A little help..... wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:42 AM:Could the NCT give us an address that we can mail our donations in support of this initiative?

vickis wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:26 AM:Legalization of gay marriage in California is a good news for GLBT. One of my friends, who found her another part on the online community BisexualMingle, decided to get married recently. Hope they have a great marriage life.

bob wrote on Jun 14, 2008 4:36 AM:let them get married. let them ENJOY married life. lol. if me and my wife have to be married in order to health benfits for both of us and they dont thats crap so if they want befits they should have to be married and i honestly think its cool more power to them

Charlotte wrote on Jun 14, 2008 5:51 AM:There will always be people against equality. Marriage is a basic civil right that should be attainable by all Americans if they choose. Education is key. For those who are uncomfortable with gay marriage check out our short produced to educate & defuse the controversy. It has a way of opening closed minds & provides some sanity on the issue: ...

Herb wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:16 AM:The CA Supreme Court implied, if they haven't came right and said, that they had no choice to rule in favor of gay marriages due to the way the law was written. They implied that the legislator messed up.
Hey people, let's get it right this time! The people of CA have already told you what they want, and now we have to do it all over again. Write the law this time correctly.

Sleeping but Awake wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:42 AM:I wonder how many gay citizens of the county have purchased a car from Hoehn motors in Carlsbad to date. My guess is that a bunch of gay people have, and have had their cars serviced there as well. I wonder how many will go there for services after today, my guess is zero and rightfully so. This is another example of several wealthy individuals trying to run the lives of others cloaked in their religion.

JA wrote on Jun 14, 2008 7:10 AM:What bigots these people are!

Dan P wrote on Jun 14, 2008 7:28 AM:The argument that gays will sue to be married in churches is spurious. There is no effort to legally require churches to perform gay marriages, nor can they be required to. Just as divorce is accepted as a legal institution, but opposed by many churches who are not obligated to recognize its validity.

There are churches who already perform gay marriages (not legally recognized) and they will continue to do so, amendment or no amendment.

Paul wrote on Jun 14, 2008 7:49 AM:I doubt the paper would let the address be posted here. Maybe they will. But meanwhile you can get a lot of information about the issues and get the name and address of the primary organization that put the Protect Marriage amendment on the ballot. They are fund raising to pay for publicity for the efforts to get a favorable vote on the issue. On the Internet just write protect marriage as one word ...

Stacey wrote on Jun 14, 2008 7:51 AM:At least now I know whose businesses not to visit. For example, I know now to avoid Hoehn Motors when I start shopping for my new car. And Daniel McCalla needs to realize that not all hetero marriages produce children either. Should they be voided as well?

I will be sure to vote NO on this ridiculous attempt to legalize government sponsored discrimination.

Descrimination wrote on Jun 14, 2008 8:09 AM:If gays are allowed to marry and get all the benefits including tax breaks, then we the singles of California DEMAND THE SAME BENEFITS!!!!

ron ... wrote on Jun 14, 2008 8:39 AM:I have had my Honda Accords serviced at Hoehn Honda since 1995. They do excellent work. However I can't support a overtly narrow-minded owner of a company who stomps on civil rights. Robert stay out of people's lives - just sell and service cars. I won't be returning to Hoehn for anything. So long.

Paul wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:03 AM:The recent state Supreme Court decision was four for and three against "gay marriage" being a right. If only one of those four judges had decided the other way, then the legal result would have been the opposite. It certainly is NOT obvious in the law and state constitution that men have a right to "marry" men or women "marry" women or the decision would have been SEVEN TO ZERO in favor of "gay marriage." Sometimes activist judges are "making laws" that are the territory of legislators or the voting public at large. In the proposition 22 vote a few years ago some counties were as high as 70 to 80 percent in favor of defining marriage as one man and one woman. And even with all the money spent by well-funded pro-gay organizations and with huge liberal population centers the statewide choice was won with over 61%

Just Wondering wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:12 AM:ron and stacy, you choose to boycott persons who have taken a position different from yours. Do you think it is OK that over a million of us have signed pledges to not buy a new car made by a major car company that was donating a large sums of corporate money regularly to promoting gay events, unless they stopped and became neutral with their corporate contributions and advertizing. donations?

JK wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:13 AM:I have leased 5 Porches from Hoehn and had them serviced over the years. Now no more! How many more customers will Hoehn loose?

I have gay friends wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:33 AM:"Until the gays prove to me that they can have children, which is why God created marriage, I just think this is an abomination." I have gay friends with children. Who says "God" created marriage? I think hate-filled people are an "abomination".

Lee wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:35 AM:Marriage basically is a civil (legal) action not a religious action.
It's interesting that 4 wealthy homophobes are resurrecting this initiative.

We are BUYING wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:35 AM:3 porches for the girls from Hoehn, we unlike others do not lease vehicles.

Just Wondering wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:48 AM:If a car dealer said, so what! I don't want to work on gays' cars anyway; he would be violating the law and be prosecuted by the state. Mr. Hoehn did not say that. So how come it is ok for you to say you will not do business there anymore because he thinks the word "marriage" should be reserved for a man and woman. California law allows same sex people to live together and have sex together, and optionally to register as same sex couples if they desire to and get many of the legal benefits they sought. BESIDES for all you know or don't know some of the persons there who have leased or sold you those cars, and some of those who have serviced your Porches were GAY. If so, then you refusal to go back after getting good service may be hurting the livelihood of innocent gay persons. Think about it. And besides that before you go to another agency are you going to go in and ask to talk to the owner and grill him or her about whether they give, or ever have given money to a group promoting “marriage is between a man and a women“. If you don't ask you might end up at a place where the owners donated even more money to causes you disagree with. Think about that too.

To Lee and Char wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:57 AM:Marriage is a Religious Practice. A holy sacrament. Why do gays insist on corrupting our Holy way of life. 4 wealty wise prople care about the sanctity of marriage. They want to conserve some good old values. That's the problem with alot of people, nothing is sacred anymore.

To Stacey wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:58 AM:You're right...Not all hetero marriages produce children. Now cite one case where a same sex union produced just ONE child. I'm sure the editors of various medical journals would like to hear from you....

missmarple wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:11 AM:How about Mary Cheney?

Ronald wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:13 AM:I object to people misusing the words homophobic and homophobes for everyone who disagrees with their own opinion.
I saw a young air force officer have a homophobic attack one time when the don't ask don't tell policy was announced to a group. He turned bright red, was trembling all over and yelling to demand he could talk to his Senator when she came to visit the site soon. Perhaps that might be called a homophobic reaction although he may have been sexually attacked by a homosexual as a youth or something.
Anyhow I object to the misuse of labeling everone who disapproves of theactions of homsexuals with the homophobic label. That is no different than someone else calling everyone who disagrees with his position a stupid ignorant moron, or any such comment.

Jordan wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:13 AM:Mr. Hoehn and others, I would like to say thank you for supporting a cause that you believe in in spite of the scrutiny you probably knew you would receive. If people want to take their business elsewhere due to these facts, that's their decision, but it's nice to see somebody standing up for what they believe regardless of the potential financial consequences. Who knows, you may just end up with additional business from those who agree with this cause as a result. Thanks again.

Bill wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:14 AM:Marriage is a holy sacrament between a man and a woman. It is NOT between a same sex couple. If you want to live a perverted lifestyle, that is fine by me, just dont indoctrinate your sic and twisted views on the rest of America who VOTED TO NOT ALLOW THIS travesty. Believe it or not, but there are still some traditional, conservatives out here who still think that being gay is a crime against nature. I hope your all fuming now. Go kiss your boyfriend.

Generations of Wisdom wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:18 AM:I applaud Hoehn's owners for putting their money where their principles are. The blogging we see above is an example of how organized the gay groups are and how they will not stop short of acceptance of their lifestyle as OK. Isn't it amazing how smart the California Supreme Court thinks they are by rejecting thousands of years of the collective wisdom of every major religion? If you think the activists will not yet mandate churches to marry gays, think again!

what about satanic staight couples wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:21 AM:It appears the overwhelming argument against gay marriage has religious tones or straight up says "God no likey." Now for moment let's forget that whole seperation of church and state thing (they think that's all just silly anyway :) ) ... I'd like to ask those using the religious argument, what about atheist or even Satanic straight couples? Or heck, a Satanic couple who is barren? They can legally get married but a boring, committed homosexual couple cannot? Explain that please. (Not being sassy, just wanna know)
-- str8 chick

Sleeping but Awake wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:50 AM:Applauding Hoehn for their funding discrimination is not right. I for one am wrtiing Hoehn to tell him I will not shop in his car stores for vehicles or service, and copy the USA president of every car brand they sell. Here is the bottom line, people who support gay rights have green money. If the car makers want us to favor them with this green currency then they need to straighten their dealers out....period.

Bo wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:51 AM:Get over it already! How does gay marriage DIRECTLY harm you? If your concern is that it is a sin then let God handle it!

Chris wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:04 AM:How many of these do-gooders are the ones who support the troops who are are on trial for [allegedly] murdering innocent Iraqis in cold blood. With the country in dire straights and our murderous rampages in Iraq and Afganistan I would think that these do-gooders would have more important things on their mind other that going after two people who want to live together and have the same legal rights as the heteral sexuals.

Mr. Hoehn wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:05 AM:Thank you and you WILL receive my business for future vehicle purchases.

Stacey wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:16 AM:JUST WONDERING: You ask: "So how come it is ok for you to say you will not do business there anymore because he thinks the word "marriage" should be reserved for a man and woman." ... I answer: Easy, because it's my money and I have the right to choose to spend it where I want. Let me break it down a little for you:

First, I totally respect your right & choice to boycott or not boycott anything you want for any reason you feel appropriate. Is there anything I said that would make you believe otherwise?

Second, I totally respect Mr Hoehn's right to believe what he believes and to support the cause in whatever way he feels he can have the most impact. Much in the same way I would hope that he would respect me right to disagree with his position and to show that in whatever way I feel I can have the most impact.

You also say "you refusal to go back after getting good service may be hurting the livelihood of innocent gay persons" ... That's true. I would imagine it could hurt the livelihood of innocent straight people too. I research the backgrounds of many companies to choose where I will put my hard earned dollar. There are restaurants I won't go to because I don't like the way they do business even though the service has always been good. I'm sure it sucks for the waitresses we always over tipped, but I simply can't reward the business itself for what I believe are its bad practices. There are companies I won't buy from because they have development division that test commercial products on animals. Etc, etc.

And those are just a few things I think about when I decide where to conduct my business. You should think about that too.

Re To Stacey ... Childless Couples wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:19 AM:Science can help a woman/woman couple conceive a child, but man/man would certainly not be able to. But that's not the point I was trying to make. If the sole condition of marriage is that they can produce children then there are many married hetero couples out there that shouldn't be allowed to participate in the legal union either.

Earl wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:19 AM:My dear friends, marriage as an institution has evolved. Divorce was once illegal. Marriage between people of two races was once illegal. The bible sanctions bigamy. The court upholds the sacred right to equality before the law. Let people in love marry.

Robert wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:23 AM:It is not correct to state this initiative was resurrected by the four wealthy individuals named in the article. Certainly their contributions helped get signatures gathered, or will help publicize it. The fact is the need for this effort and talk about it has been going on for several years, and finally got rolling. The people working on this petition had gathered 1.1 million signatures, far more than were required to put this on the November ballot and submitted it to the state in April 2008 It was not until May 15, that the State Supreme Court announced their 4-3 decision. June 2, the state announced tentative had qualified for the November ballot. Law firms asked the State Supreme Court to hold off placing their decision in effect until after the November election. The attorney generals of ten other states which have specific laws defining marriage to mean between one man and one woman also asked the state Supreme Court to hold off because of the legal complications when same sex marriages couples moved to their states, or residents of their states visited California to get married and came home claiming to be married, then they would have a lot of extra court work to put up with including what if California did pass their law in November stating marriage in California was for one man and one woman. Any Persons who would like to read more of the steps during the last eight years and other information can find this on the web site for ProtectMarriage.

.

Re To Lee and Char wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:25 AM:"Marriage is a Religious Practice" ... That statement would be true if it stayed within the confines of the church, but it hasn't. It stopped being a religious practice when the public governments started issuing licenses and publically enforcing those contracts. Now it's no longer a religious practice ... it's a public contract. As a public contract, it cannot be denied to any legal, law abiding and taxpaying citizen for reasons such as skin color, sex, religious affiliate or sexual orientation.

If the church wanted to keep marriage as it believes it should be then they never should have let it leave their control.

And ... as far as the sanctity of marriage is concerned ... with the divorce rate being roughly 50%, I think we heterosexuals are doing enough to destroy any sanctity marriage may have ever had.

Ronson wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:40 AM:Two people of the same sex in a commited relationship can register as domestic partners. This is as it should be and separation rules should apply. They should have all the rights and benefits as a man and woman who are married. JUST DON'T CALL IT A MARRIAGE.

LADY wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:47 AM:THANK GOD,people are BACKING this with money. MONEY talks!!! Marriage is for a man and women PERIOD,the rest of you people GET OVER it!!! Find something else to do with your time!!! Where can I send my MONEY!!!!

Paul wrote on Jun 14, 2008 11:55 AM:To whoever asked what about satanic straight couples at 10:21 AM.
The Satanic straight couple would likely want to be married in a Satanic Church if they were practicing Satanists. They could not say their marriage was made in heaven. How would the wife react if the husband went around saying their marriage was made in hell?
Maybe she would say it was cute and laugh about it. Maybe she would be angry and put an evil spell on him. If they had children would they be little devils? If they were barren would there be a sympathetic social worker somewhere that would let them adopt a poor normal kid? If not, could they sue the state for illegal religious discrimination?
A loving committed homosexual couple can live together and be nice to each other, have sex with each other, commit to a civil union and have more legal rights than a conventional couple who are living together without being married. You make it sound like they still have to hide in the closet. If the homosexual couple is cool with liberal Christian Churches they can have a religious commitment ceremony. If they have more evangelical religious beliefs but feel homosexual tendencies they have a choice to make. Some homosexual groups suppress the fact that many individuals have rejected a homosexual lifestyle and get married to an opposite sex partner or remain celebrate.

Sounds Familiar wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:08 PM:Jack Feller raised so much heck, they put "In God We Trust" in the City Council Chambers, Mayor Wood subjects the visitors to the Council Meetings to a looong drawn out prayer session prior to every meeting. Hollingsworth and Hoehn (8 car dealerships in car country) and the other businessmen forget who they are serving, including the welfare of employee paychecks! Whether the Political or the Business world, religion has no place but their PRIVATE lives. The result can be disastrous when mixed. Marrying Politics and Religion is the worst bedfellow possible for all concerned. No matter who they want to marry!

Amen wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:31 PM:So! Let's all get down to car country and hold a prayer service at the Hoehn dealerships! This isn't the only holy watering hole meddling in the private lives of others. Just remember, you wouldn't have $25,000. if those cars stop selling!And while we are praying, let's include all the overpopulated households struggling to feed their children in this economy

Former Hoehn customer wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:31 PM:I'm never giving my business to Hoehn again. To me, this is as bigoted as if they said they only work on cars owned by white people. Why a business that spends so much money on advertising would want to sponsor discrimination is beyond me. I'll take my money elsewhere.

Phil wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:36 PM:"Until the gays prove to me that they can have children, which is why God created marriage, I just think this is an abomination."

Right, and what about all those senior couples getting married, who have no intention of producing more children? Shall we BAN marriage for those over age 50?

Or shall we BAN age-inappropriate marriage, like the 65 year old man who wants to marry some 20 year old chick? And while we're at it, shall we BAN mixed-race marriages? How about a BAN on marriage between people who don't believe in God? Or how about a BAN on 2nd marriages for people who have already failed at marriage?

Homophobia still persists but is slowly losing it's grip on most of us. Intelligent folks with an ounce of compassion are not threatened by someone else's sexuality. It's the ignorant hateful people who have nothing better to do with their time than think up BANS for others to live by. Get a life!

Joe wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:55 PM:These "fat cats" who can contibute $50,000 or more would be better served to spend their money investigating the wide spread child molestation committed by the leaders of their respective churches.

str chick wrote on Jun 14, 2008 12:58 PM:Hey Paul, those are lovely scenarios but that doesn't address my question. My point is that the religious argument against homosexual marriage doesn't hold water because under the current law, atheist and anti-religious folks can get married as long as it's a man and woman, but God forbid (hehe) a loving homosexual couple gets married - gasp!!

Yes, churches have every right to say who can and cannot get married under their roof. However, in a government system that allows people to get married regardless of their religious beliefs, the "God doesn't like it" argument has no place.

bodecea wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:14 PM:Gay Californias are recognised as being one of the largest groups with disposable income. I would hope that note would be taken that Hoehn and Manchester don't want us to be equal in the eyes of the law. I would imagine that they don't want our money either. Let us make them happy in that regard and I encourage all gays and those who believe in equal rights for all Californians to spend our money elsewhere.

senator who wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:18 PM:I am not gay, I never have been gay, does that sound familiar ?
Maybe these people with the money are trying to throw us a curve ball.

confused wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:21 PM:Could somebody please tell me what the problem is about gay people marrying.
and please don't bring religion into it.
Thank you

Bob wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:25 PM:Jjust 40 years ago many states had las forbidding the marriage of black man and a white woman. The arguments provided then are the same people use today for gay marriage (religion, individual rights, etc...). Wake up and realize that to deny a government given right to a citizen is discrimination.

What wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:53 PM:I will vote no on this if they manage to get it on the ballot. If the christian majority passed a ballot inititive banning other religons the courts would have to overturn it as unconstitutional. I suspect a law banning same sex marrige would also be struck down as unconstitutional. Freedom of religon would protect a church from lawsiuits trying to force them to perform marriges that they feel are wrong.
Between the divorse rate and polygamy I think I can say that the sanctity of marrige is already toast.
Lastly how does a samesex marrige harm your relationship with your spouse? Mind your own buisness.

If... wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:53 PM:If the great homophobes of California actually allow hate to be written into the state constitution than I will PERSONALLY make sure that all childless marriage cease to exist. I say, if gays can't marriage for that reason then let's REALLY make sure others can't.
And for the person saying how people are misusing the word "homophobe" ... if you sat there and said you don't think blacks should marry, i'd call you a racist...not someone who just 'disagrees with blacks'. So if you tell me gays shouldn't be allowed the same RIGHTS AND TITLES then guess what? you're homophobic..the end!

These Signatures wrote on Jun 14, 2008 1:57 PM:These groups that are out getting signatures to ban-gay marriage use absolutly horrible methods to do so including LYING to those who are signing. They'll ask you to sign one petition and then ask you to sign a 'copy' for business records...when in fact the second copy is to ban gay marriage. How do these groups sit there saying their HOLY and looking out for families when they use tricks and lies? And let the voters go out, in the past the bigots got their way, but now there's an entirely NEW HUGE OPEN MINDED generation of voters who are ready to tell the world they want equality for themselves, their friends, and their families. Good Luck

Alf wrote on Jun 14, 2008 2:00 PM:For all the religious arguments against "gay" marriage I have one thing to say, a quote from a rather famous person, "Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s". The legal aspects of marriage are a matter of law, the religious aspects are a matter of religion. If you refuse to differentiate the two, you are not following the words of Christ, the very foundation and inspiration of Christianity. Does the phrase "By the power invested in me by the state of" ring a bell? If it does, then you MUST accept that the legal rights and responsibilities of heterosexual marriage must be the exact same LEGAL rights and responsibilities for a "civil union" for homosexuals or there is no "equal protection under the law". I will not vote for a law or amendment that promotes inequality or that attempts to interject religion into the law, it seems to me that the First Amendment is rather clear on the subject. Regards, Alf.

Remember When wrote on Jun 14, 2008 2:02 PM:we were in a pointless war spending billions of dollars while gas prices and the house market become so horrible that people cannot afford the basics while losing their homes and jobs?
And yet are passion as a state is whether or not to allow gays to marry?

If they're happy let them marry, who really cares?

We have too many serious problems here at home to fix and we need everyone playing as a team, not fighting over who gets the better toy... Get your heads out of your rears and let's fix our homes--together!

Infidel wrote on Jun 14, 2008 2:06 PM:I now know where I will buy my next car, spend the night and store my stuff. Can I now have those who are paying to get this crap ruling any further so I can boycott them.

I have wrote on Jun 14, 2008 2:41 PM:For all the people commenting on the fact that gays cannot have children. Many heterosexuals can't as well. This is why we have adoption. My neighbors are lesbians with 3 adopted children. The children are the most well adjusted people you will find in the neighborhood. The home they live is the best kept (besides mine:-) in the neighborhood. I would prefer neighbors like them over the hetero families with kids that race there cars and party all the time.

John wrote on Jun 14, 2008 3:07 PM:Have those that identify as "far-right christian conservatives" EVER been on the RIGHT side of Justice, Equality, and Morality? Ever?

From Women's Rights, the Civil Rights Movement, Interracial Marriage, etc., etc., they consistently stand for perpetuating White-Male-Hetero-Power. Perhaps those with all of the power and rights should be the only ones required to pay taxes; it is immoral to tax those who are denied basic civil rights.

Bill wrote on Jun 14, 2008 3:30 PM:A seventh grader once asked; "if homosexuals can't reproduce, how come there's so many of them?"

Love wrote on Jun 14, 2008 4:13 PM:How does two men or two women marrying each other affect anyone other than themselves? This is a free country last I checked and they should have the right to marry. Will it affect Hoehn's car sales or in some way do damage to the Manchester Developments or hurt the storage industry? I think not. Their money would be better spent to purchase food for the food bank or help out Father Carroll's charities!

Paul wrote on Jun 14, 2008 4:57 PM:This is an attempted reply to str chick at 12:58 and confused at 1:21 PM. At least I am acknowledging your comments. Examples from over 3,000 years ago represented in todays civil and criminal law for everybody: Do not murder anyone. Do not commit adultery. Do not steal, Do not give false testimony. Then some advice: Do not covet things belonging to your neighbor. This can lead to theft, adultery, or even murder, you can read about these violations every day in the newspaper. Other examples from that era are rules for those who wanted a religious relationship with God, like do not curse God or use his name to curse other people. Examples from 2,000 years ago: Treat other people the way you would like to be treated. Help the needy, visit those who are sick and in prison. Anyway a lot of people consider the Bible to be the closest thing to an operating manual and directions for the human race, so they quote it. I also have a book that develops the case for traditional marriage and against homosexual marriage over about 250 pages written by a person with several Phds and with much experience dealing with people. Then there are people including Bill O’Reilly who want to hear convincing reasons in ten seconds or less or think there are no reasons. That is not easy to do. It may even be impossible to fully develop the conclusion backed with scholarly secular arguments in a several second sound byte. IF it were easy the author would not have written a 250 page book. However that does not mean the conclusion is invalid. However it is a fact that there are many "Gay" people who are not gay in the older meaning of the word. In fact there is a DVD out titled "It’s not Gay: Former homosexuals tell a story few have heard" It allows former homosexuals the opportunity to tell their own story in their own words. Along with medical and mental health experts these individuals give a clear warning that the prevalent view of homosexuality being presented to students is not the whole story. This is a compassionate presentation that will help anyone to get a more fair and balanced approach to this subject. You will notice the newspaper articles are showing examples of those people who have been in a committed relationship for a long time. Those reporters who promote the gay lifestyle rarely report on the huge numbers of them that have tried living together in a committed relationship but have not succeed in staying together very long. They do not report on those who roam park restrooms looking for love in all the wrong places. If homosexual marriage becomes legal, then that opens the school wide open from kindergarten through college to groups promoting homosexual behavior as normal and even desirable. Remember there has not been a gay gene discovered so far. Then when gays get rights in other countries they tend to suppress and even make illegal any discourse to the contrary, even in England and Canada. And it's showing up in the USA now too. a few of those stories are reported in mainstream media but most are not reported. Also note that 250 page book and the DVD Imentioned are not hate speech and are not hatefully written.

Fairness wrote on Jun 14, 2008 5:14 PM:This discussion today is not fair and balanced. Next week the reporters should report the names of local businesses and their owners who donate significant sums to pro-gay activist groups and the gay parade festivities. Then the rest of us can sit here all day boasting about how we aren’t going to patronize them any more. That would balance today’s comments wouldn't it?

Moral Issue wrote on Jun 14, 2008 5:17 PM:Every once in a while an issue is a MORAL ISSUE. This is one. This is not a benefits issue. This is not a civil rights issue. This is a moral issue.

This country was founded "one nation under God." This is a judeo-Christian society. This is one of the few times where the poltical issue crosses the line to the moral side.

Jerimiah wrote on Jun 14, 2008 5:46 PM:All we hear is about "gay rights". As I remember my wedding vows, there was nothing said about "rights", but it was about duty and obligation to one another. As far back as Aristotle, he stated that a man and woman creating a family is the basis for all society.

Silly comments..... wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:18 PM:It is a given that there are many heterosexuals that can't have children. It's also a given that a homosexual union will never produce children. I only have one question...If your mom and dad had chosen girl/girl and boy/boy unions, would you be blogging today?

To Sleeping But Awake wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:23 PM:Do you think for one minute that a few (hundred even)homosexual car buyers are going to cause Hoehn Motors or any other sponsor any sleepless nights? Wow you homosexuals and supporters are full of yourselvs arn't you?!?!?!?!

Me wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:26 PM:the only reason that gay marriage is an issue is because religion says that homosexuals are immoral and bad, I'm pretty sure that any law establishing religion is unconstitutional, and that is what making gay marriage illegal is, unconstitiuional.

Roberto wrote on Jun 14, 2008 6:37 PM:Give it up peeps...Gay people can have marriage and pay taxes like everyone else. I think this issue will die lickity split. The only one who should be concerned is the two people in the contract.

Steve wrote on Jun 14, 2008 9:49 PM:All these individuals will now receive hate mail.

The gay interest groups will now target them like theve've done to other who dissagree with their immoral way of life.

Kyla wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:31 PM:I wished I lived in California so I could help out, and I certainly would buy a car from Mr. Hoehn if I was in the state!!
I can't vote for the initiative but I sure will send money to help out!!
Stand up Californians for traditional values and common sense! You need not be intimidated by the very vocal and demanding minority that loves media play and will do anything to shove so-called gay marriage down your throat.

Kyla wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:35 PM:"Discrimination" poster is right--singles should get benefits if same sex couples do under the new umbrella of "marriage"--their variety of course. You know, that's what it comes down to---money, bennies, and all the perks.

Pat wrote on Jun 14, 2008 10:39 PM:Interesting story. Mr. Walker left out the names and occupations/jobs of the people making the largest contributions opposing this initiative so we can give them due consideration. Was this an oversight?

volvo wrote on Jun 15, 2008 1:59 AM:Ya know its funny, im reading all this and well people are making good point's but will someone please tell me when the Gay's Right's trumped my own? i can say this because my vote to not allow gay marriage was overruled by my goverment because the Gay's said it wasnt right. hummmm seems to me it doesnt matter weather people like it or not, they think they are above the other's in this state, now this is why i will be at the poll's in November voting AGAINST GAY MARRIAGE just because you have thrown it in my face way to many time's. It no longer matter's weather i think its right or wrong. Vote on this one to protect your voting right's again our judge's

Homo Phobes wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:08 AM:Homo Phobes? The truth is that you are afraid of God. You have Christ Phobe. It is so foolish. Jesus Christ died to save you. Yet, you choose to live in lust and fornication. In the end, you will destroy yourself and spend eternity wailing and nashing your teeth over your foolish choices in this life. Why not allow God to help you before it is too late?

Hate wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:10 AM:It is you that hate not the Christians. You already stand condemned before a holy, and righteous God. Christians are only trying to warn you and turn you from your self-destructive path you are on.

Right wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:12 AM:Since when do criminals have rights? Criminals lose all rights as a citizen. Sodomy has been on the law books since this country began and still is in many states. Just because you manage to change the laws does not make it right. In the end you will stand before a holy and righteous God you will have to give an account to. Please repent before it is too late for you.

God bless these men wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:16 AM:God bless these mens for taking a stand for righteousness. Sen. Hollingsworth will get my vote! Mr. Hoehn's business will be sought out by those who appreciate what he did. God bless these men.

May God have mercy wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:20 AM:May God have mercy on our country. It is obvious reading these blogs that people do not know what the founding father of this country stood for. It is obvious that they do not know or care what God has to say on the subject. This country is in a sad state of affairs and is ripe for judgement. We are already experiencing judgement in our economy and health and wars.
All this will only serve to speed up God's judgment of America.

Dave wrote on Jun 15, 2008 8:06 AM:So by McKenna's logic (such as it is), should sterile couples or those who choose not to have children should not be allowed to marry as well?

Mojave Jim wrote on Jun 15, 2008 8:08 AM:The worst part of this gay marriage thing is that we will now be treated to having to watch two men kiss on all the TV news programs. Frankly it turns my stomach.

wow wrote on Jun 15, 2008 8:49 AM:did ya ever think maybe God doesn't even care bout this?? It's a TEST. hmmm

To Wow wrote on Jun 15, 2008 8:59 AM:God does care! You obviously do not read His word or you would know that a loving God that sent His son to die for you does care very much! Just as we have traffic laws to protect us when we are on the highway, God has do's and don'ts to protect us on the highway of life. Read His word and know his love for you and experience fellowship with your Creator.

So Cal Native wrote on Jun 15, 2008 9:08 AM:I am so glad to hear this happening. Gays already have the rights married people do by the civil unions. All they are doing is thinking about themselves and not the children that will be effected because, they will want to adopt. This must be stopped to protect the children from their lifestyles. God didn't make Adam & Adam, he made Adam & Eve. Who is the hubby and whom is the wiffey? I feel sorry the poor kids already affected by them! My mommy is MAN.

Philip wrote on Jun 15, 2008 9:12 AM:Do the Hoehn dealerships really think their public support of bigotry and hatred will win them new customers? What a foolish move. I just want the Hoehn dealerships to know that my partner and I were just about to buy two new cars from them. I am so glad to know of their support of hatred prior to our purchases. They have just lost a $100,000 cash sale and that is just our household. I urge the gay community to boycott these dealerships as well. I refuse to give my money to businesses who will take my money to support an ammendment which denies me my rights to marry who I want. Stay out of my business and I will certainly stay out of yours!

Why Marriage wrote on Jun 15, 2008 9:23 AM:Why can't they call it something else??
The word "Marriage" is for a man and woman. "insert word here" is for gay people.

to philip wrote on Jun 15, 2008 9:58 AM:There are MANY more conservative, God fearing and respectable people who will patronize Mr. Hoehn's dealership. Your pathetic little boycott will not impact him in the least. I hope that you will realize soon, before it is too late, how much God loves you and wants you to give your life to Him, and be free from the sin that enslaves you.

Bubba wrote on Jun 15, 2008 10:12 AM:People should have the right to marry sheep! Equal rights for sheepherders! Ww have suffered tremendous emotional pain for centuries. Please stop dicriminating against us.

Alf wrote on Jun 15, 2008 10:39 AM:Well, "Bubba" at 10:12AM, at least your "handle" and attidude are of like kind, both ludicrous. Regards, Alf.

Alf wrote on Jun 15, 2008 10:47 AM:Well, "Why Marriage" at 9:23AM, the answer is that no other name has EXACTLY the same legal status, legal rights, legal responsibilities and interstate recognition. Until there is something else that DOES convey EXACTLY the same legal status, legal rights, legal responsibilities and interstate recognition, the push and debate will continue. Regards, Alf.

Equality wrote on Jun 15, 2008 12:13 PM:Let me play God for a minute here. 1st I have man evolve from monkeys & then I instill sexuality at birth, some are hetero some are Gay, some are born with male & female genitalia ( I couldn`t makeup my mind so I said what the hell) I`m a loving God & even though I made you gay I`m going to hate you to hell for it. If you believe this you need to wake up to reality. You can`t believe everything you read including the bible. As a Hetero American male I believe we all should have the same rights no matter what our skin color, gender, religious beliefs or sexual orietation may be. If you don`t agree then I don`t believe in you.

Cal wrote on Jun 15, 2008 1:27 PM:I completely agree with Mojave Jim. It really turns my stomach to see men in love and kissing. I would much rather see floods, earthquakes and the carnage from suicide bombers when I relax and watch the TV news.

Im sure glad wrote on Jun 15, 2008 1:56 PM:they published the names of the people who are bankrolling the initiative. We have just announced that our entire neighborhood will NOT be purchasing autos from Hoehn EVER EVER. Please do the same. We dont need to give our hard earned money to bigots and discriminators. Shame on Hoehn. Im so glad to know They dont want my sale. I can go elsewhere now where They will appreciate my purchase.

to ALF wrote on Jun 15, 2008 2:43 PM:RE: 10:39PM, And ALF is such a leap up the ladder!

To Cal wrote on Jun 15, 2008 2:45 PM:Wish Granted!!

To Im sure glad wrote on Jun 15, 2008 2:48 PM:If I were a theft or murderer would you say I am being discriminated against? Obviously not. Sodomy is a crime according to God's law. And for good reason. Sodomy is a sad, self-defeating life style. God wants to set you free from your enslavement to lust. Irregardless, Hoehn obviously is a man who stands for righteousness. I am sure he will not be influenced by losing a few bucks. As righteous Abraham refused reward from the king of Sodom, Hoehn does not need your help. God will bless him and his family!

Bryan wrote on Jun 15, 2008 4:52 PM:All this crap about Christians helping people make the "right" decisions is b.s. Your God allows everyone to make a choice. It's he who will make the ultimate decision in who goes wherever after this life. You Christians need to remember your verse: "It is by faith alone, not by works so that no one can boast..." It is a right for anyone to marry here, just like it was mentioned that someone marrying a different race was illegal. Move on and concern yourself with the issues that effect you. I'm straight and married, I will be voting for gays and lesbians to marry because they are just as equal as I am in this society.

to poster at wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:04 PM:I'm not gay and I don't believe in God. Keep your religion off of our bodies and your laws out of our pants.

John wrote on Jun 15, 2008 5:14 PM:Must be nice to have cash to spend on frivolity. Amazing what money can buy.

schmanctity wrote on Jun 15, 2008 6:22 PM:If you really believe in the sanctity of marriage, you should spend your time and money with your own spouse and your own family instead of dictating to the rest of us.

Human rights wrote on Jun 15, 2008 6:35 PM:We all are wired differently, But I know as a hetero male when myself & my bro`s were 15-16 yr`s all we thought about was the opposite sex & how they looked coming out of the pool in their designer swim wear Ah-la Phoebe Cates in Fast Times at Ridgemont High. That is just how those who are born gay feel about the same sex. Bigotry is wrong in any form.

Steve wrote on Jun 15, 2008 6:46 PM:If homosexuality was a choice, I don't think Rock Hudson or George Michael would've chosen that 'lifestyle'.... There's also pseudo-homosexuals, but they'll limit themselves to anything that doesn't move.

Alf wrote on Jun 15, 2008 7:02 PM:Well, "To Im sure glad" at 2:48PM, the laws of this land are not the Old Testament. The Constitution does not say "equal protection under the law as long as you comply with Old Testament rules". How perfect an example of the reason for separation of church and state you are. Regards, Alf.

Same Here Ron wrote on Jun 15, 2008 7:07 PM:I will now being going to another dealership for my car repairs and new car purchases. What a ridiculous bunch of phobic garbage. Looks as if this dealership news is sweeping ALL over the internet.

Look as if wrote on Jun 15, 2008 7:20 PM:Ill be removing my items from A-1 storage and storing them somewhere else. Thanks Casters for showing Your true colors also.

Re To Im gure glad wrote on Jun 15, 2008 7:35 PM:Thieves and murderers don't have the same rights because they are not law abiding. That type of argument is irrelevant to the subject at hand.

Sodomy is still a crime in some states, but most have overturned those archaic laws because regulating consensual acts in the privacy of someone's home is largely considered beyond the reach of proper law. This will continue more and more until it's no longer a law. I also believe that the majority of people have experienced sodomy in one form or another (anal or oral).

With regards to God's law. Here's a news flash for you. God doesn't rule our government and, therefore, has no more relevance to the discussion than your thieves and murderers idea. Aside from that, anyone who needs someone else to tell them it's wrong to kill, steal, lie or cheat has more problems than God could ever help them with anyway.

All that aside, if you are the believer in God that you seem to be then you should also know that judging others isn't your job ... it's His. How about you lead your life while you let everyone else lead theirs. God will sort it out when/if the time comes.

Ruby wrote on Jun 15, 2008 8:42 PM:Gay marriage is wrong and sickening! If you have to go that route to find happiness call it something else! Don't cheapen marriage just because our Governor needs to find a quick solution to his budget problems. He doesn't have to live here ... Can you just imagine the confusion this will cause our kids. It matters to me what happens in my State and God says it's wrong!

Paul wrote on Jun 15, 2008 9:46 PM:Well folks: This is interesting. Obviously there is a difference of opinion on this subject.
It looks like many of the pro-gay arguments are saying; "You are wrong, so shut up about it." This is the tip of an iceberg. In a number of countries when gays get some political power they convince the liberal politicians with their gay lobby groups to pass laws that it is illegal to say they are wrong or that they are doing wrong. In some locations they
have made it against the law for persons to say anything against the gay lifestyle. If that happened here
many of the persons who wrote in favor of the protect marriage amendment in this comment section could be arrested and charged with a hate crime, even in England and Canada. You may not believe this is happening, but I could list many names and cities where this is happening. A few of these cases are reported in news sites such as World Net Daily, and some in Onenewsnow. There are probably a lot more cases are reported in other publications.

Just Curious wrote on Jun 15, 2008 10:12 PM:Hey you guys! The article did not say the car DEALERSHIP donated money for the protect marriage amendment, it said the owner did, So you are going to punish the job security of all the dozens, perhaps hundreds of EMPLOYEES just because the owner wants to protect thousands of years of marriage tradition in many different cultures and religions. Am I to believe this is a typical "gay" response to a social debate? Besides when you go the other car dealer are you going to interview the owner about his political contributions, how about even the sales manager himself, I'd be surprised if many of you even met him personally. How about the salesman himself. Ask him if he is gay, then walk out if he says he is not gay?
This is crazy, buy your car where they give you a good price and good service.

Bill wrote on Jun 16, 2008 2:05 PM:The car DEALERSHIP owner is pretty clever, gays have a higher income on average and that dealership could get a lot more business. Were talking money here, not sexual orientation...and I hope Ruby has a kid that turns out gay, and if he ends up like Matthew Shepard will she be satisfied?