Boboclown wrote on Mar 28, 2008 11:37 AM:The circus and clowns are still in town.

AWTOOTOOBAD wrote on Mar 28, 2008 11:51 AM:Great news! The tale of the UAV. Hopefully, SSgt Wuterich will see the same result.
S/F

Hey tig wrote on Mar 28, 2008 12:34 PM:You having that humble pie for desert!! Looks like you may be eating alot of words!

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 28, 2008 2:23 PM:"Tigmother Predicts: Tatum will accept a deal; testify for the prosecution against the more seriously charged Wuterich and be given a bad conduct or general discharge with all charges dropped."Direct quote of Tigmother's post of 3-25-08, 4:11 PM, "CAMP PENDLETON: First Haditha trial to unfold" The poster of "Hey Tig" at 12:34 PM is no doubt one of those who cheers for the miscreants. Many such cheerleaders either hate the Corps because they were NOT honorably discharged or they have formed a pathetic relationship with one of the accused or convicted. That is to say they are either disgruntled or perverse. The Corps is right in these prosecutions and the detractors are wrong, no matter their animus or delusions.

Good thing wrote on Mar 28, 2008 2:40 PM:these men were not Border Patrol Agents or they would of been in prision for life.

This is a nation of wrote on Mar 28, 2008 3:42 PM:polical monsters and others (ACLU) that would demand that Superman be chained to kryptonite.

?? wrote on Mar 28, 2008 4:26 PM:"He followed the rules of engagement as he was trained to" Oh really does that included killing children. He should still be held accountable. Why is it that no one has to be responsible for their own actions anymore?

John1 wrote on Mar 28, 2008 4:30 PM:TO ?? Accountable for what? Taking incoming fire and reacting the way any well trained Marine combat rifleman would react?

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 28, 2008 5:18 PM:Any so-called prediction is a safe bet for TIG since the procedings over the past 2 years for all of these Marines seems to be written in stone. I'm trying to figure out the arrogant attitude displayed by TIG. Too much bitterness about the Corps and anyone who supports Marines. His accusation that those who support them have some kind of bad history with the Corps may reflect more on him and his reasons for resentment. As for the neverending suggestion by TIG that someone who knows the accused or knows one of the convicted has a pathetic relationship with that person, I'm a little worried about what type of mind thinks only in terms of perversion rather in terms of humanity. Perhaps TIG should seek help for the negative energy he wastes on the MAJORITY who stand by these Marines.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Mar 28, 2008 5:28 PM:Now tig, you are beyond hilarious...did you even READ the article before you made your comment? If you did, you must have a severe comprehension deficiency. I can't even believe this coming from you!! I'll spell it out for you...The Prosecution admitted that Tatum followed the rules of engagement, (and therefore did nothing wrong) and dropped all charges "because it was the right thing to do. There was NO DEAL and is NO DEAL to be made. Unless he would like to ask for some charges to be put back on him so that he can make a deal...Ha Ha Ha! When he testifies truthfully that they followed the rules of engagement (which the prosecution now has to admit) then, hopefully Wuterick will have a similar outcome! This case is falling apart, because there never was on, not that you'd care. You just want to see Marines covicted. If it were not overly obvious that you are completely uniformed, one might think that you were part of the Prosecution team! Like I said before, go get a hobby other than blogging here...Now everyone here chortles at YOU!!! Farewell, tigthing!!

Tuck wrote on Mar 28, 2008 6:19 PM:I am sure that this story will sadden many liberals.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Mar 28, 2008 7:16 PM:To ?? The ones who should be held accountable are the insurgents that went into the homes of the civilians and attacked and fired upon our Marines. That is who is responsible for those civilian deaths.

Chris wrote on Mar 28, 2008 11:38 PM:There were no insurgents in the area and certainly none in the houses. But then all you Marine supporters will come up with all kinds of scenarios to justify attrocities committed by our troops. I just wonder how you would feel if it was your children who were hiding behind the bed when they were killed. Well never mind. As far as I am concerned you are too far gone to know what I am talking about. Many of us Americans have reached the bottom of the barrel.

To Chris???? wrote on Mar 29, 2008 1:05 AM:What is wrong with you??? Chris, you are the one who is too far gone! There were insurgents in the area and in the houses. But I know, it will do no good to tell you. I guess you must have yourself convinced that you were there otherwise, you have no business making such a statement. What are you? A murtha puppet. No IED either, eh? Tell that to the Marine who got blown in half...tell it to his family. Yes...somebody must've scraped you off the bottom of the barrel. They should have put the lid on it instead. I have the footage of the UAV. Don't tell me there were no insurgents in the area! Go find tig...you two should make great companions!

Question wrote on Mar 29, 2008 6:53 AM:To Chris: Why do you hate America so much? What's your story dude?

Massachusetts Democrat wrote on Mar 29, 2008 7:30 AM:Perhaps now an investigation can be launched to identify those responsible for the fourteen Marine casualties, 1 killed,13 wounded, that occured during the daylight hours of 19NOV05 in Haditha.

Former SecDef Rumsfeld, Secy. Winter and Congressman Murtha should co-chair the investigation.

Oorah wrote on Mar 29, 2008 8:10 AM:GREAT NEWS.I'm so very Happy for Tatum and his family.Finally Justice is served.The goverment should have to reembruse the family for all the expences and hardships.
YES, VIRGINA,THERE IS A GOD.
Hang in there Sgt.L.Hutchins(3/5),Ssgt F.Wuterich,Lt.Col J.Chessani,Lt.A.Grayson of the 3/1.and our Border patrol officiers Compean and Ramos.You are in my thoughts and Prayers.
OORAH

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 29, 2008 10:13 AM:Tigmother quotes from the article above: "The dismissal was accompanied by a grant of immunity requiring the 27-year-old Oklahoma native to testify against Wuterich,..." The operative words are IMMUNITY and REQUIRING. A rose by any other name is a rose and a deal by any other name is a deal. Were Tatum to testify as a neutral and voluntary witness, friendly to neither side, there would be no need for IMMUNITY nor would he be REQUIRED to testify. No matter the spin by the defense, a DEAL WAS MADE. The dismissal is CONDITIONAL and the condition is that Tatum testifies AGAINST Wuterich as the quote shows. Should Tatum fail to so testify, the charges will be refiled. This is all standard strategy in criminal prosecutions. Squeeze the minor actor and use his testimony to convict the major offender.

P wrote on Mar 29, 2008 10:22 AM:Everyone knows the insurgents are training their "kids" to kill our troops. I wonder how many of these "kids" had weapons or had bombs strapped to them by their loving parents?

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 29, 2008 10:27 AM:Tigmother reminds that 3 of the P8 were convicted by 3 DIFFERENT juries composed of combat experienced MARINES. Tigmother will accept and respect the decision of such Marines rather than that of a few malcontents who haunt the courthouses. And thus shall it be in the case of Sgt Wuterich. A jury of his MARINE PEERS, all combat veterans, will decide his fate. And so should it be.

skip wrote on Mar 29, 2008 11:30 AM:To Chris: You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts - which you seem to make up as you go. No sane person would think that a combat soldier would need to get the resume' of the shootee before he pulls the trigger in a combat situation. If that's you attitude, you would be soon dead in combat. Leave the fighting to our brave soldiers.

Roger wrote on Mar 29, 2008 11:56 AM:To Chris: You have too much pent up anger. Please go see a therapist.

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 29, 2008 2:16 PM:Official UCMJ news release:
"CAMP PENDLETON, Calif. (March 28, 2008) – Charges against Lance Cpl. Stephen B. Tatum for his alleged involvement in the death of Iraqi civilians in Haditha, Iraq on November 19, 2005, were dismissed today. This was done in order to continue to pursue the truth seeking process into the Haditha incident." Thus charges were NOT dropped because such charges were unwarranted, but in order "...to pursue the truth seeking process into the Haditha incident." In other words, to convict Wuterich using Tatum's testimony as added evidence. That's the official UCMJ statement, not spin.

Chris to Roger wrote on Mar 29, 2008 3:55 PM:I have too much pent up anger? Shame on me for giving a hoot about innocent people being murdered in their home especially since they are Iraqis. If it weren't for our government going into other countries killing innocent people maybe I wouldn't have such anger. But it just shows how degenerate we have become when we tell people who get angry over the killing of innocent people that THEY need a therapist.

Chris to to Chris wrote on Mar 29, 2008 3:59 PM:Your blog is bunk. Out of all the people killed not one was an insurgent. You saw the 60 minute clip just like I did and yet you have the odasity to say that there were insurgents in the house. If there were there would not be any trials. But I am used to you military supporters just throwing out the truth and replacing it with fasehoods.

Chris wrote on Mar 29, 2008 4:02 PM:None of the kids had weapons but you don't really care do you.

Chris wrote on Mar 29, 2008 4:04 PM:Our soldiers killed innocent people with out cause and skip is just spouting nonsense.

Roger wrote on Mar 29, 2008 4:36 PM:To Chris: A few things YOU need to understand as I think your anger is blinding your vision. 1) The troops were sent to Iraq by Jorge and his oil buddies, it was not their choice. They are just trying to stay alive. If you don’t the support the war, you MUST support them. 2) If our government is so evil, why do people risk their lives to come here?
I think you need to put your anger to a better use. Perhaps you should help the Minutemen construct a border a fence. That will release some energy!!!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 29, 2008 5:11 PM:TIGMOTHER should be reminded that all were NOT combat "experienced". Each served at least "one" combat TOUR! That does not equate to experience in combat. One panel member specialized in aviation, another specialized in transportation; both admirable but seriously "little" comparison to the training of the P8. "Deploying" does not mean one is experienced in combat! Again; nothing new from TIGMOTHER. We all watched the military's so-called "truth seeking process" throughout the Hamdania hearings and courts-martial. It's a no-brainer they're now going after Wuterich, as they did Hutchins.

Chris wrote on Mar 29, 2008 5:27 PM:The lead vehicle in the convoy hit a IED and killed the person inside. Then these Marines saw a car comming from the other way and stopped them. After the people in the car got out with their hands up these Marines just killed them and then went to the houses. There was no fire comming from the houses but the first thing one of them did was open the door slightly and toss in a grenade and then went in and finished the job. They went to the other houses and took out the residents there. Then these Marines lied about it and told their superiors that the people were killed by a roadside bomb. If what these Marines did was a righteous takdown then why lie about it. A member of the media filed a report and that is when the truth came out. As far as the border is concerned I don't give a damn how many Illegal aliens come here. After what we did I just don't care what OTHER people do.

esteban wrote on Mar 29, 2008 5:51 PM:Thank God the Marine was free....and it peeves Chris to boot!!!! Face it Chris, the US is winning. That makes YOU the loser....again.

Chris is wrong again...go figure wrote on Mar 29, 2008 9:11 PM:It was not the lead humvee that was IED'd...furthermore...I was not talking about the 60 minutes footage. I was talking about the Unmanned Arial Vehicle that was taking video over the area of the firefight...Apparently YOU have not seen that. So you can STOP TALKING ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK YOU KNOW. You were not there and YOU DON'T KNOW!

Chris wrote on Mar 29, 2008 10:27 PM:There was no unmanned arial vehicle. Period. If there was then why was the lie believed until the media got it. THERE WAS NO UNMANNED ARIAL VEHICLE. PERIOD.

Give it up! wrote on Mar 29, 2008 10:44 PM:To Chris: ... You don't know what you are talking about. I have the video! As I have said before. Maybe you should do some REAL research instead of making up all this crap in you own mind and calling it fact! The video was posted on the internet. The media LIES. Tim McGirk's story was proven to be erroneous. He verified NOTHING! Their interest is in sellling papers and getting people to blog on their blogs. I guess you have never dealt with the media, either. Politics and Agenda!! Time for you and tig to stop spewing. It's way past time for anyone to take you seriously. The two of you are definitely in your "own little world!"

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 30, 2008 1:24 AM:To Give it up!: DITTO!!! AW4.

Skip wrote on Mar 30, 2008 6:52 AM:To Chris: Sadly, there are lot of people like you who would automatically condemn the military based on reports in the media. It's that sentiment that the media plays on. The part you don't get is that by and large reporters covering the war are there to make a name for themselves. The only way they can do that is to "uncover" wrong-doing. I thing there are several cases where to biggest mistake the soldier made was in not plugging the reporter first.

John wrote on Mar 30, 2008 9:33 AM:Start the petitions NOW to have Bush PARDONED EVERY SERVICEMAN (regardless of branch of service!) that is accused of some "atrocity" in Iraq or Afghanistan! The fact that every frigging insurgent (and non-insurgent) male over there has not been VAPORIZED by our troops is indication they have "held back" and fought with too much restraint on them! Bush needs to pardon accused serviceman on the morning of 01/20/09 when he walks out of the White House for the last time!

Mom of a Marine wrote on Mar 30, 2008 10:06 AM:Hell...Bush can do that BEFORE that!

Bigbadbill wrote on Mar 30, 2008 10:07 AM:Rules of Engagement to Resolve Conflict: 1. Shoot first and ask questions later. 2. Kill em all and let God sort out the good guys and bad guys. 3. If a reporter gets in you way, shoot him first.

Grateful wrote on Mar 30, 2008 11:30 AM:To Chris: As anyone who has been in it will attest - war is a dreadful and dirty business. You should be grateful that there are men like Cpl.Tatum who are willing to put themselves in harms way so you and your ilk can sit back and pray for peace. Before you wish for his prosecution, you should be made to stand in his shoes.

Bo wrote on Mar 30, 2008 11:58 AM:When are Bush, Cheney, Rumsfield, and Rice going to be tried for killing over 4,000 American Heroes by sending them to Iraq under false pretences (AKA LIES) and then leaving them there for over 5 years to be targets? Get our troops out of danger now and stop the persecution of these fine young Americans! They have done nothing wrong but follow orders from the war criminals in the White House!!

Stryker Mom wrote on Mar 30, 2008 12:03 PM:Great News for the Tatum Family! This sorry persecution should never have gotten so far. The only ones who should be behind bars are Secretary of the Navy Winter and Jack Murtha for using this to further their political agendas. Good thing those two traitors and others like them weren't in office during WWII. They are pathetic.

Proud Infidel wrote on Mar 30, 2008 12:07 PM:There would have been no "innocent civilian" deaths had blood-thirsty, 7th century terrorits not used them as human sheilds. The Marines acted properly and were well within the rules of engagement. Good citizens of the 12th District of Pennsylvania - throw the bum out! God bless our troops!

P To Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 12:43 PM:How do you know that the kids didn't have weapons? Were YOU there? And do "I" care? Yes I do, I care about my 19 yr old son who is being shipped there in May. THAT is who I care about.

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 30, 2008 1:39 PM:AW4 causes Tigmother endless mirth and chuckling. AW4's pathetic nitpicking misses the FACT that any MARINE who serves in Iraq is serving in a combat zone as defined by executive order; they receive combat pay and all of their pay is tax exempt. Serving in a COMBAT ZONE is hazardous and no part of Iraq is a safe refuge, not even the "Green Zone." It is not necessary that bullets whiz by their head nor that they were riding in a vehicle hit by a roadside bomb. Further, many members of the MARINE jury have received medals for VALOR in a combat zone and were indeed in close, hot combat. To even hint that somebody like AW4 is better able to judge the guilt or innocence of these defendants than the MARINE juries is beyond ridiculous. No matter, justice has and will prevail in these cases, including the disposition of the P8. The defendants have received and will receive fair and legal trials that will survive the appeal process ~ EASILY. Once again, AW4 has contributed NOTHING to the dialogue but chatter and blather. Tigmother chuckles.

Stryker Mom wrote on Mar 30, 2008 2:34 PM:To: P
I know exactly how you feel. My only son has re-enlisted and will be deploying in '09 for a third tour. I will keep your son in my prayers. Keep up the good fight. Our values and freedoms would have long been lost if people like our sons were not here to protect them. We should all keep the Wuterich family in our prayers, too. I hope this nightmare will end for them soon. God bless America!

Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 5:45 PM:What rot. "Our values and freedoms would have long been lost if people like our sons were not here to protect them". Yes all those Iraqis that were living in poverty were comming over here to conquer the good old USA. I am just so sick of cleches that are nonsense. Yes the Marine corps is trying these men based on some reporter trying to make a name for himself. Rediculous. Oh, yea we should just shoot these reporters, how dare they report any crimminal action by our troops. Those children and women in their homes were carrying weapons. Those Iraqis standing there with their hands up were a threat. I am disgusted that these Americans who have kept taking about truth, justice and fair play don't apply that to other people. Oh how the excusses keep comming.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Mar 30, 2008 6:27 PM:tig...Nowhere did AW4 even "hint" that she was better able to judge the guilt or innocence of these Marines. You seem to think that YOU have the monopoly on that. Chris thinks he has it too. AW4 does NOT judge these Marines, she supports them, as do I, because they volunteer to have bullets buzzing by their heads, and possibly get shot, or blown up by IED's, so that WE don't have to. They deserve at least that - our support. That is what you cannot understand and do not have the capacity for. All your hate mongering and half-cocked "predictions" based on NOTHING (because you don't know the half of the story in either of these cases)are worthless! Yet, you continue to think that something gives you the authority to be judge, jury, and the one to pass out sentences on these Marines. You don't know any of them, (we do)...and you were not in their situation. Tell us all...WHAT qualifies you to be judge and jury???? And tell us all...Just WHAT have YOU CONTRIBUTED HERE? Most of us here, of course, know ...

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 30, 2008 7:20 PM:Oh4goodnessake! TIGMOTHER! AW4 hasn't missed a thing. What would you like for me to do, spell each comment out for you the way I would a child? I gave you credit for understanding what I was saying. Just because one goes into a combat zone does NOT mean that one has fought or faced what these Marines have. It doesn't mean they've had the training they've had. Why do you think the men at Hamdania were hand-picked? Even a child would have understood that. Some panel members may have received medals for Valor but which panel? They must have been the ones on Magic's and Thomas' jury because whoever sat on the last trial had zero concept of what that particular squad was sent there to do. Get back to me when you can tell me exactly what each contributed to actual battle. If you want to talk about "my" ability to judge the guilt or innocence of these Marines, I can tell you that I would have questioned why whatever the defense needed was not granted, why Awad was in classified documents that were not allowed into evidence, why the prosecution claimed for 2 years to have DNA and other evidence of the identity of the man killed but had absolutely Nothing. That alone would have caused me to question what the hell was going on. Americans have been spoon-fed a line of crap about Hamdania and Haditha, and you probably know it as well as I. So, continue to throw your usual obnoxious, juvenile verbage and chuckle yourself silly. I don't believe for one minute that you are chuckling at anything. Like the prosecution and politicians, you're hoping that the truth stays buried. It Won't!!!

Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 9:04 PM:Give it up says that they have the vidios. I don't believe it for a minute because there was no vidio.

To Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 9:59 PM:Learn to spell.

Chris to to Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 10:33 PM:You got the message. That is all that counts.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 30, 2008 10:55 PM:To Chris: Google Drones, Haditha and there's CNN's right there; IF you're really interested in the truth. You're on the wrong side if you care about this country. If you care more about others that's sad.

Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 11:26 PM:To AW4cryinoutloud. Let's see. If I am more concerned about innocent people (all Iraqis are innocent) that we are doing terrible things too, than our own people who are doing those terrible things then that is sad. I guess that is the difference between you and me. I am more concerned about right and wrong than I am about who is doing it. I will allways take the side of the innocent party.

Chris wrote on Mar 30, 2008 11:31 PM:To AW4cryinoutloud. Did you bother to read the article on the drone. It arrived 30 minutes after the IED went off and doesn't show the Marines when they killed the civilians. So what is your point.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Mar 31, 2008 12:51 AM:to tig at 2:16...I got censored before...I guess because I couldn't stop laughing at the time...Everyone look what tig is saying there...The UCMJ made an official statement??? Wow, that would be quite a trick indeed. I don't even thing the Marine Corps could pull that one off. I believe it was an "unnamed" Marine Corps spokesperson who made the statement...NOT THE UCMJ!! Hee Hee You're still cracking me up! But, that's nothing new.

To Chris wrote on Mar 31, 2008 7:09 AM:Oh the innocent children? Get clue, they are putting weapons in the hands of children over there. Instead of making comments you nothing about, why don't you go over there? That's what I thought, you are too busy living in you parents house on welfare.

Chris wrote on Mar 31, 2008 7:10 AM:I was wrong, I can't help myself

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 31, 2008 8:27 AM:To Chris: You really need to read what a person says. I begin to think you may be the 'son' of TIGMOTHER. I did not say that it showed the deaths of civilians in the houses. I said if you're really interested in the truth. I read the article on the drone. Did you miss the part 'below' the part you read that said, "The video appears to show that, THROUGHOUT THAT DAY, MARINES ENGAGED IN FIERCE FIREFIGHTS, and called in airstrikes to level buildings-often with no definitive idea of who was inside. That could buttress defense argument that Marines clearing buildings on the ground with guns and grenades WERE JUST FOLLOWING RULES OF ENGAGEMENT." You asked what my point was. THAT is my point; they defended themselves according to ROE's. Thay came home alive. Insurgents hide behind women and children. You, nor anyone else can prove whether insurgents killed some of the women and children. The one teen said she knew the IED was going to explode. They knew about it Chris! SO; they should either get the hell out of there or suffer the freakin consequences. These so-called 'innocent' people (according to you) let the insurgents kill our Marine. They could have warned them, but No! They "allowed" it to happen. They brought Hell on themselves. So, right prevailed over wrong on that day when OUR Marines defended themselves and lived to tell about it. You're a sorry case to worry more about insurgent sympathizers than your own countrymen. Why don't you go blog on Move-On's site or Code Pink's site? You'd be much happier there. Please take your TIGmother with you. And thanks for admitting there was a Drone!

Chris to to Chrs wrote on Mar 31, 2008 8:59 AM:In this case you are just spinning in the wind. There were no weapons. The post for 7:10 was not mine. But it just shows the desperation of people when they have no defense.

Chris to AW4 wrote on Mar 31, 2008 9:03 AM:All that fighting was latter in the day and the point is that it had nothing to do with the incedent we are talking about.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 31, 2008 10:22 AM:Looky here, Tig and Chris and all you other dumdums. Not only do I know more about these cases than any living person, but in addition: I have been in contact with space people who agree with everything I have said! Every night I commune with extraterrestials. I've had rides in their UFO's (of course they are not "unidentified" to me.) They've monitored all of the battles in Iraq and have told me all. As I sit here in my little trailer, I can see that it's time for another bucket of suds.

TIGMOTHER wrote on Mar 31, 2008 10:54 AM:It's interesting that "Mom of a Marine" defends AW4 and speaks for her. ... Also interesting how AW4, who wouldn't know Iraq from a hot rock, blabbers on and on about the supposed details of some encounter that somebody had in Iraq with somebody else. This AW4 character, and her alter ego and other persona M of M, now attacks the credentials of the numerous good MARINES who served on the military juries. Tigmother accepts the judgment of those juries who not only found the defendants guilty but imposed a 15 year sentence on Hutchins. More importantly, those who have review authority WILL ACCEPT those judgments also. The President and the Secretary of Defense have already expressed their dismay and disapproval of these crimes and the criminals who have committed them. Thus, a Presidential Pardon will NEVER OCCUR. Further, it's a political reality that no President will even think of such a pardon. The American people in poll after poll have overwhelmingly REJECTED a continuance of the war in Iraq and those who have committed crimes in that war.

Bob wrote on Mar 31, 2008 2:14 PM:Way to go!

Chris wrote on Mar 31, 2008 2:28 PM:I took more time to read you nonsense. First of all why should these civilians warn the Marines.Why do they owe these Marines who destroyed their country anything. Now if they did warn these Marines then he insurgents may have killed them for being a colaberator. We would do the same thing over here. Let's get one thing straight. The majority of the Iraqis support attacks on the troops because our troops destroyed their country. But that is no excuse to murder a person just because they are not a stool pigeon. It just amazes me at how arrogant we Americans have become. We go into a country and kill untold tens of thousands of it's citizens and then think that those remaining owe us something. Only in America.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 31, 2008 3:28 PM:To Chris: Then GET OUT and go live with them!!!

USMC, Ret. wrote on Mar 31, 2008 3:30 PM:I think some of the bloggers on here who defend the people charged and/or convicted of war crimes in Iraq, are playing into the hands of the insurgents and jihadists. Those crimes are grist for their mill and if those crimes were ignored or glossed over, it would be a propaganda victory of huge proportions for those insurgents. Al Queda and others fan the flames of hatred with such material. I am loyal to the United States Marine Corps and believe in what they have elected to do to bring justice in these cases. It's ironic that a few people attack the Corps and berate it for doing the right thing. Those few people are not friends of this country. They have more in common with Al Sadr and Bin Laden than with patriotic American citizens.

BOB J. wrote on Mar 31, 2008 3:48 PM:Right on Chris. I couldn't have said it better myself! We have people defending atrocities committed by our own troops and wailing and moaning that those punished for that are brought to justice. Didn't we learn ANYTHING from the fiasco in Viet Nam? We lost approx. 50,000 of our military there, thousands more maimed and millions of Vietnamese killed ~ all for nothing! Once again we are in somebody elses' country as a foreign invader, there for no good reason, staying for longer than World War II and all to no avail. We will ultimately leave Iraq and the Iraqis will find their own way, just as the Vietnamese did. Those who wrongly put us in Iraq for fake reasons are the same people who not only cannot speak Arabic but who are utterly ignorant of the culture and mores of a people they feel they should reform and save. How absurd and outrageous. If there is a target, it should be Osama and his henchmen, not Shiites and Sunnis.

ZEDDA wrote on Mar 31, 2008 4:00 PM:It looks like AW4cryinoutloud has really had too much of the suds! Chris has expressed his opinion and because it differs from AW4's is no reason to "GET OUT." The Soviet Communists and the Czars exiled people who disagreed with them to Siberia. That's antithetical to the American way and our democracy. It strikes me that AW4cryinoutloud represents the view of a tiny minority who have a false sense of what they think is patriotism. To blindly and stridently defend criminality is both unamerican and evil.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Mar 31, 2008 4:09 PM:To USMC Ret: Nice Try!!!

Proud Infidel wrote on Mar 31, 2008 4:36 PM:Tigmo=WWI Vet=Chris...This guy has more lies, uh make that lives, than a cat. Give me a break.

Chris to Proud Infidel wrote on Mar 31, 2008 7:42 PM:Meow.

Proud Infidel wrote on Mar 31, 2008 8:18 PM:USMC, Ret. (????) didn't even know how to spell Al Qaeda.....hmmmmm

You still don't understand! wrote on Mar 31, 2008 8:31 PM:There was no ciminality...no atrocity.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 12:59 AM:To Zedda: Chris constantly defends anyone "except" his own countrymen. If one can not defend his own countrymen then that person is living in the wrong country and would be better served to live with those he chooses to defend. Therefore; the words, Get Out! No one is exiling anyone. What a bloody ridiculous comment. I agree; to blindly and stridently defend criminality is both unamerican and evil. So, why don't you, Chris, TIG and the coward who used my blog name to make a fool of himself, cease and desist with your defense of the enemy's BS propaganda against AMERICANS? Please don't tell me you guys wear Pink Tshirts!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 10:04 AM:To ZEDDA: You might want to go back to school and take a course in Basic Math. You stated that I represent the views of a tiny minority. You realy need that class; 24 to 6 is a MAJORITY. I discounted one blog because it was someone using my blog name to misrepresent me (March 31 at 10:22AM). Process of elimination leads one to suspect it's one of those who already blogged and couldn't handle the truth. Even if you add it YOU and your followers or alter ego (s) can spew yourselves silly but the Fact is that you're in the MINORITY. Learn to count!!!

TIGMOTHER wrote on Apr 1, 2008 10:07 AM:Tigmother notes M of M's post wherein she cites a minor typo of Tigmother, to wit: "UCMJ" which should obviously have been "USMC." That is the best goofy M of M has to offer to the dialogue. Dear me. In the same silly way, Tigmother quotes M of M from the same post: "I don't even thing the Marine Corps could pull that one off" THING??? hahahaha AW4's nasty little allusion to "pink T shirts" is illustrative of just how ... . Never mind. The convictions and guilty pleas are now permanent and inalterable as will be those to come. Justice prevails!

ZEDDA wrote on Apr 1, 2008 10:33 AM:Appears to me that "criminality" has already been established by the decision of General Courts Martial and/or pleas of guilty to criminal acts. Those actions are "enemy propaganda?" Also looks like if anybody disagrees with AW4, they are the enemy and should be exiled. Hysteria at its worst. And yes, on occasion I have worn a pink T-shirt. So what? What is the relevance of that? Oh yeah, now I see where you're coming from and what kind of person you are AW4. Your hateful, ignorant diatribes brand you for what you are. I would say what that is, but it would be too strong to pass muster with the blog editors.

Kami wrote on Apr 1, 2008 12:35 PM:RE: Pink t-shirt comment

It means you are a member of the anti-America, pro-Communist front group known as Code Pink. They wear a trademark pink t-shirt. That is fairly common knowledge.

ZEDDA wrote on Apr 1, 2008 12:42 PM:AW4cryinoutloud uses the number of blogs on here as a data base to establish the percentage of those who favor or approve Marines convicted or charged with war crimes. ... Her warped views are shared by only a very tiny minority of American citizens, and most of that minority don't really understand the issue, which is atrocities committed by the American military. The Congress of the United States and the President represent the American people under our system of government. A majority voted them into office. How many of them say that what Hutchins and Wuterich and the rest did was OK? None.

MorallyRight1 wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:06 PM:The Corps began going down this unjust road many, many months ago. And, now because of the 'pride' they cannot reverse their actions. It is just another case wherein they will hang one man, unjustly, so as to appease the Iraqi government. If just once they would take action to 'please' the American public, justice would inadvertantly be served. How can you hold a staff sgt. responsible, and not his superiors. Isn't the Corps all about rank and who is responsible for whom? And, most simply, because the Sgt. was the first to come out publicly and take the beating, if I am not mistaken, he is now the focus of the Marine's beating, for doing so. Yes, I do agree the circus and the clowns are back in action, or did they ever leave? Lest we not forget another Sgt. who is still incarcerated and hanging unjustly, now Pvt.? With a few exceptions, sounds much like a carbon copy of his court martial fiasco. My prayers continue go out to both men and their families....Keep the faith!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:10 PM:To TIGMOTHER: Excuse me for asking but just what is nasty about referring to pink T-shirts? Unless You consider Code Pink as "nasty". It lies within your mind, and, apparently, as I look at the comments by ZEDDA; in his mind also. You two really need to get a grip on your perverted take on things. FYI!!! Nothing is permanent or inalterable. In your dreams! And, you know what? Justice may yet prevail. Patience TIG...Patience!!!

Mom of Marine wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:27 PM:To Tig...A minor typo can occur once. You typed that not once but twice, proving (1) you don't know what you are talking about. (2)you make your comments without any intelligent thought. Gosh...I'm sooo crushed that you called me goofy! Is that the best you could come up with. Talking about "goofy"...you need to look at yourself. I have offered more intelligent dialogue here that you could ever dream up. You continued ignorance is once again tiresome. And you are wrong about plea deals and convictions being permanent and unalterable. Yes...WRONG AGAIN, but that certainly is not a surprise! And for Zedda...Criminality was established only by the Press! It is a facade.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:30 PM:To ZEDDA: Learned to count yet? ... you know very well what I mean when referring to the "enemy". Here, let me educate you; The enemy lies and spreads propaganda about our troops to place them in a negative light. The "enemy" spreads propaganda through the news media and the internet. The "enemy" delights in the suffering of others. The "enemy" tries to turn citizens on one another so that they in turn will turn on their government and those who fight for it. Propaganda! It's been around for a long time. Surely you must be aware. People disagree with me all the time. So what? My husband disagrees with me at times. So what? No! I don't plan to exile my husband or friends who disagree with me. But I gotta tell ya'; when it comes to the TIG's and the ZEDDA's, if I had the power to exile them; you betya!!! The hysteria is yours and TIG's; your fear is that too many bloggers will support OUR Marines and wise up to the BS. I also have worn a pink t-shirt. I look good in pink. You remind me of a guy who used to blog here; words like "hateful", and "diatribes" You say you know where I'm coming from. You haven't the slightest clue. If NCT had taken the pink T-shirt comment to mean anything perverse, as apparently reflected in "your" mind, they'd, as you say, not have printed it. CODE PINK!!! Ever hear of them? ... These have most definitely been MY comments and not those of any other blogger.(AW4cryinoutloud)

Steve wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:55 PM:USMC ret. I agree with you on one statement. They should be held accountable if a crime was committed. There wasn't. They have dismissed all charges against the enlisted men for following the ROE. If the troops all fell under the ROE, how does the squad leader, the one giving orders not? Let the testimony fall where it may, and the verdict the same, but I am not happy about the govt. doing anything possible to get a conviction. The prosecuting officers Fit Reps should not be based on whether they get a conviction or not, but rather getting the truth out. I also do not believe that if MOM and AW4 have spent countless of hours and days trying just find out what the truth really is, shouldn't put them in the same statement as Bin Laden. Your loyalty to the Corps is appreciated, but if we do not question authority when we believe them to be wrong, We might as well be under dictatorship.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:56 PM:OMG...I made a minor typo...Sorry, I guess I should be shackled, chained and convicted...I meant to say to tig that YOUR continued ignorance is once again, tiresome. I guess we can make that once, twice, three times, etc.....You have made so many "errors in judgement" in your comments here...there must be something to convict you of. But, I guess it is not against the law to be stupid...thanks to people like OUR MARINES!!

Steve wrote on Apr 1, 2008 1:59 PM:Tig: What was your previous prediction? Did you get that one from your tarot cards, or your crystal ball? My advise is to get a new hobby...

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 2:01 PM:Oh Mercy; just when I though it couldn't get any more ridiculous. Now I have a database? OK! I'd be careful with the math if I were ZEDDA. He doesn't have a very good track record so far. Funny, how I'm accused of being an 'Exiler" of people who disagree with me but ZEDDA professes that those who "DO" agree with me don't really understand the issue. ZEDDA, You don't get it. You stated that I'm in a minority, you turn around and ask how many say that what Hutchins and Wuterich and the rest did was OK, and then you answer your own question with NONE??? Really? Please share your database. How many, of the millions of Americans in this country, did you get around to asking and entering in your database? ZEDDA......Here's a clue to just a microscopic mathematmatical answer for you....Try adding the number of bloggers here who support these Marines. I'm thinkin' you forgot to include them in your database. Learn to Count!!!

Steve wrote on Apr 1, 2008 2:05 PM:Ohhhhhh...CHRIS....Sharratt's role in the killing of four Iraqi men inside a bedroom was deemed by Gen. James Mattis, who was then overseeing the case, to fall within the rules of engagement.

That came after testimony during a pretrial hearing showed that one of the Iraqis Sharratt killed was armed with an AK-47 assault rifle.

Did you not understand that part, or is it beyond your reading comprehension?

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 2:06 PM:To Kami: Thanks Kami. Good to see not everyone has the mindset displayed by TIG and ZEDDA.

ZEDDA wrote on Apr 1, 2008 2:32 PM:"The Congress of the United States and the President represent the American people under our system of government. A majority voted them into office. How many of them say that what Hutchins and Wuterich and the rest did was OK? None." Learn to read AW4cryinoutloud, learn to read. Our government condemns Wuterich, Hutchins and all of the rest of those who committed war crimes, else they wouldn't prosecute them. Our Congress and President were elected by a majority of the American people and that's a good enough poll for me.

DESERT BUG wrote on Apr 1, 2008 2:51 PM:I think it's time to turn down the volume on the back-and-forths and the slinging of barbs. Other than venting anger, nothing is accomplished. A salient point to me is that Sgt Wuterich was an honor student in high school; and has a spic and span clean record. Larry Hutchins has a spotless record too. These young guys did what they thought was best under the CIRCUMSTANCES. These young men aren't habitual criminals. To paraphrase General MacArthur, they "did their duty as God gave them the light to see that duty." I am not so much interested in the play by play description of WHAT they did, but WHY they did it. Granted, some innocents were killed in those incidents. When President Truman authorized the use of the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, thousands and thousands of Japanese were killed, including women and children. So should President Truman have been tried for a criminal act? War is war. Horrible things happen. I am sure that in the AFTERMATH, when all the dust had settled, Sgts Wuterich and Hutchins were very upset that innocents had died as a collateral product of combat. I feel for them in that sense too. But right now, I am more concerned with the future of these wrongly convicted Marines. I think that's where the emphasis should be. They are going to need continuing help and there should be a way for those who understand and sympathize with their plight to aid them. Hopefully, a fund will be set up and someone or a committe can coordinate such efforts.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 4:21 PM:To ZEDDA: Oh My! I "did" read what you said. The problem here is not my reading; it's "your" typing and what comes through. You're not used to a democratic form of government are ya? The government is "supposed" to represent the American people. In reality, it rarely happens. Have you ever heard the phrase, "Unchecked Power is the Foundation of Tyranny"? Well, fasten your seatbelt because (in MY opinion) you are witnessing today the reality of those words. Since this government is Not a dictatorship No one tells me what to think, what to believe, what questions to ask or whether I should ask them. Most assuredly, No "Government" will decide for me who to trust or believe in. Are you really trying to convince people that a little over 500 members of Congress, POTUS and the Executive branch, and that members of the Judicial branch of this government are going to decide what MILLIONS of Americans believe? Where have you been living? Here's the "chuckle and chortle" about your comments...You refer to polls. Good grief; they poll perhaps 900 people or so at a time, NOT a whole Nation. Most of the time they pick 'certain types' of people to poll. And the last but not least chortle and chuckle; try asking how many pissed off liberals would admit that POTUS was elected by the majority. All we've heard for almost 8 years is belly-aching about how the elections were 'stolen'. So, you are arguing that We, the People, are to take the word of the Government that these Marines are guilty, simply because the Government says so? Oh, ZEDDO; Thanks for the chortle and chuckle. I'll put that one in my "database" you mentioned. The Marines my husband and I have come to know, admire, and respect, will get a chuckle. Shucks, POTUS might even get a chuckle. Thanks ZEDDA.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Apr 1, 2008 4:44 PM:God Bless you, DesertBug! You are right! Except that in the Hamdania case there was no innocent killed! They were all wrongly accused! But your comment was very poignant...and I for one appreciate it. Thank you.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 5:09 PM:Me Too BUG! I'm tired of the sillyness. Too easy to get caught up in it until an Adult says something. AW4.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Apr 1, 2008 7:07 PM:Steve @ 1:55...Thank you for not comparing me to Bin Laden. I don't know how it is for AW4, but I have followed, studied, and been involved with the cases for YEARS. And I don't mean just reading the NCTimes. They and their reporters claim to support the troops. They are the hometown newspaper of Camp Pendleton. They are biased...and like all in the media frenzy of making names and selling papers, they are no different. They need to do some more research...it's out there. There was no crime in Haditha or Hamdania...I sometimes get the feeling that some of these pathetic bloggers would have loved it if all these Marines would have been killed in Iraq rather than doing their jobs well and coming home in one peice. It is very aggravating reading all this from those who know nothing and think they know it all. (That includes these reporters.)

Chris wrote on Apr 1, 2008 8:04 PM:Sorry guys I was wrong. I finally read a book without pictures and learned that the press does indeed lie. I will now go and support the military. I am indeed not worthy to breath the same air as them but at least I can state how wrong I was.

Proud Infidel wrote on Apr 1, 2008 8:23 PM:To Mom of a Marine and AW4:
Try not to get too worked up with Tigmo, Chris, Zedda, WWI Vet (who hasn't posted in awhile) and whoever else Tigmo decides to be today. They are all one and the same. I know it is disturbing this guy was raised in the most wonderful country in the world; yet, grew up to hate it and the very men who give him his liberty. I'm sure right at this moment little Tig is down in the batcave trying to think up another alter ego!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 8:25 PM:To Mom of a Marine: Hey! The Bin Laden thing came from ignorance and an attempt to hurt you. I'd ever so love to see this guy say it to your son or any Marine we've defended. Once he'd say it he'd be saying to himself, "Feet don't fail me now". I've only been involved with this for about 22 months. It's a long story but the result has been an eye-opening experience into the workings of our government, what politicians will do to further their goals, and how complicit, whether willingly or unwillingly, the media has been in what's been done to these Marines. I've met people for whom I have so much respect and admiration. ALL of them make me proud to be an American. My husband and I will stand by them come Hell or Ignorant Blogger. Those who have been dealt a crooked hand will have their day. Now Mom, be prepared for the juvenile insults that will most likely follow. I love it! AW4.

Mom of A Marine wrote on Apr 1, 2008 11:13 PM:Thanks AW4 and all. After what I've been through for the past two years... these blogs are just petty annoyances...there is nothing that tigmo, chris, zeeda or any other uniformed blogger could say here that would hurt me. They fail.The day may come when they will finally understand. I hope they'll all be eating that humble pie soon and maybe choke on it! HeeHee!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 1, 2008 11:36 PM:To Proud Infidel: Thanks for the concern. I love your blog name. I figured it was all the same person. Lately he's become tiresome. Too much negativity for me so I'll try to take a different path and see what happens. Thanks again. AW4.

Stryker Mom wrote on Apr 2, 2008 6:02 AM:To Mom of a Marine and AW4:
I am right there with you, and proudly so! There are more that are with us than those who are against us! Don't lose faith! May God bless you both, and may God bless our precious warriors!

Go USA!

DESERT BUG wrote on Apr 2, 2008 10:49 AM:To Mom of a Marine, AW4, Stryker Mom and all who are fighting for justice and who care about the young men who have been so horribly wronged. Thanks. It's wonderful to see all of these positive blogs and comments. For myself, I continue to ignore those who agitate and irritate. I no longer reply to their barbs because I believe that is playing THEIR game. Phooey on them. I do wish that some coordinated effort could be made to help these young Marine victims of a politically inspired persecution. They must be looking at their future with some feelings of despair and depression. If only we could relieve them of at least some of that. I am thinking of: (1) Legal assistance in furthering their appeals and pressure for pardons. (2) Practical help for them during their confinement, such as sending them goodies and such. (3) Their future, to include education and employment. (4) Funding to facilitate this and more. Maybe a bank such as WaMu would set up a fund and a check and balance committee could administer the funds. These are just my random, rather unfocused thoughts. I would be more than willing to contribute to such a fund. I am sure there are many others who would feel the same way.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 2, 2008 1:25 PM:To Chris: I don't think the comments at 8:04PM were yours. I believe someone else used your blog name to embarrass. Although I disagree with you on practically eveything I respect your right to Not be misrepresented. AW4.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 2, 2008 2:01 PM:To Stryker Mom: There are more of us with you than you may realize. Semper Fi means none of us (military or civilian) will intend to quit until those unjustly accused, convicted, and incarcerated, have been vindicated; regardless of branch of service. Though some would like you to believe it, Nothing has been written in stone.

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 2, 2008 2:22 PM:To DESERT BUG: I'm going to try and take your advice and see how long I last. Hah Hah! If for no other reason; to just get away from the negativity. I find it takes something from you. I told Proud Infidel I'd try a different path so guess I'd better do it, huh? For anyone who really wants to help with the day to day things for these guys; the Brig will advise. If you're a united american patriot you're already helping. Your thoughts on the futures of these men should be, and will be heard. Be nice if the media would Qtip their ears and step up to the plate. Where's Woodward and Bernstein when you need them? Oh for the day when an investigative journalist was really an Investigative Journalist. Thanks BUG!

AW4cryinoutloud wrote on Apr 2, 2008 2:26 PM:Stryker Mom; take the word "will" out of the second sentence (April 2 at 2:01pm. I need a proofreader since I appear to be too lazy to do it myself.

DESERT BUG wrote on Apr 2, 2008 4:13 PM:AW4: I know about the Marine Corps Brig at Pendleton, but I don't know where Larry Hutchins is now. Guess I need to do some research. If he's at Ft Leavenworth, I'm thinking his family could use some support in visiting him. Same kind of thinking for the other guys too. I can just see lots of needs these men have. People demonstrated at the Gate for the P8 and I'd bet if properly organized those same folks would be interested. Maybe some publicity to attract free help from sympathetic organizations with deep pockets. A law firm and a CPA willing to do some public service? Just stream of thought stuff so far. I'm going to check the Calif Atty Gen and BBB lists for possible charitable orgs that might be keyed in. And true, we need some powerful, thorough investigative reporting re this whole travesty. Not some hancho from 60 Min acting like a prosecutor with all the scowls and accusatory manner when they did the piece on Frank Wuterich. Maybe I am rambling now. Later.

Stryker Mom wrote on Apr 2, 2008 4:27 PM:To AW4, Marine Mom and other Patriots:

My son is in the army, but I give to all of the Marine personal defense funds. I also give to United American Patriots, Move America Forward, and Defend our Defenders. We are all on the same side no matter the branch of service! We shall prevail. Most importantly, PRAY WITHOUT CEASING!

GOD BLESS OUR TROOPS!

TIGMOTHER wrote on Apr 3, 2008 4:11 PM:Tigmother is highly amused. Bug now prattles about how charitable he will be. Bug, you should realize that charity would be more intelligently placed by giving to the USO or a similar org.. Tigmother is truly astounded that you, Bug, would give anything to war criminals. By so doing Bug, you are denying just that much to those who truly need and are deserving. Do you not realize Bug that prisoners are provided everything they need by the TAXPAYERS? If you donate to such miscreants, they will only use the funds to buy dope or a weapon in the prison underground. Thus, Tigmother urges Bug and all other similarly confused beings to donate to legitimate charities and not to those who do not deserve.

And 4 days later, tig wrote on Apr 7, 2008 12:35 AM:The sound of all ignoring you!!! Yes, silence is GOLDEN!