Skip wrote on Mar 9, 2008 11:59 PM:The man identified himself as a police officer at some point before he opened fire, Roberts said, but apparently that did not deter the men, who were attacking him and might even have struck him with a chair. Roberts said he did not know what provoked the fight. The two men the officer shot were both taken to an area hospital, where one of them died Saturday night, Roberts said. The officer was treated for injuries that were not life threatening. None of their names was released Sunday. SOURCE: Riverside Press Enterprise

Syl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:05 AM:I just watched Chanel 11's report on this. I think the cop is innocent. He had to get six staples in his head which shows he was beat, the restaurant owner says he mistook one guys girlfriend for his own and apologised right away. But his mom and some chick (I forget who they said she was)claim he made rude comments and then waited for them outside and the just shot at them. If the victim did nothing wrong, then why did the cop need 6 staples? If the victims are innocent why is the cop at home right now?

murrieta resident wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:33 AM:call in the FBI. I smell cover-up all over this! Any security cameras along the street that may have caught this on tape? This should have NEVER happened and the police officer should lose his badge.

objective citizen wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:11 AM:Jennifer,

Great one-sided reporting. If you don't have any FACTS, don't write something just to write SOMETHING. Let the investigation play out and then comment.

Fred wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:31 AM:There are two sides to this ongoing story and looks like the first trial is going to happen in the NCT and Press Enterprise.

C.P. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:23 AM:If you don't know the facts then close your mouth...everything in this situation was wrong wrong wrong. Shaun was one of the nicest people I knew and no matter what, he did not deserve to do die.

aaa wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:00 AM:there are too many bars in old town with the childrens museum close by.

to CP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:03 AM:People are commenting on what the paper is reporting. I am sure that Shaun was a nice guy, but something happened here and NOT everything is being told. I am sure that there was a confrontation between EVERYONE involved. A person was killed and that needs to be investigated. A cop has a right to carry a gun while off duty. SOme of the bigger departments mandate it. This will all come out in the end. I am sorry to say, but when a person is killed and the family is on the media talking about it with in the first few hours, it makes them look bad. I know when my brother was murdered, I could not speak to the media, on yeah He was a cop and he was gunned down for being one.......

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:12 AM:Alcohol guns and Rod run...doesn't look good. Kill the rod run instead.

Gina wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:28 AM:This is tragic. I pray for ALL involved in this. No one wins here no matter who was at fault. Sickening!

d.g. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:38 AM:we need more police watching over the bars in old town. there are too many people drinking way too much. all they want is your money.

Fore wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:46 AM:It is a very sad situation for everyone involved. I am sure a fair investigation will be done and the "cover up" that murrieta resident alludes to just doesn't happen. I agree with the readers who discuss the one sided reporting of this incident. The Californian reports comments by the friends of the deceased as if they were fact. Instead of monday morning quarterbacking the situation, have faith in the Sheriff's Dept and the Riv Co DA to reveal the truth about this terrible incident.

Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:46 AM:Wow. Nice job NCT making this guy out to be some innocent victim.

Make sure you dont miss a 'minor' detail that was conveniently placed at the end of the article...

The guy was a CONVICTED FELON who served six years in the penn for assault with a deadly weapon on a police officer's family!!!

Also, everyone is quick to point out the sad fact that his son witnessed his death, but I have to ask, why did he have his 7-year old son with him while out hitting the bars with his buddies?

Pete wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:47 AM:I have read many of the accounts associated with this tragedy .. The most foolish one was to ban the Rod Run... Unfortunitly the shooting could have happened on any Saturday night .. Booze and ego's are the problem, not a family day enjoying a town wide social event that apparantly appealed to 35,000 thouand innocent folks. No one should have died over a butt slap ...

As many have said ... get the facts , that bar was full of people ... Once its clear who did what ,then go after them with all we have !!!!

Beware the Brotherhood wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:50 AM:Attention citizens and reporters of our town - provide accurate timely information! The TPD/RivCo Sheriff Dept is run in secrecy with no accountability to the public. No matter how you spin it, TPD, an off duty offcr, drinking and armed, killed a man. That is just wrong, wrong, wrong and instead of making excuses for the guy, law enforcement better provide some answers instead of closing ranks to protect one of your own.
My sympathies to the family of this man over this tragic tragic murder.

Zygo wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:16 AM:I also see way too much speculation here and all ready come to conclusion finger pointing. The facts will play out. A criminal investigation will be handled by Riverside homicide, not local Temecula, and an internal investigation will be handled by Costa Mesa. And to those that are already convinced of a coverup, if there is indications of one then the FBI would step in. The incident will be investigated fully using proven investigative methods, which does not include constant speculation in the press by the homicide investigators. So, speculate all you want but the investigators will not particpate in this forum.

That Right! wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:20 AM:Of course this is one sided reporting, it was an interview with the family. The family had an attorney within 16 hours of the incident. The attorney has them spinning the story already. Don't worry there were plenty of non-drinking witnesses. I've spoken with many and their story is not even close to what this article states.
And no...there are no cameras in Old Town, there is no cover up either. It's just plain old drunks thinking they are 16 feet tall and bullet proof. The beer muscles can really get you into trouble.

gg. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:28 AM:no one should have a gun on them when they are drinking. not even a cop.

Temecula Girl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:29 AM:If the law says that an off duty officer is always on duty, so be it. But, I believe that in any situation the officer should call in for help, reinforcement, or whatever needs to be done. Drinking was involved, people were hurt, a person was killed. He took matters into his own hands. I hope this investigation is handled in the right manner. My heart goes out to the family who lost their loved one.

Sympathies wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:34 AM: My sympathy to the family who is involved in yet another unfair situation only this time a killing by an off-duty police officer. My general opinion is that cops can do whatever they want because 1) they are not accountable and 2) they will always be protected by their own. NCT reported the victim's past history yet would not even give the officer's NAME. What is his past history? How many shootings has he been involved in? What was he doing drinking and carrying a gun? C'mon NCT, put some pressure on the "law enforcement spokesperson" to get some answers!

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:35 AM:So Beware Brotherhood...sounds like you have all the facts and know something we don't. Please enlighten us, O Wise One. Sounds like you just hate cops and already have you mind made up. Reeeeal intelligent.

Publius wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:50 AM:I can't believe some of you are criticizing the paper for doing a followup report on this. You would all be complaining if they HADN'T followed up, too. As for its 'balance,' it's hardly the reporter's fault if the cops won't say anything. The first day story was mostly the cops' side, because that's what was out there. Today's is the family's. Sounds like balance to me.

And while we're still missing a lot of the facts (who started it? did he ID himself as a cop? Did he reasonably fear for his life so that using a gun was justified?) we have a better picture of what happened today than yesterday: the cop apparently slapped some woman on the butt. If it was mistaken identity and he apologized, it should have stopped there. If he was rude and mouthed off, it still should have ended there, but it's more understandable why it didn't. The woman's friends/family apparently waited for the cop outside to confront him about his actions. Did they intend to beat him up or just get in his face and scare him? And what actually ended up happening? The cop needed stitches so he was clearly beaten, but did he throw the first punch? Even then, if you're surrounded by a group of guys getting in your face, that could be considered self-defense. How did it escalate to him pulling his gun and shooting? What were the blood-alcohol levels of the people involved? When all those questions are answered we'll know better.

The whole thing is tragic and senseless and both sides seem to bear some fault. ...

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:01 AM:Waht was he doing slaping some woman on the butt? People say he was drinking....Did they check the cops blood alcohol level?

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:02 AM:What was he doing slapping someone he didn't know in the butt? People said he was drinking...Did they check his blood alcohol level?

arny's army wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:04 AM:Taking a beating for groping another mans gal is to be expected, honor runs high in "OLD TOWN". The reports say the officer was "treated for injuries that were not life threatening."I'll bet he wishes he would of kept that pistol in his holster now.

to Temecula girl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:04 AM:Are you kidding??? The cop is surrounded by a bunch of guys getting beaten up and he's supposed to call for backup? What does he say? -- "Wait a minute guys, stop beating me for a moment so I can call in some other cops."

Shawna wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:06 AM:Regardless of the events leading up to the shooting, the bottom line is an unarmed man was shot in the chest on a busy street corner, inches away from his 7 year old son. Everybody keeps saying that something is fishy and doesn't make sense. Don't look to the victims for answers, look to the person who pulled the trigger. Who knows why this man took it to that level. Pride, being drunk, an ego trip? Becuase Shaun had served time doen't make him guilty. He is the victim here. I am sure the truth will come out. ...

yeah NCT wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:06 AM:like 'sympathies' said, take a few guys and go 'lean on' the police spokesman til he gives up a name and a history.
Sheesh...

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:18 AM:Fake esteban..go away. You add nothing of value to society.

Be Fair wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:23 AM:Don't shrug off a shooting as if it is justified in a street brawl. This is not senseless gang violence,this is a trained professional sworn to up hold the law and protect. This is extreme force,if a legal gun carrying citizen acted in this manner they would be in the county jail awaiting trial.

PC836 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:29 AM:The comments about the victim being unarmed. A weapon can be anything that can cause great bodily injury. If the off-duty police officer is being beaten with bar stools. Kicked and punched by numerous persons, he has the right to protect himself including shooting the person. Too many bleeding hearts are for the victim, have you ever been to a funeral for police officer killed ? What about his family ? The saying goes, I would rather have a trial by 12 than carried by 6.

?? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:33 AM:I understand that he has the right to carry the gun if he is off duty.....but why carry the gun if you're drinking?

To Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:50 AM:You should do some reading up on why Shaun went to prison. In that instance it was a HIGH SCHOOL fight, a brawl, and Shaun was the only one who was 18 at the time and THAT is why he went to prison. Also, during this high school fight, Shaun was hit in the eye with a lead pipe.

Furthermore, Shaun would not have started a fight if he knew [the man] was a police officer. He was getting his life back in order and doing well. The last thing he would have done was fight a police officer because the last thing he wanted to do was go back to prison.

Christina wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:06 AM:It is very difficult to read the comments from people who did not know Shaun. If you knew him or his history at all you would not be blaming him.

I hope that the truth comes out soon.

Let us not forget that there is another shooting victim that is still alive and I'm sure that the truth will be told.

Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:13 AM:If I'm off-duty and am getting jumped by multiple people, you are sure to have another incident like this. I carry every single time I walk out of my house. The only reason I carry is to have some type of means to keep my family and I safe. Until any one of these negative commenting people can walk a day in a police officer's shoes, you have no valid opinion to how and when someone can pull the trigger.

j.m. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:29 AM:So Cop... you will go into a bar.. start a fight... shoot people and feel justified? How was that keeping your family safe... Your supposed to protect us from the bad guys... Who is gonna protect us from you?

To Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:31 AM:You scare me.

Esteban to Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:31 AM:I think it is time that you get a new job. If you feel so paranoid and afraid that you can't leave your home with out your gun you are now a threat to society. I have a right to my opinion and even and especially being a police officer should not try to squelch my right to freedom of expression after all you are sworn in right.

To: To Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:50 AM:DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!You scare me too!!!

ThisIsNotAnExit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:To Sly; Why did you copy and paste my comment here? The comment you just left is the exact comment verbatim that I posted last night on [the Orange County Register Web site]. What is wrong with you?

Cop proved my point wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:How can I prove my point that it's a bad idea for off-duty cops to carry guns? I know, read the post above mine!

Max wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:So Shaun "had served a 6-year sentence for assault with a deadly weapon in an incident that involved the family member of a police officer," and was still on parole. Then, according to independent witnesses (who have nothing to gain or lose), he and his group beat a police officer, kicking him while the officer was on the ground, causing the officer to require 6 staples for a wound to the head. The officer, who identified himself as such *again, according to independent witnesses), is 100% justified in shooting. An officer has every right to self-defense in this situation. Kicking someone in the head when they're on the ground *is* in itself using deadly force AGAINST the officer, and an officer is 100% justified in using lethal force to overcome it.

Sheepdog wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:57 AM:To Cop: Amen brother.

To Esteban and the rest of the flock: Google this: LtCol Grossman and look for the piece titled "Sheep and Sheepdogs" this will explain why Cop and I do what we do... And why deep down you want us there protecting you as the flock from the evil wolves that seek to do you harm. Was 'Mr Vilan' ... a wolf? He was at one point.. And just because he wouldn't attack a police officer if he knew he was a cop... That implies that he'd attack anyone else.. Cmon people THINK!

Retired wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:00 AM:To Esteban,

Since police officers deal with the lowest 5 % of the population. All the robbers, rapist, child molester etc. It is a benefit to society to carry a firearm off duty. It is not only to protect yourself and your family. If you are in the wrong place at the right time. You can prevent a crime.

Max wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:01 AM:Esteban, police officers arrest people and take them to jail every day. Some of these people are vicious, vindictive, sociopaths who would have no qualms whatsoever killing a cop of his/her family. While it's easy for one of these people to remember the name and face of the one cop who sent him to prison, it's not so easy for the cop to remember everyone he's arrested. Police officers carry guns off duty for exactly this reason, to protect themselves, their family, and innocent people from those who would do them harm. When you're a police officer, you're a target, 24/7. Officers ARE still police officers 24/7, but when they're off duty, they don't have the luxury of being in uniform, with their patrol car and all their equipment, including radios to call backup. As for the report above, it's a one-sided tale of a family who was involved in a fatal shooting involving a city with deep pockets. I'd take the independent witnesses statements more seriously.

Johnboy wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:03 AM:This is exactly why everyone should NOT be carrying firearms. Can you imagine the chaos if every arguement ended up like this? STOP OFF DUTY COPS FROM CARRYING WEAPONS, they are as irresponsible as every other drunk

harley guy wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:04 AM:only time will tell what really went on

Just Wondering wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:05 AM:If the Rod Run produces a small amount of drunks can you imagine what the Buffoon and Wino Festival is going to be like! Yikes!

To COP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:06 AM:Imagine it was your brother, father, or son getting beat up and kicked in the head by two guys.

While you just stand around, an off-duty cop comes in and helps this person he has never met. In order to save the life of YOUR family member, the cop takes action and unfortunately has to shoot the guys.

Even though the same cop still may have been drinking, you would all then be praising him for his actions and thanking god he was there. It's funny how the situation turns!

For all of you that are so clueless about life, getting kicked in the head repeatedly CAN kill you.

I'M RIGHT BEHIND YOU COP!!!

To Harley Guy from Harley Lady wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:08 AM:Time will not tell what really went on. The spin has begun and this cop will be protected by his own and the ... victim will [be] demonized. That is just the way it is.

Michele wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:10 AM:If a guy slaps my butt I can hold my own...I don't need my man to revert to middle school menatlity in front of our child and justify doubleteaming a guy to kick him in the head. If the cop would have died due to head trauma for allowing it to continue, what would you say then?

to cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:18 AM:I support you. My fiance is a cop, and i babysit for cops. they carry a weapon off duty and i agree with it. You have to do what ever you need to do to keep yourself safe and make it back home to your family. I agree that you need a weapon because you also need to protect others as well. and "Temecula girl" they cant call in for back up in the middle of it. ...

Ralph wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:31 AM:Having attended many ROD RUN events I would like to say that they are always well-run and security is always at it's best. Unfortunately, with numerous people attending their is always some confrontations. I think we should only wait and see what the circumstances were and not listen to what is being said "by the family." Whomever was in error the Sheriff's Dept. and Costa Mesa PD will show their finding. Too much judgement too soon.

lack of trust wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:32 AM:Its sad that so few people trust the police that they assume he is guilty without having all the facts. Its guys lile "Cop" whop creat this paranoia... they defend their own right to carry a gun.. but will be the first to deny us our right to do the same. And NO cop who is planning on going out drinking should be armed. I think ALL of you need to wait before the facts coome out to make any real judgements.. for allw e know they could both be at fault. I can say this.. after spending all day at the rod run, the first thing I said to my wife when we left was "theer will be problems here later". Lots of egos and people just itching for a fight.

To COP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:35 AM:We would ALL like to protect our families by carrying concealed. What makes you special? You're not a target, that's just a cop-out(no pun intended). I want the same security as you have. Just because your job allows you to carry when you are off duty you should be just like the rest of us.

To Sheepdog wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:37 AM:I was not implying in anyway that Shaun would attack anyone else. In fact, HE was attacked not long ago at a local casino and refused to fight back because he did not want to go to prison.

As I said....those who do not know Shaun or his history need not judge..the truth will come out.

confused wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:54 AM:HE WAS A GREAT GUY N THAT'S ALL I CAN SAY.
JUST BECAUSE HE WAS A FELON DOESNT MEAN HE DESERVED WHAT WENT ON. IT WAS A FAMILY N FREINDS DAY OF HANGIN OUT ON THE BEAUTIFUL SUN.

beach lover wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:14 PM:It's already been said once that you need to hear both sides of the story. You can't take what the family says and judge what happened just based on that. And, to all the people who are quick to call this a "police cover up"...let's use a little more intelligence and wait to hear all sides of the story from ALL witnesses. Bottom line is....it's too soon to be pointing the finger....let's wait and hear from some unbiassed witnesses and not just the victims family!

ThisIsNotAnExit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:26 PM:To Dave-O;

If it was a high school fight and he was 18, and served 6 years, but has been out for 2 and a half, and is 30, the math does not add up. That means he would have gotten out at 28, meaning he would have been arrested at 22. Also if he has a 7 year old son, his son would of have to been conceived before he went to prison. So my guess is he just got out and he was older than 18 when he was arrested.

cowboyzfan wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:40 PM:which restaurant did this occur Sat night?

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:42 PM:Hey Beach Lover... Where are the witnesses? After every shooting you see people on the news saying what they saw, what they heard... etc. Not this one.... Why? All you see is the family, could be the cops have gotten to them? I've seen better coverage of witness accounts at car wrecks and drive by shootings.... but not this one... Hmmmmmmm

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:47 PM:Folks, fake esteban is the cop hater, not me. He just likes to post so people blame me for his dumb comments. I agree with Cop. I would carry off duty all the time too...just for instances like this!!! I bet he's glad he was armed cuz now he gets to go home and the bad guy doesn't. I also think all LAW ABIDING citizens should be allowed to CCW. Most cops agree with this point too.

Tom wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:52 PM:It is rather interesting that this type of event happen to the rod run and not any of the other festivals the town holds. It is almost like the type of stuff you hear that happens at oh "low rider car shows". The antique business in old town suffer when this event is town and do not in any other event!

Allen wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:53 PM:I feel Max is right on. In addition, if I were the victim, and some man slapped my girlfriend/wife's butt, I would first feel complimented she was that attractive, then I would get the mans identity, license plate, etc, or perhaps call the cops (which there were many in the area), then properly follow up with the situation legally, in a civil manner. ...

Retired wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:57 PM:Everyone has the right to bear arms and protect their home and family. Anyone can apply for a CCW, if the reason if justified they are issued by the Sheriff of the County you live in. Unfortunatley only the police and criminal carry guns. The criminals don't worry if they are breaking the law and only carry a firearm to commit crimes. Not to protect themselves or innocent people. Like Police Officers.

Cimarron wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:03 PM:A convicted felon on parole is allowed to coach youth baseball & football? Sheesh - I had to have a background check just to volunteer to be team mom.

Rasta Man wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:04 PM:The little girl last month this now,should Temecula start a love your fellow man campaign, this town is real tense.Old Town needs a Medical Marajauna store with some Reggae piped through those street speakers Now Thats What I'm Talking About.

Wait for reason wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:08 PM:All the facts need to come out before a quick judgement is made. It is a tragedy,and no one is a winner.
I do believe, however,this Town is becoming a suedo Gas lamp District as planned by the City. A large presence of old fashioned Beat Cops need to be on the Front Street during and after every event, and on weekends. To the City I say, "be careful what you wish for, you're liable to get it."

long timer wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:09 PM:Things were A LOT quieter and peaseful in this area before 90% of you moved into the area. It's a me me world now.

Pope Ron Paul wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:10 PM:Rasta Man is on to something here

beach lover wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:19 PM:Hey J.M.- this incident JUST happened over the weekend...unlike a car accident these kinds of investigations take a while. I'm pretty sure this isn't a conspiracy to save the off duty cop! People are jumping to conclusions based on what the victims family has said and the initial report in the sundays paper. I'm not saying in anyway that this isn't a tragedy...I just think people go way overboard with speculation!!

liquid courage wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:24 PM:Too bad everyone involved did not leave well enough alone after the initial confrontation in the bar and go they're seperate ways. The truth will eventually come out, as an officer involved shooting it will be thoroughly investigated, believe it or not. Try not to rush to judgement for either side. I feel bad for the 7 year old boy who no longer has a dad.

Steve-O wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:28 PM:Someone wrote:
"We would ALL like to protect our families by carrying concealed. What makes you special?"

What makes cops so special is that they deal with criminals and take them to jail every day... unlike 99% of the citizenry of this country. In fact, 99% of people in this country don't want to deal with criminals, hence they ask their local governments hire cops! Police carry off duty because even though they are not working the beat, they are still cops. When you walk out of your office and close the door at the end of your work day, you can pretty much guarantee no one will bother you about work until you go back the next day. Police never have that luxury.

Then this person wrote:
"You're not a target, that's just a cop-out(no pun intended)."

Then go talk to a cop. Ask if they've ever had their lives threatened by the people they've arrested. Ask if those threats are real, or imagined. Do some reasearch to find out if cops have ever been attacked and/or killed, just because they are cops.

He continued:
"I want the same security as you have."

Most cops want you to have that security too. Cops, in general, like the 2nd Amendment and agree that LAW ABIDING citizens should be allowed to carry guns for their protection. Study upon study has shown that violent crime rates drop dramatically where law abiding citizens carry concealed weapons. Unfortunately, the cops don't make the laws (that's done by such anti-gun politicians as Feinstein and Boxer), but they are sworn to enforce them.

And finally, he says:
"Just because your job allows you to carry when you are off duty you should be just like the rest of us."

Cops are held at a MUCH higher standard than the average person, both on duty AND off. So be careful what you wish for.

Parent wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:28 PM:I was attending a Jr. theatre production at the community theatre that evening with two small children. I walked by the restaurant with them minutes before this occured. There is no reason to carry a gun while drinking and then shoot it in a crowded place. Police would have been there in minutes. The men would be in jail, but instead a man is dead. Firing a gun especially in a family community with children walking around is wrong. It is amazing no innocent bystanders got hurt. Police on duty or not still need to use common sense and do not have the right to put citizens at such risk.

mom wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:33 PM:look it was wronge. why would an off duty officer be drinking and carrying his gun. thats stupid enough some teenage kid could have snuck up and takin it he wouldnt have known he was drinking. at no ponit should his gun been drawn in a huge crowd like the rod run if he wasnt 100% sober. he could have missed and hit a little kid. to those of you who think hes inisent think about it this way if you were their and one of those bulets hit your 5 year old what would you think of him than...would it be different if he wasnt a cop and he pulled out a gun and shot 5 bullets and killed someone u think he would be locked up right ... yeah he would be. just because hes a cop he was offduty therefor that the time of the shoting he was a civilin...

law wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:38 PM:Regardless of he said she said, it is pretty clear we have non-biased witnesses stating the officer touched the girl inappropriatley.. If you have this coupled with the fact once a officer is off-duty he has to rely on self-defense for that use of force. So here is the law..

Calif. state Supreme Court declared: "It is well established that the ordinary self-defense doctrine--applicable when a defendant reasonably believes that his safety is endangered-may not be invoked by a defendant who, through his own wrongful conduct (e.g., the initiation of a physical assault or the commission of a felony), has created circumstances under which his adversary's attack or pursuit is legally justified."


By this the officer induced the attack by the patrons by his assualt on the lady, he cannot therefore use the self-defense claim.. If I was this family I would immediatley file an assualt charge and complaint against this officer, by the girlfriend and hire an attorney immediatley.. You can guarantee the officers are already finding ways to protect their brother in arms,the quicker you act the better chance you have against the system. Good Luck, truly sorry for your loss!!

Esteban to Liquid Courage wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:43 PM:NO WAY!!!! I don't believe it. An officer involved may be investigated but it may as well not be since the cops are protected by their badge, other police officers, and even the Justice system. I feel bad for the little boy not just because he no longer has a dad but because he witnessed his fathers murder. Sad yes, Sad.

Agree w/ long timer wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:47 PM:I too am a long timer with 3 kids. This used to be a great town. Now too many drunk wine tasters, and tourists. I do understand though that the victim was a long time citizen. I blame the City Council for no planning or forsight, just $$$ in their eyes. And Jeff Stone letting the Wine Country become out of control. I know I have lived there for 14 years. The drunk drivers are out of control.

Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:52 PM:Since none of the negative commentors read my entire post, I only carry to protect my family and I. Not start problems or show off. And to the real Esteban, you are correct.

sad wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:55 PM:Why does an out of county off duty police officer need to carry a loaded gun to a crowded event where there are children everywhere when he is drinking? What a senseless and tragic death. Shaun was a nice guy who was doing a beautiful job of putting his life back together...My thoughts and prayers go out to his familiy and friends.

To esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:30 PM:Stop being a cry baby about the name. You are not the only person in the world who has or can use the name. All you gotta do is type in a different name.

???? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:31 PM:Was this a bar or a restaurant? There is a difference. No off duty police officer should be drinking and carrying a gun. If he felt the need to shoot, why not just shoot him in the leg not the chest and why 5 shots? My heart goes out to the family. Wrong is wrong.

Amazed wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:31 PM:I agree with the rasta man. Lets all just chill out and be nice to our fellow man and woman. I am not surprised by the violence - drinks, hot rods and men = fighting. Or at least often it does.

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:36 PM:If I read the articles correctly, this Cop carries a quite a large portion of responsibility in what happened...the courts and investigation will make that determination soon.

A scholar wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:37 PM:"Cover-ups" "good ole boys", the mentality I read in most blogs here is that the police are some secret dark club that is above the law. Shezz people, go do a ride along and get informed. Most of you making these stupid comments don't have a CLUE.

Concerned-1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:42 PM:NCT, you need to get John Hall on this story. He's a digger. This is a tragedy in all respect. It is also going to make for an interesting story with a lot of intrigue. Was it something that had to do with the past? Or, just fate? My respects to all the families involved. C-1.

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:43 PM:I to am tired of whining esteban...I added a one to mine and will change it again if necessary.

To ???? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:49 PM:Police do not train to shoot people in legs, and shoot knives out of hands. That's movie stuff. Also, cops shoot to stop a threat. So, if the threat does not stop, more shooting is what will happen. Lastly, there were more than one person attacking this off-duty cop.

Another Thought... wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:53 PM:to everyone so keen on bashing our legal officials and their authority... next time you need an officer to help you find the high school boy that punched your son, or the drunk driver that almost killed your daughter, remember how little regard you showed for them in this instance.

May He Rest In Peace wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:55 PM:Such a sad story, and my heart goes out to this man's family (escpecially his young son) and friends. I'm sure no one intended to end their day with such a violent situation. This goes to show we all need to learn (or re-learn) compassion and the willingness to work things out without resorting to violence.

Answer ? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:00 PM:Does anybody know if the officer was tested for intoxication for alcohol or possibly other intoxicants after the shooting ? If an officer is out indulging in alcoholic beverages is he/she permitted to carry a gun.

Parent for a Safer Temecula wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:05 PM:Newton's Law - for every action there's a reaction. Inappropriate public behavior whether intentional or by accident is inappropriate. Alcohol - is not an excuse, it's a choice. Will alcohol prove once again to be the source of intensified emotions and poor judgement?

It is with certainty that both could have made the better choice by leaving the premise to avoid a confrontation. But, as is the pattern in many of these altercations, stupid pride takes over.

My heart goes out to both families. The choices we make today determine who you are and forever shape our tomorrow.

Grammer police wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:07 PM:Correction to 3:49 post. There (was) more than one person attacking this off-duty cop.

Temec Resident wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:12 PM:"The Bank" is a mexican restaurant on the corner of Main & Front where the shooting occurred. It's not a bar. Down the street is the theater and Children's Museum, lots of little shops. Police presence was visible all day. Old Town is a small area, they could have been there in minutes and a life would have been saved!
My sympathies to the family of this man.

The Truth wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:12 PM:C'mon "A scholar" don't be a dunce! Rodney King ring a bell...there are good cops and there are no doubt bad ones like there are in every profession. No one, and I mean no one believes there are not cover ups or good-ole boy mentalaties in this profession. Let's hope the truth prevails...

to Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:14 PM:dave, if you believe that police officers can do no wrong, you are very naive. so what if the man was a convicted felon? people can turn their lives around, i know people that have, they get convicted and then they help kids to turn their lives around, for you to say "once a felon always a felon" is the most arrogant thing you can say.

integrity wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:16 PM:I think we all should wait for the "details" of this very unfortunate/deadly situation. I happen to be the mother of one of the young men the officer was defending, and I am asking you all to stop with the "speculting" it serves no purpose. This was a self defense situation, that would have involved 3 victims if the officer had not have defended them. I have extended my thanks to this officer and his wife and family. I am deaply hurt at the loss this mans mother must be feeling, and there are no words I can say that can make a difference. Tell your children daily that you love them, and then teach them how to love.

To Thisisnotanexit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:16 PM:There was a trial...for years...after the fight occured. You are right..he didn't go to prison until he was older than 18 and his son was conceived before he went to prison...

JSten wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:17 PM:No police officer should be engaged in consuming alcolol while carrying a weapon. It's against the law and agains police department policy.

We expect our law enforcement people to hold to a higher standard. If you feel like your family is jeopardized by your line of work, get out of it.

temeculan old-tower wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:23 PM:If two people are attacking one person, I think that be person being attacked has a right to defend himself with every means available. If in the process, their head gets busted open, I think that thats an attempted murder, and justifies self-defense with a firearm.

You also have to remember that these officers are highly trained in the use of deadly force. The last thing a cop wants to do, is shoot someone. But when two people are attacking you and you get hurt, is the cop supposed to lay there and get killed himself, or defend himself. Every cop wants to go home at the end of the day and thats the way they live and work.

Its too bad that all the people involved didn't go home.


As for the "Brotherhood" the southwest detention facility does house some of their own deputies for crimes.

in the know wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:23 PM:Riverside County knows how to get convictions when yhey want too. If this was an average joe this off duty police officer would be sitting in jail with a million dollar bail. In that way he would be most likely unable to hire an attorney and have to rely on the public pretenders office. He would also lose his job while waiting maybe two years for a trial. This average joe would also be charged with sexual battery and after takeing a plea bargin be required to register as a sex offender. But this is a police officer, so he will get "special" treatment. In the end the sheriffs department will say it's an internal affairs matter and the facts will never come out.

Love Old Town wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:36 PM:This is a restaurant with a patio bar. In my opinion, it is run more like a seperate BAR on the patio than an actual restaurant/bar.

google wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:42 PM:I don't know if me previous post was just too long for NCT to post or ?. Anyways, just google: people v. vilan

To see Vilan's previous case.

Skip wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:49 PM:One thing all of these stories have in common is that there is always someone saying, "He does not deserve to die". Well then maybe if some of these people would stop putting themselves in these precarious positions, then they will still be alive today. The funniest comment I heard this week on these blogs was when someone said "he did not deserve to die", and that was after the deceased guy tried to cut a live electrical wire with 50 Bazillion Volts running through it, with a pair of pliers. Hey no one deserves to die, but from what I read in this story, was that this guy been there done that before.

Paul wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:59 PM:I have no idea what happened. Let the legals sort that out. But one thing is clear from this story. You had a minor (his son) present while the Father was drinking. How many folks that weekend drove home drunk with their children?

R.I.P wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:02 PM:We miss you Shaun and you will never be forgotten and will be apart of our hearts forever. We are your voice now and we will make sure it is heard!

!!!!!YOU WILL BE MISSED!!!!!

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:19 PM:New law for 2008. Kill someone drunk driving and it is a murder charge. Kill someone with a gun in Temecula after being in a bar and allegedly drinking.... recuperate at home...If you wear a badge.... Should have been held pending charges... he would have been if he was driving.

clue wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:24 PM:A scholar[-] wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:37 PM: Shezz people, go do a ride along and get informed. Most of you making these stupid comments don't have a CLUE. My question to "scholar" is? What does a ride along have to do with an off-duty cop carrying a gun while out drinking? Please scholar, get a clue.

Wife wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:39 PM:I am writing to the statement written by"gg"! Yes cops should carry their guns off-duty. It it part of their responsibility as police officers. I am the wife of one and proud of him every minute of every. And personally I am glad that he carries off duty!!!! Everyone is also so quick to blame the police. Get the facts first and then start the blame game! Really! It does not take away the fact that a person was killed. The truth will come out. There is way more to this story then people are talking about.

enoughisenough wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:53 PM:ROD RUN = Losers
GET IT OUT OF TEMECULA!

JD wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:53 PM:I don't mind off-duty cops carrying guns. I do mind them carrying loaded guns, and drinking. You may be a cop 24/7, but you can't act accordingly if you're intoxicated. I can't say who's right or wrong here, but I don't want any intoxicated cops in my city with loaded guns.

BBC wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:05 PM:This happened because bartenders and bar owners are not keeping a close enough watch on their patrons...it has nothing to do with the Rod Run. I have seen people that can hardly walk still being served drinks. This happens at all the events that go on in old town. We have 10 bars within walking distance of each other. What is even worse is that they are also within walking distance of the theatre and childrens museum. These events are held and after they are over security leaves and the bars are still packed with those who have been drinking all day. It isn't a good situation for Old Town Temecula

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:06 PM:Now Riverside Sheriff is saying they are treating it like any other homicide/ shooting... by letting the cop go home.... yeah right... cover up...

Sober sez,,, wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:12 PM:....and the REAL killer happens to be beverage ALCOHOL in ANY form. I've heard a saying that sort of fits here: "Instant ..., just add alcohol!" I don't care who did the dirty deed, the real killer is Demon Rum. I've lived in Temecula since long before the very first Rod Run and that first Run was a huge booze event with drunks everywhere! Later rules tried to contain the drinkers to certain areas and not allow everyone to walk or drive around with open containers but most people simply haven't figured out that beverage alcohol is not working! Sobriety is the only way to avoid really stupid stuff like this. The only thing worse are the drugs that are being handed out legally by doctors like they were candy pills. I've lost family and friends to both alcohol and drugs and I'm sober and going to stay that way! Down with booze!

Emily wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:32 PM:>>SUGGESTIONS

What's wrong with this picture? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:13 PM:A Parolee gets killed by a police officer and 150 plus comments are posted. A Deputy Sheriff gets rammed and pinned in his vehicle by a parolee and only one comment is posted ( http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/02/25/news/coastal/31_87_582_24_08.txt).
Apparently, some of you are criminals supporters. Make me wonder about our society! If police officer have to quit their jobs because they are paranoid than that would leave no cops in the force. Officers have to be paranoid they don't have a choice!

Steve-O wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:23 PM:Law wrote:

"By this the officer induced the attack by the patrons by his assualt on the lady, he cannot therefore use the self-defense claim."

People not involved in the legal profession should probably not quote the law or try to explain it to others! If Person A slaps the butt of Person B, Person B is in NO WAY entitled to punch Person A, knocking him to the ground and continue to kick him! In this case, Person B has become the aggressor, and would be promptly arrested (most likely for Assault With a Deadly Weapon or Felony Battery).

Even if Person A punched Person B, Person B does not lose the right to self-defense if Person B becomes the aggressor (as above).

It ceases to be "Self-defense" when the response is no longer reasonable. Punching someone who punched you MAY
be considered reasonable and self-defense, but it all comes down to what is reasonable in the eyes of the law. If the person who punched you is a scrawny 12 year old kid, and you are a 35 year old pro-boxer, I guarantee you'll get arrested for punching him!

If a man identified himself as police officer prior to the attack (per witnesses), was then attacked by group of 5 or 6 people who knocked him to the ground(per witnesses), and punched and kicked while down (per witnesses), THEY are the aggressor and the man has every right to defend his LIFE. If anyone wants to argue that in this case, the officer's life was not at risk, put your own son or daughter on the ground and have 5 guys kick and punch him/her, then come back and argue it again.

Many Questions! wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:41 PM:Yes it is true that CA. allows some Peace Officers to carry while off duty. But their Department sets the rules on that provision. What is the Costa Mesa Police Dept. rules on a off duty Police Officer drinking and carrying while off duty? Was he drinking? Police Officers are held at a higher standard then other citizens, both on and off duty. The community tries to hire only the finest men and women to carry a badge and gun 24/7, and are trusted to be responsible with that burden. A good clean invesitgation will determine if the shooting was under the color of authority or mutual combat gone bad. I wish the involved officer the best of luck with the investigation and my sympathies go out to the family of the deceased man.

Vicki wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:47 PM:I have lived in this town for a very long time. This place they keep calling a bar is a family restaurant. Did they, indeed, do an alcohol level test on the officer?
In the comments about the victim's age & how long he was in prison, etc., implying that the truth about the high school fight was a lie, I believe that Shaun did not start serving time for a few years after the altercation. I remember the facts of that incident & it took a long time to get to court & to be able to get a conviction because there many questions about the high school fight that he & several other people were involved in. Him being the only one that did do time.
If an off-duty police officer is allowed to carry a weapon while he is drinking, and doesn't have enough respect for women that he can slap a woman on her butt in a public place & get away with an apology!!!! Well I think this should positively reflect what kind of man he is, police officer or not!!!
The Rod Run, The Tractor Race, The Balloon & Wine Festival are all (& have always been) one huge drinking affair.
My support & love & prayers to the Vilan family.

to A Scholar wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:48 PM:I have known a lot of police officers in my life. I have been on a few ride alongs. Stopped doing it after the officers I was with one night beat the crap out of some kid because he ran. There are definitly some that think they are above the law.

Prohibition wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:55 PM:ALCOHOL, ALCOHOL, ALCOHOL.

Temecula Dude wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:57 PM:This is a very sad thing that occurred in our once nice, clean, quiet community. The area is changing and not for the better. We have had too much crime and murder in this city over the past two years. I bet we have had more homicides than Lake Elsinore.

All parties involved were in the wrong and it is too bad our community is going down the drain.

SAD To HEAR wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:01 PM:Maybe all these people who feel so sorry should do something that would truely show it, like start a trust fund for the young boy who lost his father.

Lola wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:10 PM:I can't find anything that says either party was DRUNK. Only thst all had been drinking. They were at a restaurant, not a bar, so they had probably been eating dinner while having a couple of beers. It's amazing to me that so many people can jump to so many conclusions with so little information. So far it has all been provided by the vistims family - which is going to make the victim look completely innocent. I'm sure the cop is to blame to a certain extent, but let's wait and hear what the independent witnesses have to say, before we decide who's innocent and who's guilty.

befudged wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:19 PM:Shhh...WOW..talk about adding INSULT TO INJURY!!! Check this ! UN- B- Fudge- Ing Leevable!


While waiting to hear word about whether Vilan survived the shooting... family and friends said they were cordoned off by police and that their pleas for news of his condition were ignored.

"All night we were saying, 'Just tell us if he is alive or dead,'" Kitley said.

Crowley said she was finally notified of her son's status by an officer saying: "You know your son's dead, right?"

Wouldn't u like 2 know.. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:46 PM:How about this, instead of getting rid of the Rod Run, we get rid of all the parolees!!!!!!!!!!

Skip wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:51 PM:RE: GOOGLE "People v. Vilan" >>>> Before anyone else says anything bad about the cop please Google and read the following "People v. Vilan". Absolutely engrossing and unbelieveable. Many similiarities here. Like I said earlier, He been there , done that ............

temecula since 1990 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:53 PM:This was an unnecessary killing of a man. Was he perfect, no, was he causing trouble, possibly maybe even likely, did he deserve to die, NO WAY! Was the cop drunk, probably, was the cop inappropriately touching others, yes, should the cop gave called the local PD instead, absolutely, did the cop have to pull his gun on a crowded street, no way.

This cop will likely be protected, and this may account for a lack of alcohol/drug testing. I hope the truth comes out, and my hearts out to the family and friends of this victim.

To cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:04 PM:I also support you & other fellow officers!!!! My husband is a cop too. Listen people like someone else said in the many comments above, you can't judge a cop until you're in his shoes.

Temecula Dude wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:19 PM:The off-duty police officer should not have had his gun with him while he was drinking and he should not have touched the womans butt. If he is armed, which is perfectly legal he should have been drinking, water, soda, etc. Then he may not have touched this womans butt.

All the same, the deceased is on parole for assault with a deadly weapon so he is used to violence. We can't paint him out to be an innocent angel. Let cooler heads prevail and allow the investigations to take place. When all is done the truth should come out. No one is innocent.

to Steve-O wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:20 PM:you are my hero...

and to everyone defending the deceased and stating how inappropriate it was for an officer to shoot with children nearby, please inform me how appropriate it is to start drunken brawals in front of children.

To Skip wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:28 PM:Wow now I get why he got 7 years for assault with a deadly weapon. If you read the Vilan vs People on the google search you will see it. If I put too many details they will omit my posting. He certainly did not deserve to die, but.... EVERYONE NEEDS TO GOOGLE SEARCH PEOPLE VS VILAN, it will answer a lot of questions. I agree with "wouldn't you like to Know"... And maybe we should cut back on the drinking at the Restaurant/ bars in Old Town. Temecula beer Garden!!!!!

HM wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:59 PM:Wow, just read People v. Vilan, a guy you'd really like to take home to your parents. Same MO, trouble seems to be around this guy. He finally met his match.

My Town wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:13 PM:Everyone is going to have their take on this but like so many have said up above, it came down to drinking and poor choices on both sides and nobody wins. Whatever the outcome, we need to teach our kids the differences between right and wrong, how to have tolerance for others (unlike many of the comments above) and that walking away from a situation like this is not cowardly but takes more maturity then staying and throwing around verbal insults and coming to blows or worse.

g.g. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:14 PM:a cop should NOT have a GUN on him when he is drinking. anyone that thinks he should, are nuts.

Temecula Resident wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:16 PM:All I can hope is that most of the comments posted are coming from people who don't live here in town.'Cover-ups?' 'Corrupt newspapers?' 'Silencing witnesses?' Most people who live here know that it's not the case. 'Where's the lack of witnesses who want to talk to the news?' This is not LA where everybody is racing to get in front of a camera.

'Off duty cop's with guns?' The only thing that is different from being 'on duty' is that they aren't getting calls after their 'shift' ends. They are still fully trained police officers who have been in numerous 'training' and 'real' situations where they've had to determine what is a true threat. They are still more qualified than most of us to use a gun because their training includes more than just the handling of the weapon. People are basing their opinions and comments solely on what the media is reporting and 'heresay'. The media does not know the whole story, and until all of the FACTS are collected, people need to stop trashing the people involved, the Rod Run, law enforcement and each other. It's a good thing you can remain annonymous otherwise more than half of these comments wouldn't be here.

It's already been said that The Bank isn't a bar, it's a family restaurant with limited seating and a long wait. As far as I know, you're not even allowed to drink alcohol out on the patio. This officer probably wanted to take his family girlfriend to enjoy the Rod Run like everyone else, unfortunately he can't relax like everyone else can. His eye catches potential 'trouble' long before we would notice anything amiss. He was probably hoping that grabbing a beer with his dinner at the end of the day would be 'relaxing'. I'd be surprised if the blood tests show he was 'drunk'.

According to the media, the officer 'mistakenly touched the girl, thinking it was his girlfriend'. According to the restaurant manager, the 'victim' and his friends had been causing trouble in other restaurants. Nobody knows if either of these 'statements' are true until all of the facts are collected. The 'statements' from the parties involved are as different as night and day, which usually means that once the facts from everyone are collected, it's going to be pretty clear what really happened. If it's that different, someone's lying.

M.K wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:29 PM:Hey Skip I agree with "wouldn't you like to know"... Maybe we should google you!!

to Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:39 PM:Do you still carry when you are drinking? If so then you are a hypocrite when you arrest a person for DUI as that weapon you carry is as deadly as any car

OKO wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:49 PM:To Temecula Resident. The Bank has a bar now.Full liquor bar for the patio and the restaurant.

A Friend wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:49 PM:To all of you who are saying all the negative things about Shaun I want to know where you get your facts? You didn't know him so how can you be so sure of the kind of person he was? You weren't there when this happened so how can you be so sure he put this police officer at risk where deadly force was necessary? I am pro police AND knew Shaun. This is what bothers: there was only one person aith a gun that night and he was ... [allegedly] drinking and acting inappropriately. If that person wants the rsoect due a police officer then he needs toi act like one. When the truth comes out I hope it shows that dealy force was not needed here.

rench wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:52 PM:To enoughisenough--The Rod Run does not equal losers. It equals a community event that provides entertainment and charitable contributions to the area, such as The Boys and Girls Club of the area, as well as a lot of money and visibility to Old Town businesses. The Rod Run is very well run, with the support of the community, the local business people, and coordinated very well with local authorities. This event is tragic, yes, but should not lead to a shutting down of any events in Old Town Temecula. By the way, The Rod Run wrapped up at 4:00 P.M., 3 1/2 hours before this shooting. Anyone who decides to stay and cause trouble afterwards is doing so not because of The Rod Run, but because they apparently have no built-in self-control mechanism. Take responsibility for your own actions, like a responsible adult should. Do not blame anyone or anything else.

Charles wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:10 PM:I know one thing, if you look for trouble in Southern California you will find it. Sometimes you'll find trouble even when you aren't looking for it. My advice, when driving look straight ahead, when drinking in bars be ready for a fight, and when walking the srteet keep your eyes peeled.
It's dangerous out there.

parolee wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:19 PM:The info on google was very interesting. the paper did report he ws on parole for assult...

rench wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:53 PM:As far as these comments being anonymous, I would like to say that I have no problem with people knowing who I am. How do I make a "public" post, so everyone knows who I am? Nothing to hide here. Maybe someone else wants to hide their identity? [Editor's note: If you wish to use your full name, you can write a letter to the editor and send it to letters@nctimes.com.]

Lost wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:55 PM:The court system is not perfect but it's all we have and we should let the investigation run its course. This was a tragic unnecessary event. The act of violence is what tarnishes our community. My only hope is that we can all learn that violence and jumping to conclusions does not solve anything. All we know is that there are many families and friends in mourning and our prayers should be with everyone. We should all have patience and forgiveness in our hearts.

RF wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:04 AM:This reporter's story is absolutely ridiculous, one-sided and completely void of any investigative reporting. I cannot believe the editor supported printing this article in its current form. This was irresponsible writing in its worst form. It should have been placed in the "Letters to the Editor" or "Opinions" section. A former reporter and editor myself, I would never have let this print. It would have been a good start but nowhere near a finish.

I fully support interviewing the victim's family and friends and getting their side of the story which was clearly done in depth. But where were the questions to have them clarify their answers about what actually happened? I am sure they all thought the victim was a great guy - as they should have. He was their friend, their family member, their boyfriend. But with all their detail leading up to the incident, they blanked on what happened right at the most critical moments? And everyone on their side was completely innocent just enjoying a quiet night out with friends when some bully decided to shoot them? That's like the guy you catch with marijuana in his pocket and tells you they aren't his pants. Neither story makes any sense. If half the people here could Google People V. Vilan, why was this reporter unable to do the same? Everything in here was the family's viewpoint and should have been headlined as such with a byline for whichever relative spoke the longest. Again, nothing wrong with getting their side out, but don't stand their in the rain and let everyone tell you the sun is shining, Jennifer.

The argument about "balance" being had in reporting because the day before it was "all about the police department's side" is also idiocy. All stories should have complete balance not jaded on each side for a different day. As for the "police reporting," the first articles covering this incident were based on a quick press release developed by the law enforcement media department with what little information was available at the onset of an investigation. I wish the police department could come out with every piece of information they had at the very moment they had it without checking its veracity. Then we could all argue some more about what may or may not have happened and then the next day argue about a new set of suppositions. Clearly, many here seem to be stacking blame and throwing out "conspiracy," "cover-up" and statements about things you obviously have a storng gut reaction to but cannot support with any facts or any real, unbiased experiences.

As for the many questions on here if the police department took the officer's blood: It is often standard practice for anyone involved in a shooting to have toxicology/B.A.C. reports requested on their blood. Certainly, the officer's Internal Affairs Department also took blood when they conducted their own personnel investigation. Is that personnel investigation open to the public? No. It is not a cover-up. It is the law. It protects all who have personnel investigations - not just cops. Plus, personnel investigations cannot be used during criminal investigations because people are ordered to talk and therefore cannot be held liable for those statements under Miranda.

As for the criminal investigation, it has been 48 hours since this occurred. Why are so many up in arms about the limited information being available from the Sheriff's Department? Do you think it's been an hour and "Law and Order" is over already? It takes weeks to process all the evidence, including the toxicology reports on everyone involved (the officer, the victim and whomever else actually was involved who stuck around after this happened). The Sheriff's Department won't release any findings until the case is ready to go to the District Attorney's office for their review (and all the cases go to the DA - they don't get stuffed in the "Fellow Cop Conspiracy Box." This ain't the "Night the Lights Went Out in Georgia").

Do Homicide investigators let people go home while they continue investigating instead of taking them right to jail - many, many times dependent upon the circumstances. If a citizen had a valid CCW and was in the same situation (as the shooter here) where self-defense was being reviewed and investigated, likely the citizen would have also gone home. Not just the cop.

But reporters will continue to ask the Department questions as issues regarding this case arise in the media - as they should. It's their job to ask questions. Until that case is finished, however, all the answers from the Departments will be "Sorry, no comment. Investigation still under way." And you know what that will bring? A fresh round of "Cover-up!" exclamations and frustration from the masses that the police will not share what's happening with the public. Try to remember as you read everything and feel answers should be quick and expedient that complete and through investigations take time and attention to detail. One of those details is not compromising the investigation by releasing details in the media. It is not a cover-up. If the case is prosecutable, it protects the DA's ability to try the case in a court of law. Law enforcement also gets in pretty serious trouble for discussing case details in public, as they should, due to this very fact.

Every cop can carry off duty. They make their own personal value statement regarding carrying when drinking, but departments do have reprecussions for if an incident occurs while they were drinking (even minor incidents clearly less serious than this one). There hasn't been any information released about the off-duty officer drinking or being drunk. It has just been debated because someone, somwehere, said he was in a bar. The establishment he was at was a restaurant. As for the final info on that argument - was he or wasn't he? Again, that won't be released for some time along with any other pertinent facts to the investigation. His drinking or not drinking is still not the totality of the investigation. It is one part of the whole.

Blanket statements made from people after they read media reports should remember the current political game being played out in the public forum right now - everything can be skewed to the individual reporter's viewpoint unless they strive to be as unbiased as possible and provide that balance we should demand from our reporters.

Protect and serve, NOT wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:51 AM:I'd like to start off by saying that I have lived in Temecula since 88, so all you who comment on how badly it's changed need to realize with growth comes change, good and bad.
Second, I would like to add that those with the simple thoughts that the police are "HEROS" protecting us, need to get out from under the mayberry sign. I'd like to say that there are more good officers than bad, but the fact is, I've read about more police involved shootings in the last year than ever before. If their firearms are the last line of self defense, then why is it the first used? police officers are looking more and more like the gangsters they are supposidly protecting us from. Serve and Protect, try Intimidate and Abuse

johnathin wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:54 AM:No good cop would shoot a father dead with the 7-year-old son watching? This is a bad cop, remove him from the law enforcement community.

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:55 AM:This is Riverside County and if a cover up is possible, it will happen in my opinion. With that said, it will be diificult and I believe in this case the media exposure is to great a liability therefore the truth will prevail this time...whatever that truth is.

A Scholar wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:57 AM:Hey, you really are clueless aren't you. Who said he was even drinking? It's the mindless blogs like yours that put wrong ideas out there...

Oh boy wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:02 AM:This is all just a one sided story, here's a thought let just wait and see what REALLY happened after the police finish the investigation....wow

James wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:17 AM:Please google: People v. Vilan

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:40 AM:RF, What exactly are you trying to say?
This belongs in the editorial section if it were good enough.....its to wordy and really doesn't say anything.

rench wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:31 AM:To vicki--so all of the fund-raising events should cease to exist? what do you think this town runs on? money. and tourism. one isolated incident should not bring an end to all of this. i am sorry for the loss of this individual, but was he really a contributing member of society? look at his record people v. vilan on google. then look at all the good things that these events have brought to Temecula. I hope you will find a brighter future for Temecula's kids, and a brighter future for The Boys and Girls Clubs of Southwestern Riverside County.

OffDutyOfcr wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:48 AM:The extensive statement above is pretty accurate. The only incorrect statement is that when a police officer is involved in an "Officer Involved Shooting" in the state of California, and the investigating agency wants to obtain blood as evidence for or against their case, they have to have a warrant from a judge, or the officer's consent. It is up to the individual officer whether or not they want to give blood as part of the investigation.

As for carrying off duty. I carry everywhere I go for the exact reasons stated by others earlier. I don't remember every person I've arrested, but most of them remember me. I have encountered people off duty that I have contacted on duty. For that reason, and many other personal reasons, I always carry. Most police agencies have a policy about drinking while carrying off duty. My agency's policy is fairly broad indicating that the officer should use good judgement when drinking as to whether he or she should be carrying their off duty weapon.

As for the Riverside County DA's office... I think most would be surprised at their track record. The Riverside Co DA's office, in recent years, has obtained something of a reputation for filing charges against officers on or off duty for officer involved shootings where the DA believes there was wrong doing on the part of the officer. I work in Orange County, not Riverside, but based on my previous experiences and observations...if there are charges to be filed against the officer for a fatal error in judgement...RCDA's Office WILL take action. There is not a cover up. I believe many citizens would also be surprised to find out how careful a majority of officers are with their conduct, on and off duty. Nearly every police agency I know of HIGHLY scrutinizes the actions of their officers. They have too much liability not too. Many times officers feel like they are guilty, until proven innocent, when it comes to Internal Administrative Investigations.

j.m. wrote on Mar 11, 2008 6:13 AM:Hey RF... names and case #s of people with a valid CCW permit who shot someone and went home... Give em to us. You cant because those people spent hours, if not days answering questions, fielding media coverage... names released to media... the cop went home and 4 days later we still do not even have a name. Costa mesa got him hours later after he left what good are those tests?.... Open thy eyes and you shall see...

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 11, 2008 6:20 AM:I agree with of duty officer...particularly in this high profile case. I do believe that the riverside county DA office is corrupt but the lead balloon attached to this case would create a political problem for this one ticket-one candidate office....yes the officer will get special treatment but if I understand the corrupt logic of the corrupt riverside DA...they will protect themselves first.

LKF wrote on Mar 11, 2008 7:05 AM:Some versions have listed the dead guy as the victim. By reading a little more, one can determine the Off-Duty Officer is the victim and Mr. Vilan was the suspect. A parolee who did time for assault vs. an off-duty (legally armed Police Officer). As for a cover up by the Sheriff's dept.. No chance of that happening. For those of you who think this will be a white wash, can you tell us where it says an off-duty Officer is required to let himself get murdered or maimed when attacked by two individuals? The Officer should get a good Lawyer and immediately file suit against the two assailants.

Addition for everyone to know wrote on Mar 11, 2008 7:55 AM:Just for those who think the officer was fighting only 2 people. He was not, He was jumped by 6! More truth to come out later.

Zygo wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:03 AM:To RF and OffDutyOfcr: Excellent informative posts

To j.m.: A blood test taken even hours later is still of value because your body drops a set value per hour. An example: If a blood test is done with a result of .02% B.A. four hours after the incident then the B.A. at the time of the incident would have been approximately .10% B.A. The initial .02% plus the .08% drop for the 4 hours. Since the officer would not have drank (if he drank at all) after the incident, then the results would be fairly accurate. So the answer to your question is yes, a test taken hours later is of value for investigative purposes.

j.m. wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:14 AM:So OffdutyOfcr... you can make a judgement call about carrying a gun while drinking... but the rest of society is impaired after 2 drinks and cant make a decision on their own about driving? ... You can choose not to give blood... but If you have 1 beer on your breath they can hold you down and forcibly take blood in California? .... And you wonder why we are getting tired of this...

Solution wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:20 AM:Close down The Bank. Their food sucks anyways.

The other Cop wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:31 AM: I carry off duty EXACTY for the reason many have commented on previously. I arrest many hardened criminals, gang members, parolees, etc. On several occasions, those I have arrested have repeated my name several times while stating they would come after me, my wife, and my children. On a few of those occasions, they specifically mentioned murdering my daughter.
Now ask yourself, "Do I want my family murdered?" Your answer better be, "No." I will put myself in the way of harm to prevent any harm on my family. I would also put myself in harm's way to protect the life of an innocent. Would you, as a non "off duty cop" do the same? I would, and have sworn myself to do so...on or off-duty. I am armed off duty to be a first responder that can respond faster than a on duty unit if I am already at the location of a critical incident. If a gunman opens fire in a restaurant, I can possibly eliminate the threat of someone being killed by the gunman. On duty cops could be, at the closest, blocks away, taking several minutes to respond. Seconds count when hundreds of bullets can be fired in a single minute.
On the other side of the coin...drinking and guns do not mix. Most cops will not carry while drinking...some do, but that is a judgement on their intoxication and many department's policies dictate their behavior.
For those who say "Cops shouldn't carry off-duty." Fine. Let those who protect you sheep be sheep along side you. Then we can all meet the same fate...6 feet under and the bad guy walks away. Armed or not, I'd still put myself in harms way to protect my family and the innocent. Would you? Ask yourself why you would take a cop's right to carry off-duty when that same right could be what keeps your daughter from being killed by a madman, a parolee, or a gang member. All that it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing. There are alot of good men out there that DO NOTHING when it counts. I, and most officers I work with...are NOT those men that DO NOTHING. WE ACT. Ponder that before you are so quick to assume cops are "quick on the trigger."
Thank you for all the negative comments that add to the thinking that begins to grow within many cops, "Why is it I do this job...protect people..help people...fight criminals, get injured? All I ever get is criticized, ridiculed, hated, and second-guessed. No one appreciates the job I do. I get spit on, cussed at, disrespected on a daily basis." Keep adding to the fire...soon all the sheep will have no sheep dogs to protect them from wolves.

TO: j.m. wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:42 AM:Blood alcohol is a deteriorating evidence item...therefore the evidence code in the State of California allows for forced draw without warrant due to the reduction in evidentiary value over time if not obtained within 3 hours. By the way...when you got your license to drive, which is a privelege, you signed your contract for your license with an "implied consent" stipulation. That stated that you gave "CONSENT" for the obtaining of blood evidence in a DUI matter...you gave CONSENT when you signed for your license. CONSENT is an exception to a search warrant...which is yet another reason why forced blood draws are allowed. You have no case as you signed a contract saying "I WILL GIVE YOU MY BLOOD" when you signed for your license. If youre "tired of this," DONT DRIVE DRUNK! You are argueing two different points. An officer invloved in a shooting did not sign a contract for "implied consent" simply for carrying a firearm. A driver who is licensed did. ...

Zygo wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:46 AM:To j.m.: Interesting argument with some false premises. Unless you are drinking quart jars, 2 drinks are not going to get you to intoxicated to the point of DUI. Holding you down to take blood is something that is generally reserved for someone that has been involved in an injury traffic collision and refuses to cooperate. Yes, it can be used in limited cases for other DUI investigations, but generally reserved by police agencies (not the courts) for recalcitrant drivers who are suspected of being DUI in injury traffic collisions.

Regarding your comment back to OffdutyOfcr: I think you should go back and reread his post regarding his department's policy. His department does have a policy regarding drinking and carrying a gun. My old department (I'm now retired) had a fairly strict policy. I am sure Costa Mesa also has a specific policy. But, IF he was drinking to WHAT level of drinking and WHAT impact his drinking played a role in this incident will play a role in any future internal disciplinary action if warranted. But even "if" had possibly violated his department's policy re drinking and carrying his weapon, it would carry little weight in a criminal investigation if he was laying on the ground getting beaten and shot up from the ground in self defense.

Alcohol ? wrote on Mar 11, 2008 9:47 AM:Everyone assumes that because this happened outside of a resteraunt that serves alcohol that the involved parties were all drunk and that is what caused this deadly insident to occur. Tell me when it is that each and everyone of us take responsibility for our own actions, instead of blaming a substance, the police, owners of bars & resteraunts. I guess everyone figures that no one that isn't under the influence would ever jump some one or slap someone on the butt without being high. Do we really need more laws to control us or tell us how to behave? People should show control in no matter what they do or what they drink or don't drink, gangs, violence and stupid shootings and killings are everywhere and it is not always Alcohol or drug related. There is alot of abnormal people in our society that push situations to the limit without any reason other then stupitidy and the ego to be a bad boy. It is not up to everyone else to take care of our sorry selves that can't take control of our situations or surroundings without calling on some law maker, representative to guide us.

Wife wrote on Mar 11, 2008 10:35 AM:As the wife of a police officer you learn the ropes never walk on their right side, when they say go you go, and you get over knowing that when he goes to work people want to kill him! We were shopping in Home Depot when a Skinhead walked up to my husband, me & our 3 kids and said "nice kids boss" (inmates use the term boss for cops) He always caries a gun for just this reason! Do you know how many gangs require the death of a cop as an initiation!!! The number one job of a cop is to go home alive at the end of the day! Don't judge until you live life knowing that people all over the country want to kill you because of your job!

CC wrote on Mar 11, 2008 10:47 AM:Another preventable tragedy in our seemingly cursed town. To the cop who commented yesterday about “walking a mile in your shoes”: You are speaking to a mass of young adults who grew up in this town and was betrayed (at a young age) by law enforcement and the justice system. So we should pity your brotherhood because we haven’t walked a mile in your shoes? Unfortunately, I got the impression long ago that cops feel they are superior beings who bust citizens for doing the very same things that they get away with – because of their career. Who can consciously argue that this misfortune was totally preventable? There is no reason why that officer should of brought his firearm to a family event! It’s a tradition to us locals, where violence was not part of its past.

I will continue to hope that justice will be served this time around... which is an understatement at least. The real tragedy falls to the little boy who lost his daddy way too soon.

RIP our friends: Todd Davis, Ian Scott, Ben Cardiel, Bob Esposito, Gary Neggasmith, Jerry Stapleford, Shaun Vilan.

TO PROTECT AND SERVE, NOT wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:07 AM:NICE IGNORANT STATEMENT. THERE AREMORE OFFICER INVOLVED SHOOTING BECASUE MORE SUSPECTS ARE CARRYING GUNS. COPS DO NOT SHOOT FOR NO REASON. THEIR ONLY GOAL IS TO GO HOME TO THEIR FAMILY. IT IS NO SECRET THAT COPS CARRY GUNS. IF CRIMINALS DO NOT DO WHAT THEY ARE TOLD AND ACT IN AN AGGRESSIVE MANNER WHEN AN OFFICER HAS A GUN IN HIS HAND THEN IT IS HIS FAULT HE GETS SHOT.

TO RF wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:10 AM:NICELY SAID. FINALLY SOMEONE UNDERSTANDS HOW THINGS WORK IN REALITY. EVERYONE SHOULD READ RF's BLOG AND ACTUALLY READ IT FOR THE QUALITY OF THE INFORMATION. IT MIGHT ANSWER SOME OF YOUR QUESTIONS AND STIFFLE THE IGNORANT COMMENTS.

J.M. wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:10 AM:You cannot make a reasonable argument with the righteous.... BAC charts show some people over .08 at 2 drinks. OffdutyOfcr said his policy was broad and up to him... Please make me a long list of the street gangs with killing a cop in the credo, Why arent cops mandated to drug and alcohol tests after they shoot someone? Us sheep want to know.

kigmy wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:18 AM:It is a sad day to see when a family event in Old Town gets an eye opening shot of reality. Just walk by the Stampede bar when the doors are open and see the list of "unacceptable attire and behavior" and you can clearly see the world has changed. I am a new resident of Temecula and love the town. I am still trying to cope with how to raise my children in today's world without sheltering them to death. ...

alex wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:50 AM:Serve and protect is an honorable profession. However this area has had more than it's share of harsh crimnal activity by the so called Riverside justice system.
It needs a federal investigation from top to bottom! Then, let the chips fall where they may. There is never an excuse for rudness to a shooting victims family. I have served federal and local law inforcemet. I suggest that an honest investigation in this are will require a federal oversight.

Ashley wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:01 PM:I think we should try the case in a court of law. We weren't there. We don't know who said what to whom. It is sad for all the parties and families involved. It is sad if alcohol was the fuel that fanned the fire. People (adults) need to take responsibility for their actions while out in public. I bet if these two people didn't interact at the bar, neither would be in this position. If you are drinking, monitor yourself and behave....by the age of 20 you should know how to act. (ps. how could a 20 year old drink at a bar anyway???)

Why wrote on Mar 11, 2008 12:42 PM:We have been given the name and background of Shaun Vilan and some have implied his past history may make him responsible. Why don't we know the name of the off-duty cop that killed him? What is HIS history? Does HE have a history of violence? Was HE drinking? ...

esteban wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:26 PM:If the cop had a history of violence, he wouldn't have been hired. Duh.

Peter wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:43 PM:This is why we have a law against public intoxication. Things can get out of hand and people can loose their minds.

Old Town criminals wrote on Mar 11, 2008 1:50 PM:Old Town Temecula has a gang problem but it is hidden away from the main street. Go back into the neighborhood and you will meet some pretty scary chasracters. The gang that resides there is constantly in and out of the prison system. Our gang task force has been tracking and locking up these guys. Temecula PD Keep up the good work!
Violent criminals, leave temecula or end of in jail or worse. Just go away.

JohnT wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:14 PM:I spoke with an Old Town store employee/owner, and this person had commented that the Rod Run is a bad thing. Made the comment that she saw the beer trucks coming in constantly in preparation for the event. "That's the only thing about this event, is the alcohol. It's too much".

Obviously it's fun to give your opinion, but at this stage we still need the facts. One thing is for sure, none of this dialog matters until we have facts. The only fact that we do have is that a father was tragically killed outside a restaurant by an off-duty cop. For the sake of the innocent involved, let' stop bashing one or the other until these facts come out. And they will.

Stop being Haters wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:16 PM:Everyone should quit trying to judge Shaun based on his past arrest. He served his time, graduated college, and was working toward his master's. He was never in trouble while he was in prison and his parole officer loved him. If anyone were to know Shaun they would know that he was loved by his friends and family and he loved them back. He was a GREAT father and friend. He will be missed by everyone that knew him.

LR wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:45 PM:To COP, OTHER COP, and PROTECT AND SERVE, NOT

First of all, to the cops out there, please continue to carry off duty for our sakes and your own. Regardless of this ONE incidence, that gun is what could decide if you live or die. And THANK YOU for protecting us. Because its people like "PROTECT AND SERVE, NOT" that make your jobs even more difficult than they already are. These people think they know everything about being a cop, and having the kind of responsibility that cops have. How many people can actually, honestly say they put their life on the line EVERY DAY of their life?? Not many. HOW many people can honestly say they would risk their life to save the members of their community?? NOT MANY. And those who might say they would... most likely wouldn't when faced with a life or death situation.

These cops you all are bashing ARE our HEROES. So there are a few bad cops. Of course. Every profession has its bad apples, but being a police officer puts you in the prime spot light. So of course all you people hear about are those cases where the bad cop did something, or you spin the cases where a good cop takes a life for GOOD REASON (not referring to this case since there is not enough evidence to support any argument for or against it at this point) into a negative situation where the cop was wrong. NO one knows what its like to be a police officer. Not unless you have lived the life. So stop judging based on the media or gossip. Get the facts. And if you are on a ride a long where you actually yourself witness a cop being unethical, go to the Chief and fix the problem. The community is just as much responsible as the police officers. Stop pointing fingers, and bashing cops. You are missing the point of this situation completely.

Joe wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:51 PM:The police have been to quiet about this
and we all know they protect there own.
this cop was also drinking.

skyskier wrote on Mar 11, 2008 2:55 PM:kigmy
[-] wrote on Mar 11, 2008 11:18 AM:It is a sad day to see when a family event in Old Town gets an eye opening shot of reality. Just walk by the Stampede bar when the doors are open and see the list of "unacceptable attire and behavior" and you can clearly see the world has changed. I am a new resident of Temecula and love the town. I am still trying to cope with how to raise my children in today's world without sheltering them to death. ...

I figured out how to raise my children in today's world without sheltering them to death. ... 34 years ago !!

I moved to Winchester area a built me my own 5 acre ranch. I was willing to give in to living without conveniences like a mall down the street, no costco, no sidewalks,curbs, gutters , streetlights, no skateparks, no super market down the street, no movie theaters, no CORRUPT city council members willing to sell out to EVERY tom dick & harry developer, NO OFF RAMP to get into Temecula, (only a back road into Murrietta yes, THIS is the original spelling of murietta) no parks,no school shootings, no drveby's in your hood, no carjackings, no kidnappings, no rapes, no home invasions
and ALL the rest of the BS trappings brought out by ALL the NEW residents.
It WAS a great way of life for the 1st 25 or so years, now, I might as well be living in LA . The ONLY thing keeping me here in California is my mother inlaw. As soon as she passes I'm going to Montana. I figure by the time you're all done "improving" the "quality" of life in the Temecula valley and decide to move to Montana, I'll be long dead & gone! Enjoy what you got left, best of all to you & your's

Tem Resident wrote on Mar 11, 2008 3:15 PM:I've had several comments not posted. It's good to see the press doesn't believe in the freedom of speech.

Temex Taxpayer wrote on Mar 11, 2008 3:21 PM:You are all so naive... have any of you, that aren't cops, tried to deal with the Riverside County Sheriff's Department? Did anyone see the article that they received last year... a D- in accessibility and responsiveness to the public?! I know. I wrote to the Chief, three times, about a problem I was having, no response. Wrote to my councilman, no response. Wrote to my Assemblyman who finally helped me and solved the stupid problem that should have been solved by the Chief. They know they don't have to answer to us lowly citizens.

Sad Sue wrote on Mar 11, 2008 3:21 PM:Why are you selecting which comments to post and which to toss? Aren't they all relevant? [Editor's note: Please see our comment policy at nctimes.com/blogpolicy.]

To Skyskier wrote on Mar 11, 2008 3:47 PM:Nope, Murrietta was the second spelling of the town, perpetuated by a spelling error when applying for a post office. The original spelling was Murrieta after Juan Murrieta, it was misspelled for years and then corrected to the original spelling.

LAN8TV wrote on Mar 11, 2008 3:48 PM:Was the victim black or white?

To: Stop being Haters wrote on Mar 11, 2008 4:06 PM:Read this : Google: "People V. Vilan" Mr. Vilan is some kind of bully or monster, and luck was against him this day, as he picked on the wrong man.

Resident wrote on Mar 11, 2008 4:46 PM:The newspaper headline could very well have been:

'Off Duty unarmed police officer beaten to death by ex felon'.

I think the posts on this site would be entirely different.

Ask any cop if he would fire his weapon if he new it wasn't life threatening. There is too much controversy, trial by the public based on the media, and interogation by Internal Affairs to want to even pull the weapon let alone fire it. Too much to answer to, and every cop knows it. He wouldn't have pulled it unless he felt threatened, and wouldn't have fired it at anyone (let alone with other people around) unless he felt his life was in serious danger. No cop wants to deal with the consequenses of ending someone else's life.

A police officer doesn't typically head out of the house, packing his gun, planning to get drunk. He heads out of the house, with the training and tools of his trade because he is on duty 24/7. If he interviened in an attempted rape or murder, and had to shoot the suspect, not too many people would be complaining about his having a beer with his dinner.

As far as alcohol on either side, leave it out of the equation until the facts are in.

By the way, Breaking News on Channel 9 just in at 4:45pm:

'The Department says that the officer DID identify himself before any fight broke out, and the 'crowd' attacked him from behind.' They also said their findings contradicted almost everything the family has said.

Cali wrote on Mar 11, 2008 4:53 PM:If everyone was not so bent on hating cops and the service they provide. This blog wouldn't exist. I am not a wife of a cop nor do I think they are above the law. But I do support what they do. Cops see more garbage than we can possibly fathom. Crimes committed against innocents, crimes committed against felons, etc. However, know your facts. The background/history of this off duty police man is checked out by the police department before he's even allowed to go through the academy. Shaun completed his degree while in prison (on the taxpayers dollar) I don't hear anyone crying about that. How many non-felon citizens can afford to even go to college? Did he deserve to die? Probably not. Did the cop deserve to be attacked by multiple people? Probably not. This was an incident that went too far. If this guy was the victim and on parole. He knew the repercussions of getting involved with any questionable activity. Waiting outside of anywhere, bar, restaurant, church, etc. to give them a good scare is inviting trouble. He may have been a good guy, but made some bad choices and the outcome is not to everyone's liking. Suppose the off-duty cop was beaten to death by these individuals. We'd be looking at an outcry of a different sort.

our tax dollars.... wrote on Mar 11, 2008 5:55 PM:I'm annoyed that this guy got a college degree as an imprisoned felon (who impregnated a woman while awaiting trial), wasted tax dollars and returned to a life of crime. Plenty of hardworking, law abiding citizens would love a free education. I think that convicted criminals should take low paying jobs (or whatever they can get) and pay their own way through college, like everyone else. A single mother, widow, or injured Iraq veteran could have been educated in his place.

Tem Neighbor wrote on Mar 11, 2008 7:59 PM:The truth is emerging and the facts are out. The cop was not drunk, was ambushed, and fought back for his life after identifying himself as a PO. Vilan was scum and the world will be better off w/o him. Now lets see what happens to his buddy who should be tried for assault with a deadly weapon.

Amen wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:08 PM:to 'our tax dollars'. It's amazing how committing felonies can be a great benefit.

two rules wrote on Mar 11, 2008 8:42 PM:First rule is to never pick up a firearm when angry.
Second rule is to never pick up a firearm when drinking.
The officer should have locked it in the car when he went for drinks. Sounds like an example of two liquored up idiots with tempers and misplaced tosterone. Just another case of exercising poor judgement for all parties involved.

The Truth wrote on Mar 11, 2008 9:38 PM:To the "Other Cop" The right to carry = "being necessary to the security of a free State" and prohibits infringement of "the right of the people to keep and bear arms." In other words, arm the Sheep and the Sheep can give you the day off. Usually police come after the fact of an incident and after the sheep have been slaughtered. The right to carry seems to work well in many states and many of us Sheep can/will take care of ourselves pretty well if need be but thank you if know where you are/will be needed ahead of time.

Innocent?! wrote on Mar 11, 2008 10:27 PM:The guy is a CONVICTED FELON for an assault with a deadly weapon on a police officer's family!!! Repeat Offender.. I think so... People dont get staples in thier head from "words" flying around....mostly likely a chair... This cop will be aquitted of any charges that might be brought up or if any will be brought up at all!

To sad Sue wrote on Mar 11, 2008 10:44 PM:If The reviewer does not like what you have to say or thinks it might have a hint of racial undertones she will not print it. Sometimes if post at another time another reviewer will ok it. It is strange cause I have seen some things get through such as the 7:59 post calling the deceased a scum. It seems that the reviewer has her opinions & tends to let like opinions get through easier. She probably won`t print mine

Between the lines wrote on Mar 11, 2008 10:57 PM:If the off duty officer had been attacked and beaten like he claimed, why isn't he in the hospital with multiple injuries??
Sorry but it doesn't sound like it was a horrific enough situation to shoot and kill someone over.

RF wrote on Mar 12, 2008 7:46 AM:To J.M. - Again, on-duty officers ARE required to provide their blood for internal investigations. As for the Internal investigation, off-duty officers are required to provide blood for toxicology tests, as well. (Without a warrant.) OffDutyOfficer pointed out that criminal investigators need a warrant to obtain blood from the peace officer - and anyone other citizen in the same situation - unless they provide their permission for the sample. That's not saying much as such a warrant would not be denied by the judge. It's extra paperwork, but it protects the citizen's (and/or officer's) rights when they go to court. It also protects the investigation so the results aren't tossed out on a technicality.

To Roberto1: Yeah, my response was too long. It's frustrating to read many of these comments. What was I trying to say? In short, if people don't have the information about how these investigations work, they shouldn't waste time arguing about what did or didn't happen and why, in such a vehement manner without trying to educate themselves. Just trying to give a basis for why certain procedures are taken. As for the reporting comments:

Interesting to see the article today in the NC Times about how Vilan's past behavior IS a factor. What a difference from March 9th's article. Will it change any of the "hate the cops" comments here - probably not. Regardless of this article, it's the third-party witnesses who should receive the most attention for credibility; those who have nothing to gain and no relationship with those involved.

Bob wrote on Mar 14, 2008 11:21 AM:Hey Between The Lines...

The officer DID wind up in the hospital and required several staples to close the gash in his head.
I suppose you would have let your attackers beat you until you were dead, right?

Bob wrote on Mar 14, 2008 11:23 AM:To "Grammer" (sic) Police...

Before you try to correct other people, you really should learn how to spell.
It's g-r-a-m-m-A-r.

Wow wrote on Mar 15, 2008 4:39 PM:Don't you people know? He was a good boy.... he had turned his life around... he almost had a masters degree in something.....

Too bad he didn't actually learn something while he was in jail.....

These losers don't fall far from the tree. Mommy!

Big D wrote on Mar 16, 2008 12:19 PM: First thing, a Police is required to carry a off duty weapon for many reason, for self protection for his/her family and protection for others and many time an off duty police officer has helped so many people from being killed or robbed and they put their lives on the line all the time. This type of tragedy doesn’t happen often, but will from time to time it does happen. So many time when you have alcohol or drugs or both will come into play and changes people behavior and in most cases they do not even realize the this had happen to them, one drink leads to other and before long they had much to drink. The sad part of this the families were out enjoying themselves and a very little thing can change the day can quickly get out of hand.

I am so tired of hearing cover up or protect their own or the newspaper can’t it right. Come on now and think about it; in a riot or say a bank robbery, people something make statement out of confusing. Take 20 people who just saw a bank robbery the odd that they all had the same story would at least 50/50 or worst. The incident did not happen the way they though, they get confused by all the emotions around them and the events that are going on at the moment; this happen more offend than not, people are human and they can get confused and caught up in the moment.

Know one went out that day to get hurt or to kill someone, they all were out to have fun. I do not understand way the child was there if they were going to be drink and driving and the child should have been removed right away from the seen and I hope this happen. We must remember not to throw stones at a glass window, we must the investigations take place and see the out come. We should all think about the child and families and pray to GOD that they all can come through this tragedy with some kind of understanding of what happen and move on no matter the out come. This will not be the first time nor the last time something this will happen weather a police is involved or just a husband or boyfriend is involved.

The answer is not to close the Rod Run down, it had be over for a few hour, before this happen, if any people should learn how the drink properly and especially when you have children around. The problem is still not the alcohol or the gun, it’s the people behind them and how they handle themselves and when trying to a good time.