hasn't happened. Can we "recall" Prop BB??? Anyone who knows please write on this blog. Thanks
$ 90 Million wrote on Jan 27, 2008 7:52 AM: Where did the Downtown $90 million go? PPH diverted the Downtown $90 million to cover expected cost overruns on the new hospital. Downtown got screwed. This is what happens when you over promise.
Close Ivy Instead wrote on Jan 27, 2008 8:26 AM:The plan to close the Valley Blvd crossover is very ill advised. Instead, if the PPH offices are ever built, Ivy should be closed, with the PPH offices constructed on the west side of Valley Blvd. Ivy is the least used street in Escondido's downtown area and SANDAG is actively promoting walkable community projects. Also, East Valley businesses and residents are very concerned about the effects of closing Valley Blvd. Traffic may over load Grand, and flow through residential neighborhoods onto Oak Hill. Also forcing the traffic, now carried by the Valley Blvd crossover, onto Ivy will cause Ivy to become a high-traffic barrier to pedestrians trying to get from the new administrative offices to downtown business. A pedestrian bridge over Valley Blvd between the hospital and the administrative offices, would help draw hospital workers into the downtown area while allowing the administrative staff ready access to the hospital.
A sordid plan by PPH wrote on Jan 27, 2008 8:28 AM:It may take many years, but eventually I think these two will be proven to be right. PPH's goal was to build at ERTC at any cost. That included not fully informing the public of it's true intentions, abandoning things promised in downtown Escondido and at Pomerado Hospital and the like. It now appears that the PPH plan was to get quickly involved at ERTC to a point where they could argue that it was impossible to retreat due to financial reasons. The plan may still work, but it's a sad commentary on how much we can trust this organization.
Newsworthy! wrote on Jan 27, 2008 8:42 AM:Why is this information in the "Perspective" Section? If this information is accurate, don't you think it should be in the "News" Section? Shouldn't the North County Times be doing some reporting of their own on this subject? And I would hope that it wouldn't just be in the form of PPH press releases.
Loopholes? wrote on Jan 27, 2008 9:16 AM:Covert did talk at Rotary, and softball questions indicated the audience either accepts PPH's changes, was too sleepy, or unwilling to disagree publicly. An MOU with a sunset clause makes this a one-sided deal: taxpayers pay, and PPH does whatever they want. We can't expect Covert to reverse now. Their Board apparently agrees. Council is "settling" for the RTC hospital because PPH threatened to pull the plug on Escondido if it didn't, and because they are walking a fine line, cultivating support for their eventual reelection bids. This all boils down to power (the ability to set priorities...with taxpayer money) and accountability. Just like "talks in the community" don't mean change, I am not sure "public forums" would either. Our at-large, elected representatives on the Escondido's City Council are the ones positioned to force/convince/persuade PPH to honor BOTH its commitments to the RTC and Downtown sites. A deal's a deal, and Council members should stay up late, camp out on Covert's doorstep or whatever it takes to do what is right for Escondido.
I agree with Newsworthy wrote on Jan 27, 2008 10:05 AM: Will the North County Times NOW start to dig in and find out what is really going on? ...
exposed! wrote on Jan 27, 2008 10:15 AM:This is not new information. This is simply the way PPH operates under Michael Covert's leadership. Is it any coincidence that many PPH employees who worked for Covert during the BB campaign are no longer working there? Wonder why. Could it be that these same questions and issues were raised following BB, and Covert needed to quickly clean house? Taxpayers know they were fooled. Employees were used and forced to work on the campaign whether we believed in it or not, then discarded soon after. People know the truth about PPH! The downtown village will never happen! It was just a way of getting the "naysayers" to shut up and go away! And if you get a chance, read the MOU - it is a bunch of fancy legal talk, but is in no way binding. The joke's on US!
Promises Delayed and Unfunded wrote on Jan 27, 2008 11:59 AM:Three years ago, PPH said the new hospital would be 'built by 2009'.
www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/07/13/news/top_stories/7_11_147_12_04.txt Now PPH claims it will be finished in 2011. Increased costs have sucked all the funds from the downtown project into the ERTC hospital. The new hospital project schedule slips a day each day!
Duh! wrote on Jan 27, 2008 12:02 PM:Many of us predicted that downtown would be the poor stepsister of PPH because we knew PPH wouldn't have enough money for all this, and the downtown renovation plan was just a carrot to get the city and the taxpayers to vote for BB. Come to think of it, it wasn't even a carrot. It was more like a virtual carrot to sucker people into supporting this project while a ton of money could have been saved by using the buildings at the present site and building a new tower or two at that site. The city council should hold PPH to their promises!!
It's time wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:16 PM: It's time for PPH to come clean and tell the Taxpayers what really is going on. It should not come from Covert or the PR department. It should come from the PPH Board.
VA Hospital Retrofit wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:20 PM:Prop BB passed 38 months ago. In the meantime, the Federal government is finishing the retrofit of the VA Hospital in La Jolla for about $50 million. Building 1 is an 855,000-square-foot, 6-story cruciform structure that was built in 1970. The project was being completed in phases, supporting the uninterrupted operation of the facility. This facility provides a wide range of inpatient and outpatient services to nearly a quarter million veterans. The project was scheduled for a 30-month duration.
PPH poor leadership wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:26 PM:Poor leadership and management has gotten PPH into this mess. It wasn't the result of the Escondido City Council actions. It wasn't the result those wishing to keep the downtown alive. It's unfortunate that PPH now is stuck trying to shift blame around to try to mask their own ineffectiveness. Do you think the CEO will hang around to see things crumble? Of course not. Just wait to see all of the finger pointing when things fall apart. CEO blames the PPH board. The board blames the CEO (and whoever else happens to walk down the street). It's a sad day for Escondido.
Very Smart wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:38 PM: North County Times hire these guys they are VERY SMART our at least have them train your reporters
Beware wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:41 PM: Beware another bond is coming! I bet PPH is going to call it son of Prop BB
Naysayer to 'exposed!' wrote on Jan 27, 2008 1:58 PM:We didn't go away and neither will PPH's deceptions. The authors of this piece are in good company. We saw this coming before the election and it only continues to get worse. And notice how more and more taxpayers are asking why the NCT isn't reporting on this. It raises even more questions!
Facts or Fantasy? wrote on Jan 27, 2008 2:32 PM:Three years ago, PPH Boardmember Nancy Bassett wrote the following: 'Fact 2: There is a known project cost. The total is $753 million; . . .Fact 3: There is reason why the hospital can't stay where it is. Independent seismic experts, whose work was necessitated by a state mandate, say Palomar can't withstand the minimum 6.0 earthquake, and it's actually cheaper to build a new facility, including the cost of land, than to retrofit and rebuild.'
www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/10/29/opinion/commentary/20_56_5410_28_04.txt Looking back, Nancy did not have a good grasp of the situation.
No More Bonds wrote on Jan 27, 2008 2:39 PM:The real estate market is in the tank. Homeowners cannot afford to fund any more massive bonds. www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/01/27/news/top_stories/1_01_991_26_08.txt
On time and on track wrote on Jan 27, 2008 3:22 PM:All the hospital plans and actions are on time or ahead of time and on track. Where do all these know-it-all losers get off trying to cast doubt and make accusations? What have any of them ever accomplished of ANY significance in their lives? I wager nothing.
No one is surprised that a patent lawyer and a bookeeper might have a different view on healthcare facilities planning and construction than a healthcare system board with over 200 years of frontline healthcare experience.....
Mr. Covert wrote on Jan 27, 2008 3:25 PM:Mr. Covert and Palomar Pomerado Health should be ashamed of them self’s. When will they start telling the truth????
Not trustworthy wrote on Jan 27, 2008 4:33 PM:PPH and everyone associated with them are not to be trusted. Weasel language and clever deceptions don't cut it. We don't believe a word they say. The sooner all facilities in the entire hospital district are leased out to private operators, the better it will be for all of us. PPH has lost our trust! Turn our healthcare facilities over to Scripps, Sharp or anyone with ethics ASAP.
Eric wrote on Jan 27, 2008 7:52 PM:Let's get Wally appointed as the CEO of PPH! With his integrity, the truth would be known!!
Mary G wrote on Jan 27, 2008 8:10 PM:I just received an e-mail about this story and I cannot believe it. PPH must start telling the truth.
Please wrote on Jan 27, 2008 8:13 PM:Scripps, Sharp or anyone with ethics please buy ... (Palomar Pomerado Health) our lives are depend on it.
Ralph wrote on Jan 27, 2008 9:07 PM:Fortunately the article is shown twice in a row as the first time I read it I couldn't believe my eyes!
If the bond measure asked voter for permission to borrow money for a hospital downtown, then how can they use the money for a different purpose?
Suckers R Us! wrote on Jan 27, 2008 9:36 PM:Mr. Mike is sooooooo smooth!
We give him $500 million because he promised the world and now we are learning it was just a bait and switch -- before the first brick has been laid even.
Being smug wrote on Jan 28, 2008 8:22 AM:And PPH does not respond. What can they say? They sit there smugly like a cat with a pet bird in his mouth. The time will come when they need the support of the citizens of Escondido. It will not be there, count on that!
To "On time and on track" wrote on Jan 28, 2008 8:40 AM:Unfortunately 200 years of frontline healthcare experience doesn't require character and integrity. On time and on track for what??? They will build a shell and then start begging for money. Their own figures show they are in trouble at ERTC. As far as downtown goes, you can forget about it! They have already raided the coffers and there is no money left for that. Their poor planning has put us all in such a deep hole we can't get out! All they can do is spin the bad news.
Who owns what?? wrote on Jan 28, 2008 8:45 AM: I wonder if Wally, Robroy or their sheep own any property around PPH that would make them wealthy people when the downtown redevelopment is completed. They appear to have self serving interests, instead of the good of the community as a whole. There's the story!
Estimate wrote on Jan 28, 2008 8:57 AM: Can you name one project that has come within the estimate or on schedule? I can't either. And now the Sprinter might open in March. I also don't hear anyone screaming about a 9 million dollar (plus) bridge so a few people can walk or ride their bike across Lake Hodges. If you're going to complain, don't wear blinders or be self serving when it only affects your back yard.
On Time & On Track? wrote on Jan 28, 2008 9:38 AM:Who on the PPH Board has experience in overseeing a hospital construction project? Marcelo Rivera - NO!, Bruce Krider - NO!, Nancy Bassett - NO!, Linda Greer - NO!, Alan Larson - NO!, Linda Baily, - Not hospital! Only Ted Kleiter who oversaw the construction of the Palomar Medical Center expansion in the 1980's as an administrator. This current Board is blind to what is happening. The hospital was promised by 2009. A schedule slip of at least 2 years over a 3.5 year period, combined with a 70% explosion in the budget, are ample evidence that the facilities expansion projects are not on time or on track!
Stuck with investments wrote on Jan 28, 2008 11:19 AM: If you read the 5th paragraph of this perspective, it tells the true story. "In Phase I of the downtown medical village, PPH committed to make an offer, by April 2007, on the properties needed to build a new 50,000-square-foot class-A, premier office building." The writters apparently didn't get an offer before the real estate market tanked. Now PPH will pay less for the land and save taxpayer money.
Sour grapes wrote on Jan 28, 2008 11:40 AM: Thanks PPH for saving our taxpayer money and not buying at the height of the real estate market. Maybe the greedy land speculators will lower the asking price for the land.
If I were PPH wrote on Jan 28, 2008 12:58 PM: If I were PPH, I'd wait another year before commiting to a land offer. Why buy high, there's no hurry. Work on the new hospital and let the market correct.
To sour grapes and If I wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:03 PM:Don't you get it? There is no money to buy or do anything in downtown Escondido now or later. The money is being spent and will be spent on the white elephant ERTC Hospital. Buying downtown and involving a third party developer to build a quality class A building would require a long term leaseback by PPH at market rates. They will never do that. Instead, they have overpaid for a piece of junk three story building that may or may not have have some PPH office workers in it some day. That's it for you, downtown Escondido. Get used to it.
To If I were PPH wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:19 PM:Does it matter if they had an agreement with the city? Or is this all about PPH ??????
PPH wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:22 PM: Palomar Pomerado Health Admin is very BAD. The Doctors are Great!. Keep the Doctors and Fire the Admin Staff.
Little Hong wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:25 PM: PPH's Mission Statement should be: Do as we say NOT as we do. (Trust Us)
Mr. Covert wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:27 PM: We are very ashamed of you. The PPH needs to make sure that they keep their word to Escondido Taxpayers
Fool on the Hill wrote on Jan 28, 2008 2:33 PM:It is funny that 'Who owns what??' uses the word sheep. The main reason I got involved is that I felt like a sheep being herded around after I voted for BB and then realised just how badly we had been led astray. And NO, I don't own any land downtown and am not close to anyone who does. You might want to look in a mirror. Spin your 'story'...I prefer nonfiction when it comes to politics and healthcare.
PPH PR department wrote on Jan 28, 2008 3:06 PM: Hay who owns what ? Who gets free Charger Tickets. Who gets free LT Autographs. I bet the PPH PR department employees. Do they own land in Downtown ????
The Energizer Bunny... wrote on Jan 28, 2008 3:35 PM:This thing keeps going and going and going. I find it interesting that the only people who continue to bring this matter to the media's attention are the "naysayers". And rightfully so. Michael Covert and his team expect that if they keep ignoring the problem, it will go away. You never see Mr. Covert address the questions put before him. You never see him put out an editorial defending the hospital's financial issues. He and his team are so busy forming committees to decide which pro athlete to throw money at. The decision to pay LT $2 million from the PPH fundraising office - that's DONOR money - was the dumbest PR move ever. And now PPH wants to stick its head in the sand whenever anyone raises questions about the bond or the lack of money. It's funny - during the BB campaign, Michael Covert was EVERYWHERE - you couldn't escape him! And now he's nowhere to be found. Come on, PPH - step up and BE ACCOUNTABLE!!! Do what you said you were going to do!
lessons learned wrote on Jan 28, 2008 3:53 PM:Now we understand how the current PPH regime works and thinks. All of this was done in the most cynical, duplicitous and premeditated manner imaginable. There is no reason to give this group the benefit of the doubt going forward. Citizens of Escondido, spend your health dollars somewhere else. PPH is not to be trusted.
BE ACCOUNTABLE wrote on Jan 28, 2008 4:48 PM: This is very simple Palomar Pomerado Health needs to: BE ACCOUNTABLE AND KEEP THEIR PROMISES!
Charger Tickets wrote on Jan 28, 2008 4:51 PM: Free Charger Tickets and free LT Autographs. No new hospital ?? Now I know where our Prop BB money is at (Political Pork)
A New World Of Healing wrote on Jan 28, 2008 5:04 PM:Any of several private hospital chains could have done better than PPH hoped to do for less money, and without levying taxes on our properties.
Peas wrote on Jan 28, 2008 5:38 PM:Covert and Escondido Mayor Pfeiler are 2 peas in a pod (Bad News)
Last Naysayer wrote on Jan 28, 2008 7:14 PM:Hey folks, haven't you noticed downtown Escondido is sewer, so why build a new hospital there anyway ? The escondido research park is clearly the ideal location to invest limited the limited funding that is available. I think there were many real estate spectators that invested in the downtown area surrounding the Hospital, and now you have sour grapes because of the delays. If you were reeally concerned about providing good healthcare to our community you would support the new hospital at teh research park...
My Town wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:56 AM:This is my hometown will Lori, Ed, Sam, Marie, and Dick stand up for my hospital Downtown? This place has saved my life. and to Naysayer, Downtown is not a sewer. You must work for PPH remember when they said we had a dump in Escondido? Please PPH keep with the facts and stop pasting out bad info. Just do what you promised.....
LT wrote on Jan 29, 2008 6:12 AM:Mr Charger if you are hurt. Please do not use Palomar Pomerado Health go to Sharp, Scripps. We really need you for next season
Pity Them wrote on Jan 29, 2008 7:38 AM:Pity the poor souls on the PPH Board. They had no experience or expertise with large facility expansions, large expenditures or large projects, and made a number of horrible decisions. They wouldn't listen to those in the community who repeatedly and in detailed described how wrong and damaging their decisions were. Now they (and we) have to live with these decisions. The Escondido downtown and North County health care will suffer for decades because of their bad judgment and arrogance. They now just stonewall and hope the whole thing will go away. They can't face most members of the community who know them. The Escondido City Council had a rare chance to correct this obvious disaster but lacked the courage, the backbone, to do so. They had a once in a lifetime opportunity and failed. We are served poorly by these individuals.
Please Sell wrote on Jan 29, 2008 8:34 AM: PPH Please Sell to Childrens, Sharp or Scripps they have Great leadership and LT do not even charge them to say nice things about them
Going to Sharp wrote on Jan 29, 2008 9:13 AM:Sure glad they are fixing I-15. It is so reassuring to go down to Sharp and give my money and trust my health to a quality organization instead of supporting these clowns at PPH.
WallyG wrote on Jan 29, 2008 9:15 AM: I have a right to speculate and make money, as do all of you. My family has owned property downtown for years. Why should the rich only get richer? Don't forget to buy flowers for Valentines Day!
I agree wrote on Jan 29, 2008 10:23 AM: I agree with Please Sell "PPH Please Sell to Childrens, Sharp or Scripps they have Great leadership and LT do not even charge them to say nice things about them"
Downtown Medical Village wrote on Jan 29, 2008 10:31 AM: Downtown Medical Village ???? Oh! We are sorry we were just joking
Election year wrote on Jan 29, 2008 10:53 AM: Sam will jump on any bandwagon that may get him votes, so count on his support up til November. You may want to record the next East Valley meeting. And you can count on Bobby boy to run for an office.
Stick with the Facts wrote on Jan 29, 2008 11:10 AM: PPH "Please" Stick with the Facts. Is there anything incorrect with the "Vibrant Downtown Medical Village At Risk" Article? I know the PR department likes to spin things. Sorry PPH PR Department the "Facts" are the "Facts"
Cali Gal wrote on Jan 29, 2008 12:14 PM:I have an idea..let's turn the existing hospital into another Latino Market. Fits the demographics and economic demand of downtown Escondido to a tee! Hate to say it, but DOWNtown Esco is going DOWNhill a little more each day.
motivation? wrote on Jan 29, 2008 12:49 PM:it would be interesting to uncover the motivating force(s) behind the authors of this article.
State of California wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:03 PM:yep, it's election year. what offices are gutierrez and fawcett (or their close buddies in escondido) running for? there you have the real "motivation"
White Coats wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:04 PM:We are really in trouble if PPH sells off assets to cover cost overruns.
Motivation wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:19 PM:Good government. The existing emergency room was built in 1988, and it the newest in the area. The hospital buildings are not 50 years old. The cost of retrofitting PMC was once set at $3-6 million. The district's population is not going to grow to anywhere near 1.3 million by 2024. The nearby Mission Park(formerly Grant Ave) area already has the fastest growing poverty rate in California. PPH promised a vibrant downtown medical village, not blight and a largely vacant facility.
Little Hong wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:25 PM: Wally and Robroy are making my job harder. just trust "Covert" aka Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show
Kaiser Initiative wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:28 PM:My political goal this year is to get the agreement between Kaiser and PPH released to the public before the November elections. All of my 'buddies' roll their eyes when I mention it.
To State... wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:32 PM:I thought I might run for the Historic Preservation Commission. You got me. YIPPEE! I'm going to be RICH, RICH RICH!
Come Out wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:38 PM: PPH, Come Out, Come Out where ever you at and start talking to the public. “BEWARE” Tape whatever they are saying! Then you will find out how PPH keeps changing their story.... Remember PPH Facts not Fiction….
More motivation wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:53 PM:I perceive that these writers really care about Escondido. If this kind of care would motivate our Chamber of Commerce (total PPH shills) DBA (heads in the sand), City Council (wishful and inept), or City Staff (lazy, overpaid and nonchalant) there is a good chance that PPH would not be able to get away with this punch to the gut of our City. Three cheers for the NC Times for printing this column and the guys who wrote it.
In the News wrote on Jan 29, 2008 3:18 PM: Little Andy Hong does a story of all the promises broken by PPH. Oh, then I woke up PPH doing the right thing "NOT"
Patricka wrote on Jan 29, 2008 3:29 PM:Robby and Wally = political partners or puppets? Either way, they "really care about Escondido." Yeah, RIGHT.
to "More motivation" wrote on Jan 29, 2008 3:43 PM:Shame on you for your comment which generalizes all City Staff as being "lazy, overpaid and nonchalant." I happen to know quite a few City Staff members who are quite the opposite! Thank you, City Staff, for your hard work and commitment to our City.
More motivation wrote on Jan 29, 2008 4:35 PM:Sorry that some may have taken my earlier comment as aimed at all city staff. However, the City Manager, City attorney and their staffs should have fully advised the council on the MOU. I doubt the Council was fully aware of all the loopholes and obligations that it contained. Are they presently advising the Council of any and all recourses available to them now. I doubt it.
Gee wiz Wally wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:04 PM: I like Mike and Little Andy!! You, Bobby and Dr. M would like them if not for your real estate. Don't cry it'll be worth more than you paid for it some day.
To Patricka wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:21 PM: According to you only PPH really care about Escondido." Yeah, RIGHT ……….”EVERYONE” knows that is NOT true. …
Go Public wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:32 PM:PPH "Go Public" With Real Facts and come to a council meeting if you have nothing to hide
Facts Not Fiction wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:42 PM: PPH cannot handle the truth!.... KEEP your promises PPH!!!!!
More motivation wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:47 PM:I don't know what all this silly, personal talk between parties is about. However, for "Gee Wiz Wally" to accuse those who are alarmed and horrified by PPH behavior as being mere real estate speculators is way off the mark. The premeditated and calculated breach of Prop BB and MOU promises by PPH will have longstanding detrimental consequences for the entire district. I doubt that PPH can or should survive this debacle in its present form. How much better it would be for all of us if the district leased out its facilities to professional hospital operators like Sharp, Scripps or even Kaiser! The trust and goodwill that this regime at PPH has squandered will not return unless there is a complete change of direction and leadership.
Dr.M wrote on Jan 29, 2008 6:01 PM: I'm sick of you low lifes. Just who do you think you're talking to. You are nothing. Wally and Bobby are mine, and you'll leave them alone!
Little Andy wrote on Jan 29, 2008 6:08 PM: I want a raise too. But they (PPH) say the do not have anymore money. Heck I'll stay here I like GustavoF, Covert, Wally, Robroy and even Larry
spectator wrote on Jan 29, 2008 6:39 PM:To: "City and PPH", who wrote on Jan 29, 2008 5:04 PM: "Go Public on the issue and eveything will go away" I'm just wondering....does that include Wally?
Having fun yet? wrote on Jan 29, 2008 7:15 PM:Well, the ten of you on this ridiculous blog are sure having a good time aren't you? I have a news flash for you --- It's over! The hospital is being built and guess what Escondido - we don't care! I don't live in the city and I can't wait to see the new facility. You really are all crazy if you can turn your head to the economics of having a state of the art health care facility in your community. The only thing the PPH Board did wrong was not vote to build the thing in San Marcos. Construction would have already started and then you'd be all alone, crying and hanging onto the old crusty building wishing you could recoop those lost property values. Talk about being left behind - Get over it already...
Truth wrote on Jan 29, 2008 7:54 PM:The truth is coming out. Darn that pre-election promise to build in Escondido. They tried to get out, but they keep getting sucked back in!
Three Hospital Solution wrote on Jan 29, 2008 8:04 PM:Having fun yet has one good point. Building a new hospital in San Marcos about the same size as Pomerado, and retrofitting the existing downtown hospital, would have been better for the district. The freeway between Escondido and San Marcos is clogged for much of the day. Now PPH will be stuck with a hospital overshadowed by the power plant's plume.
Show me the money wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:01 AM:I don't see any tangible sign of 'the new facility.' I do see a huge plume from its next door neighbor. It looks like a tornado is headed this way. It will provide many intriguing photo ops for years to come. Covert's dream image, castle in the sky, with that ever-present plume as an accent. I'll provide the pictures - you provide the spin on the genious of siting this 'state of the art healthcare facility' right next door to a power plant.
To wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:09 AM:Sorry pal but I saved the e-mail which stated that San Marcos never seriously considered PPH's proposal. It was a ruse and sham. It is very sad that so many fell for it. The truth shall set you free.
San Marcos Bluff wrote on Jan 30, 2008 8:17 AM:Who needs secret emails. 'I think the hospital would be great,' said [San Marcos Mayor Corky] Smith, who added that he had recently spoken with Palomar Pomerado's chief executive officer, Michael Covert. 'I think they are serious about San Marcos, but I don't think Escondido is going to let them move.' www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/06/29/news/inland/0_00_286_28_05.txt The San Marcos site was going to require a small fortune in earthwork, and San Marcos was going to want some major infrastructure improvements. PPH got a great deal with the City of Escondido, yet they are now jilting Escondido. Shame on PPH!
Cruiser wrote on Jan 30, 2008 8:50 AM:First of all, there has been a great injustice done to the City of Escondido and its residents. PPH needs to be held accountable, there is no denying that. Now...as far as Gutierres and Fawcett being so passionate and caring about the livelihood of Escondidians...I don't buy it, not even for ONE MINUTE! One of the posters above stated "The Escondido downtown and North County health care will suffer for decades because of their (PPH) bad judgment and arrogance." No, North County health care will NOT suffer "for decades"...Escondido is going to have a BRANDS NEW, state-of-the-art hospital right across the freeway, less than 10 minutes from downtown Escondido! I wouldn't describe that as North County health care "suffering for decades." Gutierres & Fawcett obviously have their own PERSONAL agendas! Get over it-It's OVER! Now, let's focus our attention on our City Council and how they'll hold PPH accountable for their mistakes.
Chuck R. wrote on Jan 30, 2008 9:01 AM:"The truth shall set you free" what is this, an Oprah episode?? As someone above said "GET OVER IT!!" To the two writers of this article, please repeat after me: "GET OVER IT!" Let your city leaders do their jobs and handle this mess. I, like several other people on this blog, really have to question your motivations)for being so very moved about this subject, enough to write an article about it. What personal gain/loss are you incurring with/without the new hospital in downtown. You're going to have a new hospital, just a little further down the road. How does that hurt you??? Please tell us all!!!
tcmhOBESERVER wrote on Jan 30, 2008 9:03 AM:I sure hope the powers at TCMH in Oceanside will learn from this fiasco as they try and craft another bond issue for the tri-city home owners..it hasn't passed twice before, and three strikes, you're outta here.
LT wrote on Jan 30, 2008 9:11 AM:to "San Marcos Bluff" -- they're not "jilting Escondido." Esco will have its hospital, just in a different area of town than what was previously planned. So what, things change. That's the FACT. The truth shall set you free, don't you agree? So face the facts and MOVE ON already.
To Chuck R. wrote on Jan 30, 2008 10:16 AM: Chuck R., You do not understand the issues. #1. After Prop BB. PPH said they would build a new hospital. “Now” PPH does not have the money to complete the “New Hospital” They are cutting the children and women center and they don’t even have the money to build the central plant so they outsourced it. #2 PPH promised to upgrade the old hospital (MOU) they told everyone that they would spend $73 Million then $93 Million NOW $ 3 Million it is hard to build a “Medical Village” for $3 Million. So you asked what is our real motivation?. It is that public officials do not fulfilling their commitments and lying to the taxpayers. I am sorry if you do not believe it. But this is a fact. We are sorry you do not make your Public Officials accountable WE DO…..
Jim wrote on Jan 30, 2008 10:23 AM:Everyone wants to move on and I am sure that is the PPH mantra. Too bad that the new site is such a disaster and the schedule is chronically delayed. The problem is that moving on means being OK with the train wreak called Prop BB. Why is it OK to build a hospital for the express purpose of pleasing Kaiser? Why not give the same deal to other private health providers? PPH needs to disclose the agreement like they are required by law to do. The contents must be so explosively controversial that they cannot find it in themselves to come clean. Some heads may roll. All the other promises for clinics, Pomerado, Downtown Escondido, etc wither away, but the Kaiser ERTC hospital must be built! Let's find out why. It is time to disclose the Kaiser agreement and all promises that surround it. Maybe then we can "move on" in a different direction.
Cruiser wrote on Jan 30, 2008 10:27 AM:to the person that insists on using the City Council's names while posting, shouldn't you be somewhere right now...like in a third grade classroom? give us a break & stop your immature behavior. ...
Jim wrote on Jan 30, 2008 10:36 AM:Everyone wants to move on and I am sure that is the PPH mantra. Too bad that the new site is such a disaster and the schedule is chronically delayed, meaning that they could still turn back. Delays like they are experiencing means that time sensitive contracts are now pretty much void anyway. The main problem with moving on is that means being OK with the train wreak called Prop BB. Why is it OK to build a hospital for the express purpose of pleasing Kaiser? Why not give the same deal to other private health providers? PPH needs to disclose the agreement as they are required by law to do. One can only assume that the contents are so explosively controversial that they cannot find it in themselves to come clean. Some heads may roll. All the other promises for clinics, Pomerado, Downtown Escondido, etc wither away, but the Kaiser ERTC hospital must be built, come hell or high water! Let's find out why. It is time to disclose the secret Kaiser agreement and all the promises that surround it. Maybe then we can "move on" in a different direction.
to Tina P wrote on Jan 30, 2008 11:17 AM:Why question who really wrote it? Why question the motives? It is irrelevant. There is no reason to doubt that Wally and Robroy did the hard work necessary to ferret out the facts that PPH loves to obfuscate. Instead, reread what they wrote and concentrate on the facts. Realize also that PPH and their minions have refuted nothing in this article. Absolutely nothing. This is a terrible indictment of PPH, a public agency. Time for regime change.
ERTC Rocks! wrote on Jan 30, 2008 1:41 PM:Literally! Digging deeper (than 10 feet) will yield big surprises. What is the status of the joint venture between JRM and PPH for a Medical Office Building in the ERTC? Has it fallen on the rocks?
ERTC Soils wrote on Jan 30, 2008 1:47 PM:'I'm not trying to say that the hospital's on bad fill,' said Fawcett. 'But there's a lot of acreage up there that's not in accordance with the original design drawings and the (city's fill) ordinance.' Shanahan [PPH's Architect] acknowledged the soils report in question 'has some ugly numbers.' www.nctimes.com/articles/2007/12/02/news/top_stories/1_01_0312_1_07.txt
re: Soils wrote on Jan 30, 2008 1:55 PM:wow, you guys don't give up, do you? it's going to be built there, whether you like it or not. end of discussion!
The Principal wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:07 PM: Gustavo, Little Andy, and Tina P you have been bad. (Passing out Fiction Not Facts) go to the Principal office. P.S. The Principal is not Covert
Plumage wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:09 PM:I don't mean to ruffle any feathers since there is an agreement regarding the power plant's lack of liability to the hospital BUT it would be interesting to get a legal opinion on PPH's liability to the citizens/taxpayers/patients if its chosen location results in problems. Life Flight doesn't need to fly on cold damp nights, does it? Stay up late and check it out. The plume is huge!
To re: Soils wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:09 PM: We have no problem with the ERTC… But keep your commitment to Downtown! Is your word wroth anything????
question for "Citizen" wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:10 PM:please tell us how much money you should be getting back, if it were indeed possible to issue a refund to you? give us a specific dollar amount.
To re: Soils wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:12 PM: Don't forget about the "ROCK" problem at the ERTC..... I am sure that that will not be the end of discussions about YOUR problems there.
re: plumage wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:13 PM:what about the "plumage" above the ice skating rink? boy, i bet that's going to cause all kinds of major problems, too! i hope life flight doesn't need to maneuver around that plumage. sure is a disaster waiting to happen!
To Tina P wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:19 PM: We all know you do not think for your self. You do as "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show" tells you.
ERTC Soils wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:45 PM:PPH will go forward with an ERTC hospital, no matter the cost. That is the problem. The rocks alone has increased the grading costs to almost half the cost of the land. And that does not include costs for the rocks under the JRM/PPH MOB.
to the 2 Authors wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:46 PM:We all know that you do not think for yourselves. You do as you are told to do.
If the truth will set you free - wrote on Jan 30, 2008 2:52 PM: And everyone wants the facts straight. We already know PPH's position, how about Wally, Rob, the Santrach's, that accountant (forgot his name), Sam and the others. Tell us what property you own or have a vested interest in (near PPH) and when it was acquired. Let us decide if your intentions are pure. You may garner more supporters for your cause. If NCT won't publish it, bring it to the East Valley meeting. We'll be there.
Property Check wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:15 PM: I did a property and found out Tina P does not live in the Escondido limits. Covert, Gustavo, Tina P and Little Andy have higher value properties than Wally and Robroy. So your right the Rich get Richer and the poor get poorer
To: If the truth will set you free wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:19 PM: Do a property check... The truth will set you free
Property Check wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:24 PM: I did a Property Check and Wally and Robroy are not rich. Nice try PPH (The Rich Guys)
Property Check wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:32 PM: Do Property Check's and the Facts will come out. Nice try PPH PR department.
PPH PR department wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:34 PM: Maybe Wally and Robroy are being paid by Scripps, Sharp
What next ??? wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:35 PM: Just wait "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show" will be out soon
To property check wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:36 PM:It's easy to find property on a residence, but locating property through relatives, trusts, buisness names and/or partnerships is difficult. Also, the county charges for the information. For one individual I mentioned there were 48 document numbers, another had 24. Robroy had five trust deeds. Talk about the rich getting richer!
Jim wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:41 PM:This property gambit is a real hoot. You posters are trying desparately to impugn the integrity of others when PPH lacks all integrity. In fact, you cannot imagine anyone acting in the best interest of Escondido, which is undeniably being irreparably harmed by PPH treachery.
To PPH PR wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:43 PM:Afraid of Sharp and Scripps? Now we are getting somewhere. A little competition is exactly what every straight thinking Escondidan wants.
PPH PR department wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:44 PM: Maybe Wally and Robroy are running for Governor of California
PPH PR department wrote on Jan 30, 2008 3:45 PM: Maybe Wally and Robroy are running for President of the United States
Answers wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:14 PM: You want answers from PPH - the supporters of PPH want answers from you. What are you affraid of? We're attempting to iron out fact from fiction. That's what you want. If you want our support, just answer some questions. Grand Ave. is not a one way street and neither is this situation.
Re: re: plumage wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:21 PM:The ice rink isn't next door to the new hospital site and it's plume doesn't appear to be nearly as large when both are visible. And your point was???
to question for Citizen wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:25 PM:How about $124.73 x the length {in years} of the bond debt + a couple of Charger box seats {for pain and suffering thru these blogs}
5 Trust Deeds wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:26 PM:Some fools cannot tell the difference between a deed and a mortgage. The way real estate values are dropping, many land owners in Escondido may owe more on their mortgage than the property is worth. Get ready for PPH to increase the tax rate to pay for the Prop BB bonds because of falling property values.
Question wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:29 PM:When is this East Valley meeting? I would like to be there. In case you didn't get the notice, this blog is meant to be anonymous. I did write a letter to the editor on the subject and I have absolutely nothing to hide. My opinions are based solely on what I percieve to be best for my community.
to: da Citizen wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:40 PM:you can have my investment, which was a huge sewage drainout pipe located adjacent to wally's garage full of political signage/garbage.
Something's gone awry wrote on Jan 30, 2008 4:42 PM:sorry, but there's nothing 'vibrant' about downtown escondido. they should have used a different adjective.
To 5 Trust Deeds wrote on Jan 30, 2008 5:02 PM: "The way real estate values are dropping, many land owners in Escondido may owe more on their mortgage than the property is worth." --- You said it!! Your motivation!!
Who's fooling who? wrote on Jan 30, 2008 5:29 PM: Trust Deed - The most common method of financing real estate purchases in California (most other states use mortgages). The trust deed transfers the title to the property to a trustee -- often a title company -- who holds it as security for a loan. When the loan is paid off, the title is transferred to the borrower
Facts wrote on Jan 30, 2008 5:35 PM: More Facts: PPH to increase the tax rate to pay for the Prop BB bonds because of falling property values
To: to: da Citizen wrote on Jan 30, 2008 5:40 PM: PPH will take it they need the $$$$$$Money $$$$$$$
Lucky wrote on Jan 30, 2008 5:55 PM: Yes, I live just outside of Escondido. Bought our home 3/97 for $189,500. Because I was self employed, it was difficult to get financing, so I worked 10 to 12 hour days - 7 days a week. The only regret was missing time with my girls when they were growing up. Lucky in life - yes. Do I want property in the city limits - NO WAY!!!
5 Trust Deeds wrote on Jan 30, 2008 6:00 PM:Huh!? Escondido's real estate values are dropping because of this article? What a fairly tale! Some just cannot accept the real motivation. Go back and read the post: Motivation wrote on Jan 29, 2008 1:19 PM
Re Motivation wrote on Jan 30, 2008 6:10 PM:To 5 left off the rest of the post. 'Get ready for PPH to increase the tax rate to pay for the Prop BB bonds because of falling property values.' Now that is motivation. Stopping higher taxes due to bad government decisions. The government employees, such those at PPH, believe taxes are great. To pay back the Prop BB bonds ($496 million) and the interest on the bonds ($800 million) will cost property taxpayers $1.3 billion. That is not free money, and it should used as promised. PPH signed an MOU. Now we find it was an IOU.
correct or incorrect wrote on Jan 31, 2008 7:27 AM: I am a taxpayer in San Marcos I have only 1 question. Is the information in this article correct or is this information incorrect?
correct or incorrect wrote on Jan 31, 2008 7:50 AM: I am not talking about the Blogs only the article
Mike wrote on Jan 31, 2008 8:18 AM: I have been following this story since I read it in "The Paper" Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show. I read the MOU and these guys are right on
Fact Checking wrote on Jan 31, 2008 8:43 AM:The accuracy of the information can be judged by going to the blog link referenced in this article: www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/06/07/news/inland/6605200328.txt
Affraid of the truth?? wrote on Jan 31, 2008 8:45 AM:I'm not wasting any more time on this blog. Wally, Rob, the Santrach's, Larry, Vander Spek, Sam and the others. Tell us what property you own or have a vested interest in (near PPH) and when it was acquired. Let the people decide the truth when the facts are in the open. To their sheep, I'd suggest you be careful who you're following, the wolves are in costume. It's been fun.
The truth is wrote on Jan 31, 2008 9:15 AM:Plain and simple, PPH did NOT want to build in the BARRIO. Who in their right mind would want to build in an area riddled with gang activity, break-ins, car theft, window smashing, etc. Come on folks, this is not a prime area of Escondido! The only time I go over to that end of town is if its absolutely necessary. Yes, PPH should be held accountable for their actions. And these "sour grapes" need to buckle up and face their financial losses... go invest in property by the new hospital, now that you know where it's being built.
to: Afraid of the truth wrote on Jan 31, 2008 9:27 AM:Couldn't agree more with you. One thing should be clarified: Wally & Robby are the sheep in this drama and yes, they should be careful of the wolves, some of whom are disguised as their friends! It has been most entertaining.
To Afraid wrote on Jan 31, 2008 9:48 AM:We tried to post the link to the County Recorder's office. It didn't get posted. I guess you will have to make the trip over to the San Marcos Branch yourself. Be sure to check back with the results.
To tried to post wrote on Jan 31, 2008 10:12 AM: How convenient. Let me start a list for you; 2nd at Grand, 2nd at Broadway, the lot on Pennsylvania. I can go on, but we'll wait for the East Valley meeting.
Spectator wrote on Jan 31, 2008 10:23 AM:I'm really looking forward to attending the East Valley meeting and hearing Gutierrez and Fawcett speak for themselves (hopefully they'll take the floor seperately and not use the "team approach.") It will be interesting to see if their level of eloquence matches that which is contained in "their" newspaper article.
To Spectator wrote on Jan 31, 2008 10:52 AM:2nd & Grand? Is that the Escondido Surgery Center? Who owned that? www.nctimes.com/articles/2004/11/01/election2004/districts/19_58_2610_31_04.txt Does anyone on the PPH Board have a conflict of interest?
To 'The truth...' @9:15 AM wrote on Jan 31, 2008 10:52 AM:I will be much more interested to see who invests in the ERTC site and check their connections. It has always been my theory that there was jealousy of the downtown property owners in the hospital zone. The only way that others could break into the lucrative hospital market was to move the hospital. Any answers for that question?
To Spectator wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:05 AM:Thank you for recognizing the eloquence of the article written by the authors. For inartful writing, go to this link: www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/03/27/opinion/commentary/18_37_583_26_05.txt . As the Mayor said, the city does not have a junkyard.
Katherine H wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:24 AM: What is Problem with PPH????????? Why don't they just do what they promise.
To Katherine H wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:32 AM: Ms Harris, They just do not have the $$$$$ Money $$$$$
to Katherine H wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:35 AM:read: "The truth is wrote on Jan 31, 2008 9:15 AM." That sums it up, in a nutshell. Promises are sometimes broken-that's part of life, my dear! You're still going to have a new hospital--don't worry your pretty little head.
to "To Spectator" wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:39 AM:There's no doubt the article was eloquently written. I, however, did not acknowledge that it was written by the two "authors" that attached their name to it. That's why I'm looking forward to attending the East Valley meeting and seeing for myself if these two match up to "their" written word.
To: to Katherine wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:52 AM: A new hospital? or 3/4 of a new hospital??? Facts not Fiction...
ERTC Land Ownership wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:52 AM:SDGE owns 20 arces. The Stone Brewery owns about 10 acres. PPH owns about 50 acres. A radio station (Astor) owns a few acres for a radio tower. Most of the rest is owned by JRM-ERTC. Under a contract between PPH and JRM (2/23/06), JRM is required to record a deed restriction on all ERTC properties sold by JRM restricting uses that would compete with PPH (paragraph 8.5.2).
Baited breath wrote on Jan 31, 2008 11:54 AM:Is it against NCT policy to tell us when this East Valley meeting will be? I would love to be there. It is pretty obvious that 'Spectator' never watches Escondido city council meetings. "Can you sum up please?" LOL.
To Spectator wrote on Jan 31, 2008 12:10 PM:You should not need to wait until March. Hopefully the City and PPH will take the advice of the authors and have a joint public workshop. The authors would not miss speaking at that meeting. Besides, the authors have spoken many times in public on this issue. The video is available on the City's web site. Too bad PPH does not post or even record video of its meetings. The dates the authors have spoken can be found by scanning the meeting minutes on the City's website. If you do not like the format of the online videos, the City Council meetings are available in DVD format for checkout at the Escondido Public Library. By the way, do you live along the East Valley Parkway corridor, like the authors? If not, be sure to NOT use the Valley Parkway crossover in getting to the meeting so you can have sufficient information to understand the topics covered. Finally, why are you afraid to post who you think really wrote the article? Are you timid?
Calling Spectator's Bluff wrote on Jan 31, 2008 12:28 PM:The next City Council meeting is Feb. 6, at 7 pm. The authors will give a presentation during 'Oral Communications' about the Downtown Medical Village, and what we think about the situation. You can give your presentation about the with all of your information about property ownership and authorship. Then any members of the public who are interested in your information can tune in and decide. Are you up to the challenge? The City has a cool machine that can project your documents on the screen. You can even make a PowerPoint presentation. However, like the authors, you will be limited to 3 minutes.
Why "O " Why wrote on Jan 31, 2008 1:08 PM: Why does PPH spend so much to hiding? Remember we can get Public Records to find out the truth.
Right On wrote on Jan 31, 2008 1:14 PM: Calling Spectator's Bluff is Right on Will PPH be there???? Talk to Daddy Mike
The authors wrote on Jan 31, 2008 1:21 PM: The authors have spoken a number of times about the PPH mess and there broken promises. I have seen then on TV. The group we have not seen is PPH except when they come with promises (MOU ect…) Which we all know have not happen... Wink, Wink…
Show Up wrote on Jan 31, 2008 2:52 PM: PPH Show Up at the Escondido City Council meeting Feb. 6, at 7 pm. Let everyone see what is the Facts NOT Fiction
Let's See wrote on Jan 31, 2008 2:58 PM: Let's see who shows up at the Escondido City Council meeting Feb. 6, at 7 pm. The Authors or / and "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show"
To: Lets See wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:01 PM: There is no way "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show” will be there. They do not what to be caught again in Broken Promises
To: Tina P wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:06 PM: Only if you talk and say things that are O.K. with "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show". But remember you do not want to be caught again in Broken Promises. LOL
Tina P wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:08 PM: Buuuuuuuuuuuuut that's why I get paid for... I'll Smile when I'm on T.V.
FYI wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:10 PM:Tina P can only talk if she is spoken to.....That is part of "Mr. Mike's Traveling Miracle Medicine Show"
Believe only what is verified wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:10 PM:Seems like Fawcett and Gutierrez just get very passionate when they learn that public officials, like the ones from PPH, are not telling the truth. Some people are like that. Doesn't matter what the issue is. At least they limit their information to the FACTS. The NCTimes verified each and every claim they made prior to printing the story. Unfortunately, it's obvious that some of the people on this blog have no problem just blasting out unsubstantiated drivel for shock value to try to "muddy the water". The "property check" angle is ridiculous and has no basis in fact. It's hard to have an intelligent conversation with someone who doesn't know facts from PPH spin.
Tina P wrote on Jan 31, 2008 3:11 PM: I can control who speaks at the Escondido Chamber of Commerce. I am woman hear me roar
To Katherine H wrote on Jan 31, 2008 4:45 PM: I'm sure he will not be there BUT he might see you in Sarasota Florida
To: Tina P wrote on Jan 31, 2008 4:57 PM:Of course you can show up honey. But you might not feel like doing the little 'victory dance' that you did for the cameras after the ill-fated city council vote that sold out the ERTC to PPH. "Mr. Mike" might want to go to a colder climate for his next snow job. I had to watch the reruns to believe it. I would be curious to know the current opinions of the planning commission..
Sarasota Florida wrote on Jan 31, 2008 5:52 PM: Sarasota Florida??? What is that about Sarasota Florida???
Accountability wrote on Jan 31, 2008 6:40 PM:Why all the focus on Covert and TP. They just do what the ego-driven PPH Board directs them to do. Right?
'Believe only' is almost there wrote on Jan 31, 2008 6:54 PM:The passion is there if public officials exaggerate the truth. The other component relates to the 9-figures next to the dollar $ign. Big money makes it easier for public officials to slip things in like the attempt to charge honorariums, paid to an 'Expert Advisory Panel', against Prop BB funds. The Independent Citizens Oversight Committee has an extremely important task, and should meet more often than one or twice a year.
Mary wrote on Jan 31, 2008 9:10 PM: You ask why more people do not get involved with community issues and politics. Then you should read the messages above about these two young writers. They have the believe and passion to stand up and be counted and all the get is beat up by PPH and their staff. I agree with their believes that PPH should stand by their word. It’s that simple. A promise is a promise. God Bless you two
to Mary wrote on Feb 1, 2008 8:04 AM:May God Bless you too, for being so gullible. I'm not a PPH board member or staff member. I'm an everday citizen of Escondido! But I have enough common sense to acknowledge that there are two sides to every coin--and I have doubts that "these two young writers" have the purest of intentions, just as PPH didn't.
Outsmarted wrote on Feb 1, 2008 8:59 AM:It is this simple ... we got suckered on the bond measure.
As soon as PPH had the bond money guaranteed, they then threatened the city council with the prospect of losing the hospital entirely to another town, so the council capitulated.
Now that PPH's victory is ensured, the pillaging continues (backing out of promises for investment in the downtown medical facilities.)
We were hoodwinked, plain and simple.
We should be a little more careful next time someone asks us for $500 million of our tax dollars.
24 hrs. later wrote on Feb 1, 2008 10:28 AM: Not one of you can answer or are willing to answer the simply question of property ownership near PPH. You piffle and attempt to redirect the question. Your replys are nonsequitur. That alone speaks volumes. The only question that remains, we know who most of you rats are, but who's the Pied Piper?
24 hrs. later wrote on Feb 1, 2008 10:29 AM: Not one of you can answer or are willing to answer the simply question of property ownership near PPH. You piffle and attempt to redirect the question. Your replies are nonsequitur. That alone speaks volumes. The only question that remains, we know who most of you rats are, but who's the Pied Piper?
Pied Piper wrote on Feb 1, 2008 12:07 PM:It is years later(since BB). I guess we will have to wait until Wednesday and see who shows up for the city council meeting. I know you will be very scared when you see me. LOL. You give us too much power. This might go to my head. LOL.
Voting NO on 'Son of BB' wrote on Feb 1, 2008 12:15 PM:Yes we were hoodwinked into voting for BB but that doesn't mean that we have to stay stuck on stupid. If and when PPH tells us that it is our moral duty to vote them more money to finish the mess, we can say NO! Hospitals screw up and fail all over the place. Then someone smarter and with a better plan takes over. It's just business - get over it.
Mary wrote on Feb 1, 2008 12:27 PM: I stand by what I wrote. Who cares? I don't who owns what. I only care about health care and saving lives. PPH said they were going to do build a new hospital and a medical village downtown, and urgent care and primary care centers in Ramona, Rancho Penasquitos/Rancho Bernardo, Valley Center and San Marcos per smartvoters.com. Let’s see who is not telling truth. We will all know the answer by 2013 when this should all be completed. PLEASE both sides do say anything bad about me I just want was promised to me. Mary
to to Mary wrote on Feb 1, 2008 12:31 PM: Mary here. Do you work for Palomar (PPH)? PLEASE do not be so hateful. Everyone just wants what they were promised.
Wake up Mary wrote on Feb 1, 2008 1:21 PM: This is life - Not everything goes as planed and you're not going to make everybody happy - Compromises need to be made on both sides - When was the last time you saw a polititian keep all and/or any their promises or projects stay within estimates. PPH doesn't have control over the economy, construction costs or greedy land owners attempting to make a killing at taxpayer expense. Instead of blessing these people, maybe you should pray for them.
To 24 Hrs. wrote on Feb 1, 2008 1:21 PM:What do you want? The home addresses of the authors published on the blog? You throw out baseless blather. Why don't you provide the facts to support your position. The highly-informed citizens concerned about the downtown hospital will continue to closely monitor PPH. Is Kaiser the Pied Piper for PPH? Why does PPH refuse to release the Kaiser Agreement. www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/01/11/opinion/commentary/19_50_381_10_08.txt
Kaiser - The Real Pied Piper wrote on Feb 1, 2008 1:30 PM:PPH told Wall Street, 'After the District [PPH] completes and opens the new Palomar Medical Center Campus, the District will be required to provide Kasier a guaranteed hospital bed capacity. If the District fails to provide the guaranteed hospital beds to Kaiser as needed, the District must provide alternative hospitalization at the at the Pomerado Hospital or at its own expense, or Kaiser may terminate the Kaiser Agreement and/or seek to revisit its terms. After the opening of the new PMC hospital, Kaiser will be required to make certain fixed payments to the District.' Quite some tradesecret! Really it is merely a political secret kept from Main Street. Come on down to Main Street and tell the 'rats' what PPH is telling Wall Street.
Kaiser - The Real Pied Piper wrote on Feb 1, 2008 2:01 PM:The PPH Board was given the following description before approving finalization of the Kaiser Agreement, 'Hospital Services Agreement between Kaiser Foundation Hospitals and PPH. Background: The Agreement is the culmination of ongoing discussions for a long-term hospital services agreement with Kaiser, and the resultant capacity required to meet the needs of the agreement. The Agreement achieves the key strategies, expected benefits, and resolution to key issues ona long-term basis. Notably, they include: - Predictability and consistency of our relationship with Kaiser through a minimum period until 2020 Additionally, the agreement provides for five-year renewal penods; - Financial stability and predictability of the reimbursement through 2020 and levels consistent—including future inflationary and cost adjustments—with the current contract;- Better assurance of adequate bed and supporting services capacities through the building of additional beds funded by Kaiser on a pro-rata basis. The Agreement will provide for the provision of hospital services to members of Kaiser Health Plan to assure adequate health services to the communities of the District. Budget Impact: Patient care reimbursement rates result in net patient revenues consistent with budgeted revenues. Fixed revenues for facilities consistent with anticipated project costs. Staff Recommendation: Management recommends approval of the Agreement. It is a key component of our strategic focus and achievement of our facilities plan. Approval will enable management to execute the final form Agreement.' (1/20/2004)
Do not be so hateful wrote on Feb 1, 2008 2:32 PM: Mary here again. I believe that PPH should keep their word. It’s that simple. A promise is a promise. God Bless the people that do not agree with me and now are being rude.
What is it wrote on Feb 1, 2008 3:34 PM: PPH CEO Micheal Covert / Katherine H / Sarasota Florida.... What is that about??????
To: What is it wrote on Feb 1, 2008 4:38 PM: Google.... Micheal Covert / Katherine H / Sarasota Florida and you'll find out
I found out wrote on Feb 1, 2008 5:42 PM:Google.....Michael Covert / Katherine H / Sarasota Florida and you'll find out..
Jim wrote on Feb 1, 2008 6:01 PM:Here's a follow up thought. Why not scale back the ERTC hospital and design and rent it exclusively to Kaiser. They can run the whole thing. That could leave money enough to repair Palomar and Pomerado and make these facilities attractive enough for Sharp or someone else to want to run. Wouldn't that be cool! Everybody but the surly PPH admins would be happy. PPH would be out of the business of running hospitals, adopting a position that Grossmont Hospital District took long ago. PPH board members would even get their lives back since most committee meetings and an angry public would be out of their lives.
I found out wrote on Feb 1, 2008 6:27 PM:I also found out Google..... "katherine harris michael covert"
Rat wrote on Feb 2, 2008 3:37 AM:If only we had known earlier of the extent of the unholy alliance between Kaiser and PPH. Talk about 'the blind leading the blind.' We should consider 'Jim''s suggestion and brainstorm on some others. It is becoming clearer and clearer that our BB cargo(taxpayer money) was loaded onto a sinking ship.
Jim wrote on Feb 2, 2008 1:02 PM:
People ask about the Secret Kaiser Agreement. Sure we know that Kaiser has some kind of "deal" as described in an earlier post above for leasing space. However, the real "secret" and what PPH refuses to admit is that Kaiser determined "where" a new hospital should go. Kaiser basically said downtown Escondido was not central enough for the patients, which they service (from Oceanside to Temecula, including mostly those far outside the PPH district). This is why the bizarre new location was chosen. It is why downtown is getting the shaft. It is why you are paying property taxes to pay for Prop BB with most promises like a clinic in Valley Center eliminated. All of this is being done to please Kaiser and to fight off the competition from a new hospital that they would otherwise build. Our taxes are going to squelch competition and to favor one particular private healthcare provider. If this is not scandalous, I don't know what qualifies. However, with the facility master plan in shambles, perhaps PPH will be forced to do the right thing and simply lease out its facilities to providers who are better at running hospitals. Bringing in competition in the form of Scripps, Kaiser (paying its own way) Sharp or any of numerous players is what we really need to bring healthcare in North County to a better level.
Kaiser wrote on Feb 2, 2008 2:53 PM: So what? You can not do anything about it. We have your money...LOL
To Kaiser wrote on Feb 2, 2008 9:44 PM:Newflash! No you don't! You have Wall Street's money. Our money is being collected by taxes over the next 40 years!
Voter wrote on Feb 3, 2008 2:49 PM:It takes cash to buy PR. PR affects politics and opinions so does that mean that the politicians with the most cash will automatically win in the next local election? What if facts and bad decisions mess up the good PR? You PR types really have your work cut out for you this time around. Just asking.
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