Skip wrote on Mar 9, 2008 11:59 PM:The man identified himself as a police officer at some point before he opened fire, Roberts said, but apparently that did not deter the men, who were attacking him and might even have struck him with a chair. Roberts said he did not know what provoked the fight. The two men the officer shot were both taken to an area hospital, where one of them died Saturday night, Roberts said. The officer was treated for injuries that were not life threatening. None of their names was released Sunday. SOURCE: Riverside Press Enterprise

Syl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:05 AM:I just watched Chanel 11's report on this. I think the cop is innocent. He had to get six staples in his head which shows he was beat, the restaurant owner says he mistook one guys girlfriend for his own and apologised right away. But his mom and some chick (I forget who they said she was)claim he made rude comments and then waited for them outside and the just shot at them. If the victim did nothing wrong, then why did the cop need 6 staples? If the victims are innocent why is the cop at home right now?

murrieta resident wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:33 AM:call in the FBI. I smell cover-up all over this! Any security cameras along the street that may have caught this on tape? This should have NEVER happened and the police officer should lose his badge.

objective citizen wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:11 AM:Jennifer,

Great one-sided reporting. If you don't have any FACTS, don't write something just to write SOMETHING. Let the investigation play out and then comment.

Fred wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:31 AM:There are two sides to this ongoing story and looks like the first trial is going to happen in the NCT and Press Enterprise.

C.P. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:23 AM:If you don't know the facts then close your mouth...everything in this situation was wrong wrong wrong. Shaun was one of the nicest people I knew and no matter what, he did not deserve to do die.

aaa wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:00 AM:there are too many bars in old town with the childrens museum close by.

to CP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:03 AM:People are commenting on what the paper is reporting. I am sure that Shaun was a nice guy, but something happened here and NOT everything is being told. I am sure that there was a confrontation between EVERYONE involved. A person was killed and that needs to be investigated. A cop has a right to carry a gun while off duty. SOme of the bigger departments mandate it. This will all come out in the end. I am sorry to say, but when a person is killed and the family is on the media talking about it with in the first few hours, it makes them look bad. I know when my brother was murdered, I could not speak to the media, on yeah He was a cop and he was gunned down for being one.......

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:12 AM:Alcohol guns and Rod run...doesn't look good. Kill the rod run instead.

Gina wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:28 AM:This is tragic. I pray for ALL involved in this. No one wins here no matter who was at fault. Sickening!

d.g. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:38 AM:we need more police watching over the bars in old town. there are too many people drinking way too much. all they want is your money.

Fore wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:46 AM:It is a very sad situation for everyone involved. I am sure a fair investigation will be done and the "cover up" that murrieta resident alludes to just doesn't happen. I agree with the readers who discuss the one sided reporting of this incident. The Californian reports comments by the friends of the deceased as if they were fact. Instead of monday morning quarterbacking the situation, have faith in the Sheriff's Dept and the Riv Co DA to reveal the truth about this terrible incident.

Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:46 AM:Wow. Nice job NCT making this guy out to be some innocent victim.

Make sure you dont miss a 'minor' detail that was conveniently placed at the end of the article...

The guy was a CONVICTED FELON who served six years in the penn for assault with a deadly weapon on a police officer's family!!!

Also, everyone is quick to point out the sad fact that his son witnessed his death, but I have to ask, why did he have his 7-year old son with him while out hitting the bars with his buddies?

Pete wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:47 AM:I have read many of the accounts associated with this tragedy .. The most foolish one was to ban the Rod Run... Unfortunitly the shooting could have happened on any Saturday night .. Booze and ego's are the problem, not a family day enjoying a town wide social event that apparantly appealed to 35,000 thouand innocent folks. No one should have died over a butt slap ...

As many have said ... get the facts , that bar was full of people ... Once its clear who did what ,then go after them with all we have !!!!

Beware the Brotherhood wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:50 AM:Attention citizens and reporters of our town - provide accurate timely information! The TPD/RivCo Sheriff Dept is run in secrecy with no accountability to the public. No matter how you spin it, TPD, an off duty offcr, drinking and armed, killed a man. That is just wrong, wrong, wrong and instead of making excuses for the guy, law enforcement better provide some answers instead of closing ranks to protect one of your own.
My sympathies to the family of this man over this tragic tragic murder.

Zygo wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:16 AM:I also see way too much speculation here and all ready come to conclusion finger pointing. The facts will play out. A criminal investigation will be handled by Riverside homicide, not local Temecula, and an internal investigation will be handled by Costa Mesa. And to those that are already convinced of a coverup, if there is indications of one then the FBI would step in. The incident will be investigated fully using proven investigative methods, which does not include constant speculation in the press by the homicide investigators. So, speculate all you want but the investigators will not particpate in this forum.

That Right! wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:20 AM:Of course this is one sided reporting, it was an interview with the family. The family had an attorney within 16 hours of the incident. The attorney has them spinning the story already. Don't worry there were plenty of non-drinking witnesses. I've spoken with many and their story is not even close to what this article states.
And no...there are no cameras in Old Town, there is no cover up either. It's just plain old drunks thinking they are 16 feet tall and bullet proof. The beer muscles can really get you into trouble.

gg. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:28 AM:no one should have a gun on them when they are drinking. not even a cop.

Temecula Girl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:29 AM:If the law says that an off duty officer is always on duty, so be it. But, I believe that in any situation the officer should call in for help, reinforcement, or whatever needs to be done. Drinking was involved, people were hurt, a person was killed. He took matters into his own hands. I hope this investigation is handled in the right manner. My heart goes out to the family who lost their loved one.

Sympathies wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:34 AM: My sympathy to the family who is involved in yet another unfair situation only this time a killing by an off-duty police officer. My general opinion is that cops can do whatever they want because 1) they are not accountable and 2) they will always be protected by their own. NCT reported the victim's past history yet would not even give the officer's NAME. What is his past history? How many shootings has he been involved in? What was he doing drinking and carrying a gun? C'mon NCT, put some pressure on the "law enforcement spokesperson" to get some answers!

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:35 AM:So Beware Brotherhood...sounds like you have all the facts and know something we don't. Please enlighten us, O Wise One. Sounds like you just hate cops and already have you mind made up. Reeeeal intelligent.

Publius wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:50 AM:I can't believe some of you are criticizing the paper for doing a followup report on this. You would all be complaining if they HADN'T followed up, too. As for its 'balance,' it's hardly the reporter's fault if the cops won't say anything. The first day story was mostly the cops' side, because that's what was out there. Today's is the family's. Sounds like balance to me.

And while we're still missing a lot of the facts (who started it? did he ID himself as a cop? Did he reasonably fear for his life so that using a gun was justified?) we have a better picture of what happened today than yesterday: the cop apparently slapped some woman on the butt. If it was mistaken identity and he apologized, it should have stopped there. If he was rude and mouthed off, it still should have ended there, but it's more understandable why it didn't. The woman's friends/family apparently waited for the cop outside to confront him about his actions. Did they intend to beat him up or just get in his face and scare him? And what actually ended up happening? The cop needed stitches so he was clearly beaten, but did he throw the first punch? Even then, if you're surrounded by a group of guys getting in your face, that could be considered self-defense. How did it escalate to him pulling his gun and shooting? What were the blood-alcohol levels of the people involved? When all those questions are answered we'll know better.

The whole thing is tragic and senseless and both sides seem to bear some fault. ...

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:01 AM:Waht was he doing slaping some woman on the butt? People say he was drinking....Did they check the cops blood alcohol level?

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:02 AM:What was he doing slapping someone he didn't know in the butt? People said he was drinking...Did they check his blood alcohol level?

arny's army wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:04 AM:Taking a beating for groping another mans gal is to be expected, honor runs high in "OLD TOWN". The reports say the officer was "treated for injuries that were not life threatening."I'll bet he wishes he would of kept that pistol in his holster now.

to Temecula girl wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:04 AM:Are you kidding??? The cop is surrounded by a bunch of guys getting beaten up and he's supposed to call for backup? What does he say? -- "Wait a minute guys, stop beating me for a moment so I can call in some other cops."

Shawna wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:06 AM:Regardless of the events leading up to the shooting, the bottom line is an unarmed man was shot in the chest on a busy street corner, inches away from his 7 year old son. Everybody keeps saying that something is fishy and doesn't make sense. Don't look to the victims for answers, look to the person who pulled the trigger. Who knows why this man took it to that level. Pride, being drunk, an ego trip? Becuase Shaun had served time doen't make him guilty. He is the victim here. I am sure the truth will come out. ...

yeah NCT wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:06 AM:like 'sympathies' said, take a few guys and go 'lean on' the police spokesman til he gives up a name and a history.
Sheesh...

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:18 AM:Fake esteban..go away. You add nothing of value to society.

Be Fair wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:23 AM:Don't shrug off a shooting as if it is justified in a street brawl. This is not senseless gang violence,this is a trained professional sworn to up hold the law and protect. This is extreme force,if a legal gun carrying citizen acted in this manner they would be in the county jail awaiting trial.

PC836 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:29 AM:The comments about the victim being unarmed. A weapon can be anything that can cause great bodily injury. If the off-duty police officer is being beaten with bar stools. Kicked and punched by numerous persons, he has the right to protect himself including shooting the person. Too many bleeding hearts are for the victim, have you ever been to a funeral for police officer killed ? What about his family ? The saying goes, I would rather have a trial by 12 than carried by 6.

?? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:33 AM:I understand that he has the right to carry the gun if he is off duty.....but why carry the gun if you're drinking?

To Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 9:50 AM:You should do some reading up on why Shaun went to prison. In that instance it was a HIGH SCHOOL fight, a brawl, and Shaun was the only one who was 18 at the time and THAT is why he went to prison. Also, during this high school fight, Shaun was hit in the eye with a lead pipe.

Furthermore, Shaun would not have started a fight if he knew [the man] was a police officer. He was getting his life back in order and doing well. The last thing he would have done was fight a police officer because the last thing he wanted to do was go back to prison.

Christina wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:06 AM:It is very difficult to read the comments from people who did not know Shaun. If you knew him or his history at all you would not be blaming him.

I hope that the truth comes out soon.

Let us not forget that there is another shooting victim that is still alive and I'm sure that the truth will be told.

Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:13 AM:If I'm off-duty and am getting jumped by multiple people, you are sure to have another incident like this. I carry every single time I walk out of my house. The only reason I carry is to have some type of means to keep my family and I safe. Until any one of these negative commenting people can walk a day in a police officer's shoes, you have no valid opinion to how and when someone can pull the trigger.

j.m. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:29 AM:So Cop... you will go into a bar.. start a fight... shoot people and feel justified? How was that keeping your family safe... Your supposed to protect us from the bad guys... Who is gonna protect us from you?

To Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:31 AM:You scare me.

Esteban to Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:31 AM:I think it is time that you get a new job. If you feel so paranoid and afraid that you can't leave your home with out your gun you are now a threat to society. I have a right to my opinion and even and especially being a police officer should not try to squelch my right to freedom of expression after all you are sworn in right.

To: To Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:50 AM:DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!DITTO!!!You scare me too!!!

ThisIsNotAnExit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:To Sly; Why did you copy and paste my comment here? The comment you just left is the exact comment verbatim that I posted last night on [the Orange County Register Web site]. What is wrong with you?

Cop proved my point wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:How can I prove my point that it's a bad idea for off-duty cops to carry guns? I know, read the post above mine!

Max wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:51 AM:So Shaun "had served a 6-year sentence for assault with a deadly weapon in an incident that involved the family member of a police officer," and was still on parole. Then, according to independent witnesses (who have nothing to gain or lose), he and his group beat a police officer, kicking him while the officer was on the ground, causing the officer to require 6 staples for a wound to the head. The officer, who identified himself as such *again, according to independent witnesses), is 100% justified in shooting. An officer has every right to self-defense in this situation. Kicking someone in the head when they're on the ground *is* in itself using deadly force AGAINST the officer, and an officer is 100% justified in using lethal force to overcome it.

Sheepdog wrote on Mar 10, 2008 10:57 AM:To Cop: Amen brother.

To Esteban and the rest of the flock: Google this: LtCol Grossman and look for the piece titled "Sheep and Sheepdogs" this will explain why Cop and I do what we do... And why deep down you want us there protecting you as the flock from the evil wolves that seek to do you harm. Was 'Mr Vilan' ... a wolf? He was at one point.. And just because he wouldn't attack a police officer if he knew he was a cop... That implies that he'd attack anyone else.. Cmon people THINK!

Retired wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:00 AM:To Esteban,

Since police officers deal with the lowest 5 % of the population. All the robbers, rapist, child molester etc. It is a benefit to society to carry a firearm off duty. It is not only to protect yourself and your family. If you are in the wrong place at the right time. You can prevent a crime.

Max wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:01 AM:Esteban, police officers arrest people and take them to jail every day. Some of these people are vicious, vindictive, sociopaths who would have no qualms whatsoever killing a cop of his/her family. While it's easy for one of these people to remember the name and face of the one cop who sent him to prison, it's not so easy for the cop to remember everyone he's arrested. Police officers carry guns off duty for exactly this reason, to protect themselves, their family, and innocent people from those who would do them harm. When you're a police officer, you're a target, 24/7. Officers ARE still police officers 24/7, but when they're off duty, they don't have the luxury of being in uniform, with their patrol car and all their equipment, including radios to call backup. As for the report above, it's a one-sided tale of a family who was involved in a fatal shooting involving a city with deep pockets. I'd take the independent witnesses statements more seriously.

Johnboy wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:03 AM:This is exactly why everyone should NOT be carrying firearms. Can you imagine the chaos if every arguement ended up like this? STOP OFF DUTY COPS FROM CARRYING WEAPONS, they are as irresponsible as every other drunk

harley guy wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:04 AM:only time will tell what really went on

Just Wondering wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:05 AM:If the Rod Run produces a small amount of drunks can you imagine what the Buffoon and Wino Festival is going to be like! Yikes!

To COP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:06 AM:Imagine it was your brother, father, or son getting beat up and kicked in the head by two guys.

While you just stand around, an off-duty cop comes in and helps this person he has never met. In order to save the life of YOUR family member, the cop takes action and unfortunately has to shoot the guys.

Even though the same cop still may have been drinking, you would all then be praising him for his actions and thanking god he was there. It's funny how the situation turns!

For all of you that are so clueless about life, getting kicked in the head repeatedly CAN kill you.

I'M RIGHT BEHIND YOU COP!!!

To Harley Guy from Harley Lady wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:08 AM:Time will not tell what really went on. The spin has begun and this cop will be protected by his own and the ... victim will [be] demonized. That is just the way it is.

Michele wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:10 AM:If a guy slaps my butt I can hold my own...I don't need my man to revert to middle school menatlity in front of our child and justify doubleteaming a guy to kick him in the head. If the cop would have died due to head trauma for allowing it to continue, what would you say then?

to cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:18 AM:I support you. My fiance is a cop, and i babysit for cops. they carry a weapon off duty and i agree with it. You have to do what ever you need to do to keep yourself safe and make it back home to your family. I agree that you need a weapon because you also need to protect others as well. and "Temecula girl" they cant call in for back up in the middle of it. ...

Ralph wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:31 AM:Having attended many ROD RUN events I would like to say that they are always well-run and security is always at it's best. Unfortunately, with numerous people attending their is always some confrontations. I think we should only wait and see what the circumstances were and not listen to what is being said "by the family." Whomever was in error the Sheriff's Dept. and Costa Mesa PD will show their finding. Too much judgement too soon.

lack of trust wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:32 AM:Its sad that so few people trust the police that they assume he is guilty without having all the facts. Its guys lile "Cop" whop creat this paranoia... they defend their own right to carry a gun.. but will be the first to deny us our right to do the same. And NO cop who is planning on going out drinking should be armed. I think ALL of you need to wait before the facts coome out to make any real judgements.. for allw e know they could both be at fault. I can say this.. after spending all day at the rod run, the first thing I said to my wife when we left was "theer will be problems here later". Lots of egos and people just itching for a fight.

To COP wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:35 AM:We would ALL like to protect our families by carrying concealed. What makes you special? You're not a target, that's just a cop-out(no pun intended). I want the same security as you have. Just because your job allows you to carry when you are off duty you should be just like the rest of us.

To Sheepdog wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:37 AM:I was not implying in anyway that Shaun would attack anyone else. In fact, HE was attacked not long ago at a local casino and refused to fight back because he did not want to go to prison.

As I said....those who do not know Shaun or his history need not judge..the truth will come out.

confused wrote on Mar 10, 2008 11:54 AM:HE WAS A GREAT GUY N THAT'S ALL I CAN SAY.
JUST BECAUSE HE WAS A FELON DOESNT MEAN HE DESERVED WHAT WENT ON. IT WAS A FAMILY N FREINDS DAY OF HANGIN OUT ON THE BEAUTIFUL SUN.

beach lover wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:14 PM:It's already been said once that you need to hear both sides of the story. You can't take what the family says and judge what happened just based on that. And, to all the people who are quick to call this a "police cover up"...let's use a little more intelligence and wait to hear all sides of the story from ALL witnesses. Bottom line is....it's too soon to be pointing the finger....let's wait and hear from some unbiassed witnesses and not just the victims family!

ThisIsNotAnExit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:26 PM:To Dave-O;

If it was a high school fight and he was 18, and served 6 years, but has been out for 2 and a half, and is 30, the math does not add up. That means he would have gotten out at 28, meaning he would have been arrested at 22. Also if he has a 7 year old son, his son would of have to been conceived before he went to prison. So my guess is he just got out and he was older than 18 when he was arrested.

cowboyzfan wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:40 PM:which restaurant did this occur Sat night?

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:42 PM:Hey Beach Lover... Where are the witnesses? After every shooting you see people on the news saying what they saw, what they heard... etc. Not this one.... Why? All you see is the family, could be the cops have gotten to them? I've seen better coverage of witness accounts at car wrecks and drive by shootings.... but not this one... Hmmmmmmm

esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:47 PM:Folks, fake esteban is the cop hater, not me. He just likes to post so people blame me for his dumb comments. I agree with Cop. I would carry off duty all the time too...just for instances like this!!! I bet he's glad he was armed cuz now he gets to go home and the bad guy doesn't. I also think all LAW ABIDING citizens should be allowed to CCW. Most cops agree with this point too.

Tom wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:52 PM:It is rather interesting that this type of event happen to the rod run and not any of the other festivals the town holds. It is almost like the type of stuff you hear that happens at oh "low rider car shows". The antique business in old town suffer when this event is town and do not in any other event!

Allen wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:53 PM:I feel Max is right on. In addition, if I were the victim, and some man slapped my girlfriend/wife's butt, I would first feel complimented she was that attractive, then I would get the mans identity, license plate, etc, or perhaps call the cops (which there were many in the area), then properly follow up with the situation legally, in a civil manner. ...

Retired wrote on Mar 10, 2008 12:57 PM:Everyone has the right to bear arms and protect their home and family. Anyone can apply for a CCW, if the reason if justified they are issued by the Sheriff of the County you live in. Unfortunatley only the police and criminal carry guns. The criminals don't worry if they are breaking the law and only carry a firearm to commit crimes. Not to protect themselves or innocent people. Like Police Officers.

Cimarron wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:03 PM:A convicted felon on parole is allowed to coach youth baseball & football? Sheesh - I had to have a background check just to volunteer to be team mom.

Rasta Man wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:04 PM:The little girl last month this now,should Temecula start a love your fellow man campaign, this town is real tense.Old Town needs a Medical Marajauna store with some Reggae piped through those street speakers Now Thats What I'm Talking About.

Wait for reason wrote on Mar 10, 2008 1:08 PM:All the facts need to come out before a quick judgement is made. It is a tragedy,and no one is a winner.
I do believe, however,this Town is becoming a suedo Gas lamp District as planned by the City. A large presence of old fashioned Beat Cops need to be on the Front Street during and after every event, and on weekends. To the City I say, "be careful what you wish for, you're liable to get it."

long timer wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:09 PM:Things were A LOT quieter and peaseful in this area before 90% of you moved into the area. It's a me me world now.

Pope Ron Paul wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:10 PM:Rasta Man is on to something here

beach lover wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:19 PM:Hey J.M.- this incident JUST happened over the weekend...unlike a car accident these kinds of investigations take a while. I'm pretty sure this isn't a conspiracy to save the off duty cop! People are jumping to conclusions based on what the victims family has said and the initial report in the sundays paper. I'm not saying in anyway that this isn't a tragedy...I just think people go way overboard with speculation!!

liquid courage wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:24 PM:Too bad everyone involved did not leave well enough alone after the initial confrontation in the bar and go they're seperate ways. The truth will eventually come out, as an officer involved shooting it will be thoroughly investigated, believe it or not. Try not to rush to judgement for either side. I feel bad for the 7 year old boy who no longer has a dad.

Steve-O wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:28 PM:Someone wrote:
"We would ALL like to protect our families by carrying concealed. What makes you special?"

What makes cops so special is that they deal with criminals and take them to jail every day... unlike 99% of the citizenry of this country. In fact, 99% of people in this country don't want to deal with criminals, hence they ask their local governments hire cops! Police carry off duty because even though they are not working the beat, they are still cops. When you walk out of your office and close the door at the end of your work day, you can pretty much guarantee no one will bother you about work until you go back the next day. Police never have that luxury.

Then this person wrote:
"You're not a target, that's just a cop-out(no pun intended)."

Then go talk to a cop. Ask if they've ever had their lives threatened by the people they've arrested. Ask if those threats are real, or imagined. Do some reasearch to find out if cops have ever been attacked and/or killed, just because they are cops.

He continued:
"I want the same security as you have."

Most cops want you to have that security too. Cops, in general, like the 2nd Amendment and agree that LAW ABIDING citizens should be allowed to carry guns for their protection. Study upon study has shown that violent crime rates drop dramatically where law abiding citizens carry concealed weapons. Unfortunately, the cops don't make the laws (that's done by such anti-gun politicians as Feinstein and Boxer), but they are sworn to enforce them.

And finally, he says:
"Just because your job allows you to carry when you are off duty you should be just like the rest of us."

Cops are held at a MUCH higher standard than the average person, both on duty AND off. So be careful what you wish for.

Parent wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:28 PM:I was attending a Jr. theatre production at the community theatre that evening with two small children. I walked by the restaurant with them minutes before this occured. There is no reason to carry a gun while drinking and then shoot it in a crowded place. Police would have been there in minutes. The men would be in jail, but instead a man is dead. Firing a gun especially in a family community with children walking around is wrong. It is amazing no innocent bystanders got hurt. Police on duty or not still need to use common sense and do not have the right to put citizens at such risk.

mom wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:33 PM:look it was wronge. why would an off duty officer be drinking and carrying his gun. thats stupid enough some teenage kid could have snuck up and takin it he wouldnt have known he was drinking. at no ponit should his gun been drawn in a huge crowd like the rod run if he wasnt 100% sober. he could have missed and hit a little kid. to those of you who think hes inisent think about it this way if you were their and one of those bulets hit your 5 year old what would you think of him than...would it be different if he wasnt a cop and he pulled out a gun and shot 5 bullets and killed someone u think he would be locked up right ... yeah he would be. just because hes a cop he was offduty therefor that the time of the shoting he was a civilin...

law wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:38 PM:Regardless of he said she said, it is pretty clear we have non-biased witnesses stating the officer touched the girl inappropriatley.. If you have this coupled with the fact once a officer is off-duty he has to rely on self-defense for that use of force. So here is the law..

Calif. state Supreme Court declared: "It is well established that the ordinary self-defense doctrine--applicable when a defendant reasonably believes that his safety is endangered-may not be invoked by a defendant who, through his own wrongful conduct (e.g., the initiation of a physical assault or the commission of a felony), has created circumstances under which his adversary's attack or pursuit is legally justified."


By this the officer induced the attack by the patrons by his assualt on the lady, he cannot therefore use the self-defense claim.. If I was this family I would immediatley file an assualt charge and complaint against this officer, by the girlfriend and hire an attorney immediatley.. You can guarantee the officers are already finding ways to protect their brother in arms,the quicker you act the better chance you have against the system. Good Luck, truly sorry for your loss!!

Esteban to Liquid Courage wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:43 PM:NO WAY!!!! I don't believe it. An officer involved may be investigated but it may as well not be since the cops are protected by their badge, other police officers, and even the Justice system. I feel bad for the little boy not just because he no longer has a dad but because he witnessed his fathers murder. Sad yes, Sad.

Agree w/ long timer wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:47 PM:I too am a long timer with 3 kids. This used to be a great town. Now too many drunk wine tasters, and tourists. I do understand though that the victim was a long time citizen. I blame the City Council for no planning or forsight, just $$$ in their eyes. And Jeff Stone letting the Wine Country become out of control. I know I have lived there for 14 years. The drunk drivers are out of control.

Cop wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:52 PM:Since none of the negative commentors read my entire post, I only carry to protect my family and I. Not start problems or show off. And to the real Esteban, you are correct.

sad wrote on Mar 10, 2008 2:55 PM:Why does an out of county off duty police officer need to carry a loaded gun to a crowded event where there are children everywhere when he is drinking? What a senseless and tragic death. Shaun was a nice guy who was doing a beautiful job of putting his life back together...My thoughts and prayers go out to his familiy and friends.

To esteban wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:30 PM:Stop being a cry baby about the name. You are not the only person in the world who has or can use the name. All you gotta do is type in a different name.

???? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:31 PM:Was this a bar or a restaurant? There is a difference. No off duty police officer should be drinking and carrying a gun. If he felt the need to shoot, why not just shoot him in the leg not the chest and why 5 shots? My heart goes out to the family. Wrong is wrong.

Amazed wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:31 PM:I agree with the rasta man. Lets all just chill out and be nice to our fellow man and woman. I am not surprised by the violence - drinks, hot rods and men = fighting. Or at least often it does.

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:36 PM:If I read the articles correctly, this Cop carries a quite a large portion of responsibility in what happened...the courts and investigation will make that determination soon.

A scholar wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:37 PM:"Cover-ups" "good ole boys", the mentality I read in most blogs here is that the police are some secret dark club that is above the law. Shezz people, go do a ride along and get informed. Most of you making these stupid comments don't have a CLUE.

Concerned-1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:42 PM:NCT, you need to get John Hall on this story. He's a digger. This is a tragedy in all respect. It is also going to make for an interesting story with a lot of intrigue. Was it something that had to do with the past? Or, just fate? My respects to all the families involved. C-1.

Roberto1 wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:43 PM:I to am tired of whining esteban...I added a one to mine and will change it again if necessary.

To ???? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:49 PM:Police do not train to shoot people in legs, and shoot knives out of hands. That's movie stuff. Also, cops shoot to stop a threat. So, if the threat does not stop, more shooting is what will happen. Lastly, there were more than one person attacking this off-duty cop.

Another Thought... wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:53 PM:to everyone so keen on bashing our legal officials and their authority... next time you need an officer to help you find the high school boy that punched your son, or the drunk driver that almost killed your daughter, remember how little regard you showed for them in this instance.

May He Rest In Peace wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:55 PM:Such a sad story, and my heart goes out to this man's family (escpecially his young son) and friends. I'm sure no one intended to end their day with such a violent situation. This goes to show we all need to learn (or re-learn) compassion and the willingness to work things out without resorting to violence.

Answer ? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:00 PM:Does anybody know if the officer was tested for intoxication for alcohol or possibly other intoxicants after the shooting ? If an officer is out indulging in alcoholic beverages is he/she permitted to carry a gun.

Parent for a Safer Temecula wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:05 PM:Newton's Law - for every action there's a reaction. Inappropriate public behavior whether intentional or by accident is inappropriate. Alcohol - is not an excuse, it's a choice. Will alcohol prove once again to be the source of intensified emotions and poor judgement?

It is with certainty that both could have made the better choice by leaving the premise to avoid a confrontation. But, as is the pattern in many of these altercations, stupid pride takes over.

My heart goes out to both families. The choices we make today determine who you are and forever shape our tomorrow.

Grammer police wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:07 PM:Correction to 3:49 post. There (was) more than one person attacking this off-duty cop.

Temec Resident wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:12 PM:"The Bank" is a mexican restaurant on the corner of Main & Front where the shooting occurred. It's not a bar. Down the street is the theater and Children's Museum, lots of little shops. Police presence was visible all day. Old Town is a small area, they could have been there in minutes and a life would have been saved!
My sympathies to the family of this man.

The Truth wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:12 PM:C'mon "A scholar" don't be a dunce! Rodney King ring a bell...there are good cops and there are no doubt bad ones like there are in every profession. No one, and I mean no one believes there are not cover ups or good-ole boy mentalaties in this profession. Let's hope the truth prevails...

to Dave-o wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:14 PM:dave, if you believe that police officers can do no wrong, you are very naive. so what if the man was a convicted felon? people can turn their lives around, i know people that have, they get convicted and then they help kids to turn their lives around, for you to say "once a felon always a felon" is the most arrogant thing you can say.

integrity wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:16 PM:I think we all should wait for the "details" of this very unfortunate/deadly situation. I happen to be the mother of one of the young men the officer was defending, and I am asking you all to stop with the "speculting" it serves no purpose. This was a self defense situation, that would have involved 3 victims if the officer had not have defended them. I have extended my thanks to this officer and his wife and family. I am deaply hurt at the loss this mans mother must be feeling, and there are no words I can say that can make a difference. Tell your children daily that you love them, and then teach them how to love.

To Thisisnotanexit wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:16 PM:There was a trial...for years...after the fight occured. You are right..he didn't go to prison until he was older than 18 and his son was conceived before he went to prison...

JSten wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:17 PM:No police officer should be engaged in consuming alcolol while carrying a weapon. It's against the law and agains police department policy.

We expect our law enforcement people to hold to a higher standard. If you feel like your family is jeopardized by your line of work, get out of it.

temeculan old-tower wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:23 PM:If two people are attacking one person, I think that be person being attacked has a right to defend himself with every means available. If in the process, their head gets busted open, I think that thats an attempted murder, and justifies self-defense with a firearm.

You also have to remember that these officers are highly trained in the use of deadly force. The last thing a cop wants to do, is shoot someone. But when two people are attacking you and you get hurt, is the cop supposed to lay there and get killed himself, or defend himself. Every cop wants to go home at the end of the day and thats the way they live and work.

Its too bad that all the people involved didn't go home.


As for the "Brotherhood" the southwest detention facility does house some of their own deputies for crimes.

in the know wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:23 PM:Riverside County knows how to get convictions when yhey want too. If this was an average joe this off duty police officer would be sitting in jail with a million dollar bail. In that way he would be most likely unable to hire an attorney and have to rely on the public pretenders office. He would also lose his job while waiting maybe two years for a trial. This average joe would also be charged with sexual battery and after takeing a plea bargin be required to register as a sex offender. But this is a police officer, so he will get "special" treatment. In the end the sheriffs department will say it's an internal affairs matter and the facts will never come out.

Love Old Town wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:36 PM:This is a restaurant with a patio bar. In my opinion, it is run more like a seperate BAR on the patio than an actual restaurant/bar.

google wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:42 PM:I don't know if me previous post was just too long for NCT to post or ?. Anyways, just google: people v. vilan

To see Vilan's previous case.

Skip wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:49 PM:One thing all of these stories have in common is that there is always someone saying, "He does not deserve to die". Well then maybe if some of these people would stop putting themselves in these precarious positions, then they will still be alive today. The funniest comment I heard this week on these blogs was when someone said "he did not deserve to die", and that was after the deceased guy tried to cut a live electrical wire with 50 Bazillion Volts running through it, with a pair of pliers. Hey no one deserves to die, but from what I read in this story, was that this guy been there done that before.

Paul wrote on Mar 10, 2008 4:59 PM:I have no idea what happened. Let the legals sort that out. But one thing is clear from this story. You had a minor (his son) present while the Father was drinking. How many folks that weekend drove home drunk with their children?

R.I.P wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:02 PM:We miss you Shaun and you will never be forgotten and will be apart of our hearts forever. We are your voice now and we will make sure it is heard!

!!!!!YOU WILL BE MISSED!!!!!

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:19 PM:New law for 2008. Kill someone drunk driving and it is a murder charge. Kill someone with a gun in Temecula after being in a bar and allegedly drinking.... recuperate at home...If you wear a badge.... Should have been held pending charges... he would have been if he was driving.

clue wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:24 PM:A scholar[-] wrote on Mar 10, 2008 3:37 PM: Shezz people, go do a ride along and get informed. Most of you making these stupid comments don't have a CLUE. My question to "scholar" is? What does a ride along have to do with an off-duty cop carrying a gun while out drinking? Please scholar, get a clue.

Wife wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:39 PM:I am writing to the statement written by"gg"! Yes cops should carry their guns off-duty. It it part of their responsibility as police officers. I am the wife of one and proud of him every minute of every. And personally I am glad that he carries off duty!!!! Everyone is also so quick to blame the police. Get the facts first and then start the blame game! Really! It does not take away the fact that a person was killed. The truth will come out. There is way more to this story then people are talking about.

enoughisenough wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:53 PM:ROD RUN = Losers
GET IT OUT OF TEMECULA!

JD wrote on Mar 10, 2008 5:53 PM:I don't mind off-duty cops carrying guns. I do mind them carrying loaded guns, and drinking. You may be a cop 24/7, but you can't act accordingly if you're intoxicated. I can't say who's right or wrong here, but I don't want any intoxicated cops in my city with loaded guns.

BBC wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:05 PM:This happened because bartenders and bar owners are not keeping a close enough watch on their patrons...it has nothing to do with the Rod Run. I have seen people that can hardly walk still being served drinks. This happens at all the events that go on in old town. We have 10 bars within walking distance of each other. What is even worse is that they are also within walking distance of the theatre and childrens museum. These events are held and after they are over security leaves and the bars are still packed with those who have been drinking all day. It isn't a good situation for Old Town Temecula

J.M. wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:06 PM:Now Riverside Sheriff is saying they are treating it like any other homicide/ shooting... by letting the cop go home.... yeah right... cover up...

Sober sez,,, wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:12 PM:....and the REAL killer happens to be beverage ALCOHOL in ANY form. I've heard a saying that sort of fits here: "Instant ..., just add alcohol!" I don't care who did the dirty deed, the real killer is Demon Rum. I've lived in Temecula since long before the very first Rod Run and that first Run was a huge booze event with drunks everywhere! Later rules tried to contain the drinkers to certain areas and not allow everyone to walk or drive around with open containers but most people simply haven't figured out that beverage alcohol is not working! Sobriety is the only way to avoid really stupid stuff like this. The only thing worse are the drugs that are being handed out legally by doctors like they were candy pills. I've lost family and friends to both alcohol and drugs and I'm sober and going to stay that way! Down with booze!

Emily wrote on Mar 10, 2008 6:32 PM:>>SUGGESTIONS

What's wrong with this picture? wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:13 PM:A Parolee gets killed by a police officer and 150 plus comments are posted. A Deputy Sheriff gets rammed and pinned in his vehicle by a parolee and only one comment is posted ( http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/02/25/news/coastal/31_87_582_24_08.txt).
Apparently, some of you are criminals supporters. Make me wonder about our society! If police officer have to quit their jobs because they are paranoid than that would leave no cops in the force. Officers have to be paranoid they don't have a choice!

Steve-O wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:23 PM:Law wrote:

"By this the officer induced the attack by the patrons by his assualt on the lady, he cannot therefore use the self-defense claim."

People not involved in the legal profession should probably not quote the law or try to explain it to others! If Person A slaps the butt of Person B, Person B is in NO WAY entitled to punch Person A, knocking him to the ground and continue to kick him! In this case, Person B has become the aggressor, and would be promptly arrested (most likely for Assault With a Deadly Weapon or Felony Battery).

Even if Person A punched Person B, Person B does not lose the right to self-defense if Person B becomes the aggressor (as above).

It ceases to be "Self-defense" when the response is no longer reasonable. Punching someone who punched you MAY
be considered reasonable and self-defense, but it all comes down to what is reasonable in the eyes of the law. If the person who punched you is a scrawny 12 year old kid, and you are a 35 year old pro-boxer, I guarantee you'll get arrested for punching him!

If a man identified himself as police officer prior to the attack (per witnesses), was then attacked by group of 5 or 6 people who knocked him to the ground(per witnesses), and punched and kicked while down (per witnesses), THEY are the aggressor and the man has every right to defend his LIFE. If anyone wants to argue that in this case, the officer's life was not at risk, put your own son or daughter on the ground and have 5 guys kick and punch him/her, then come back and argue it again.

Many Questions! wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:41 PM:Yes it is true that CA. allows some Peace Officers to carry while off duty. But their Department sets the rules on that provision. What is the Costa Mesa Police Dept. rules on a off duty Police Officer drinking and carrying while off duty? Was he drinking? Police Officers are held at a higher standard then other citizens, both on and off duty. The community tries to hire only the finest men and women to carry a badge and gun 24/7, and are trusted to be responsible with that burden. A good clean invesitgation will determine if the shooting was under the color of authority or mutual combat gone bad. I wish the involved officer the best of luck with the investigation and my sympathies go out to the family of the deceased man.

Vicki wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:47 PM:I have lived in this town for a very long time. This place they keep calling a bar is a family restaurant. Did they, indeed, do an alcohol level test on the officer?
In the comments about the victim's age & how long he was in prison, etc., implying that the truth about the high school fight was a lie, I believe that Shaun did not start serving time for a few years after the altercation. I remember the facts of that incident & it took a long time to get to court & to be able to get a conviction because there many questions about the high school fight that he & several other people were involved in. Him being the only one that did do time.
If an off-duty police officer is allowed to carry a weapon while he is drinking, and doesn't have enough respect for women that he can slap a woman on her butt in a public place & get away with an apology!!!! Well I think this should positively reflect what kind of man he is, police officer or not!!!
The Rod Run, The Tractor Race, The Balloon & Wine Festival are all (& have always been) one huge drinking affair.
My support & love & prayers to the Vilan family.

to A Scholar wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:48 PM:I have known a lot of police officers in my life. I have been on a few ride alongs. Stopped doing it after the officers I was with one night beat the crap out of some kid because he ran. There are definitly some that think they are above the law.

Prohibition wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:55 PM:ALCOHOL, ALCOHOL, ALCOHOL.

Temecula Dude wrote on Mar 10, 2008 7:57 PM:This is a very sad thing that occurred in our once nice, clean, quiet community. The area is changing and not for the better. We have had too much crime and murder in this city over the past two years. I bet we have had more homicides than Lake Elsinore.

All parties involved were in the wrong and it is too bad our community is going down the drain.

SAD To HEAR wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:01 PM:Maybe all these people who feel so sorry should do something that would truely show it, like start a trust fund for the young boy who lost his father.

Lola wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:10 PM:I can't find anything that says either party was DRUNK. Only thst all had been drinking. They were at a restaurant, not a bar, so they had probably been eating dinner while having a couple of beers. It's amazing to me that so many people can jump to so many conclusions with so little information. So far it has all been provided by the vistims family - which is going to make the victim look completely innocent. I'm sure the cop is to blame to a certain extent, but let's wait and hear what the independent witnesses have to say, before we decide who's innocent and who's guilty.

befudged wrote on Mar 10, 2008 8:19 PM:Shhh...WOW..talk about adding INSULT TO INJURY!!! Check this ! UN- B- Fudge- Ing Leev