Billy wrote on Apr 8, 2008 3:20 PM: my understanding of what solar energy can power at present is as follows: Lights, the fan on a forced air heater/air conditioner, computers, TV if not to many, etc; i.e., those small appliances that do not use great hoards of electrical energy. I have read that solor can not power those electricity hogs that cause the bulk of our bills such as: washer and dryer, refrigerator, air conditioners, water heaters, etc.
As for me I will opt to pay more to have the comfort of my home since as I grow older, and prices on everything else keep going up, I am limited to taking my pleasures at home. A cup of coffee at my favorite restaurant just went up to $1.95 and with tax #2.11. In years to come we will have our energy delivered to our homes in a package about a 2X2X2' as the need to replaces arises. And yes, I will live to see that day. I just recently got the news that if I drive carefully I will live to be 150 years or more. I will have to go back to work to pay for all this new stuff.

CN wrote on Apr 9, 2008 6:46 AM:Wow! To add $22,000 to the cost of a manufactured home is huge. If you assume that a home like that has an electric bill of $50 a month then it will take 36 years to break even. Just imagine if you needed to repair the system or remove the dirt and bird droppings. Those costs probably won't be in the budget of a retired person and would probably add another decade to the payoff.

Robert24 wrote on Apr 9, 2008 12:28 PM:...

The biggest issue that the solar folks will have is educating folks like you who really do not have all of the facts. BTW, I am not a solar contractor, nor do I have solar on my roof (yet!), but I think it is a huge benefit in this area. Go get some facts and then I think you will change your tune!

Rachel wrote on Apr 9, 2008 1:06 PM:A net zero energy home like the one mentioned in this story is about more than just solar power. It means that in addition to solar power, the home uses advanced appliances, air conditioning, hot water, lighting, etc so that the occupant never uses more power than the home generates.

A net zero energy home with just a small solar generator would pay off the cost of the improvements in about 8 years if inflation doesn't get too bad.

If inflation averages more than even 5% a year though, a system the size of a manufactured home's rooftop would pay off in 5-7 years, with net metering.

Mike wrote on Apr 9, 2008 1:53 PM:Solar power, when net metered, can power anything in your home.

The more the cost of electricity rises, the faster your solar power system pays itself off. When you install a solar power system you are prebuying your electricity at today's prices.

I wish I could have done that five years ago with gasoline!

CN wrote on Apr 9, 2008 4:04 PM:Robert24,
What facts am I missing? Please let me know about the big secret of how you can repay the $22,000 "investment" faster. Please show me the math.

Robert24 wrote on Apr 9, 2008 8:59 PM:CN; I was replying to Billy, but the NCT cut most of my post. Nonetheless, most homeowners do not have $50.00 a month energy bills (maybe in a manufactured home they could); I think the average is closer to $80.00 a month. Pool owners and others with high consumption appliances (multiple refrigerators, etc.) run much higher, and the pay off would come much sooner. My bill is never under $200.00 per month (usually closer to $300.00!), and I don't see the rates coming down anytime soon! I just think there is a lot of misinformation out there on this, and I believe it is a very viable option for the area we live in. I'd love nothing more than to not have to pay SDG&E anymore! Those "payments" never end, but I could own my solar one day!

Billy wrote on Apr 9, 2008 9:45 PM: I have not posted myself as an expert on solar energy. I do want to know about it and anything that will solve our energy problems. I believe that in the future, way in the future, our energy will be delivered to our homes in a 4X4X4' storage package and will be replaced as the need arises or something along that order. And I have just learned that I have a good chance of living to be 150 years old - if - well - and seeing it happen. lol
In my quest for knowledge about solar power I went to the Internet and this is what I got from one contractor or provider - excellent place to start for those just beginning:
"Solar power works well for most items except large electric appliances that use an electric heat element such as a water heater, clothes dryer and electric stove - for example - or total electric home heating systems. It is not cost effective to use solar power for these items. Conversion to natural gas, propane or other alternatives is usually recommended. Solar power can be used to operate a gas clothes dryer (Maytag, etc) because the electrical requirement is limited to the drum-motor and/or ignito-lighter, but not a HEAT element for drying the clothes, for example."
These are the words from a company selling solar systems. I thought it would be best to research before jumping in right now, so I attempted to advise those interested to do so. Go to the Internet and just type in Solar power. There is a great deal of information there and you may even find the company from which the above excerpt came. Robert24 - wish you success with your solar system.

Rachel wrote on Apr 10, 2008 10:04 AM:Billy- Solar power when net metered is connected to the power grid. The electricity that is produced has to be certified by the utility company as being the same as what comes off the grid.

In fact the utility company itself takes the power unused from your home solar power system, credits it back to your account as if it was their own, and "net meters" it directly back into the gird AS IS for use by any other customer of theirs.

mike wrote on Apr 10, 2008 2:05 PM:CN: $300 per month times 6 years (72 months)= $21,600

This means that if you spend $300 per month today on your electric bill and you spend $21,600 to make your home zero net energy, you will pay off a $21,600 solar system in 6 years. It would take 9 years if your electric bill is $200 per month

With inflation you will have to pay more than $300 per month in the future to get the sam electricity you get now.

In a solar powered zero net energy home, there is no inflation (you buy all those kilowatts at todays prices when you pay for your system).

CN wrote on Apr 11, 2008 7:22 AM:Mike,
Thanks for letting me know the secret. Manipulating the numbers to make your calculations look good will do it every time.
The story is about manufactured homes in a park in San Marcos. My assumptions are that these homes are for one or two people that are older and on a budget. Without all the fees that are part of everone's bill (even solar users) I am guessing that they are only using about $50 worth of electricity. $300 seams a little high for this situation.
$22,000/$50 = 440 months = 36 years
Warranties usually are 10 years for the inverter, 25 for the panels and 10 for a mobile home roof. After ten years you will probably need to replace an inverter and it will cost substantially more to re roof your home. The panels output is reduced to 80% after 25 years. All of that work for repairs will be done at future inflated costs.
Solar should be an economic decision based solely on sound principles. There are many other ways to save the planet that are cheaper.

Tom wrote on Apr 12, 2008 8:31 AM:Mike,

I checked your math with an inflation calculator online and your are right on!

I also inflated CN's calcuation of 36 years of utility payments at $50/month and discovered to my shock and amazement that even at just 5% average inflation, a person paying $50/month for 36 years would pay $60,576 to the utility company!

Thats almost thee times as much as the twenty two thousand dolar price tag for the net zero improvments.

My guess is though that if you only have a $50/month electric bill that your cost to go solar would be more like $8,000 and not $22,000 that would probably be for people like my parents that live in "all-electric" manufactured home parks.