Vito wrote on Aug 10, 2008 1:26 AM:The reason columnist Richard Kirk was furious about the California judges' decision to deny parents the liberty of home-schooling their children was obvious: the public schools have proven to be a dismal failure. One need look no further than this newspaper for proof. The opinion pages are hideously skewed to the left: to wit the tiresome drivel of anti-Second Amendment advocates such as Joseph Grant.

Vito wrote on Aug 10, 2008 1:36 AM:Robert Green's words belie his hollow sentiments. Anybody who doubts the veracity of the Swiftboat veterans or believes the citations for valor that LJG Kerry wrote on his own behalf cannot begin to define the Republican Party, much less represent its interests. Read "Unfit for Command" if you reaaly want to know the truth.

Judge Jury and Executioner wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:01 AM:Merrill Brown win's the "tin foil hat award".
Granted, sometimes venting makes you feel better, but all he offered was vile. He notes, "I can't wait," and "I also can't wait" for some pretty horrible things to happen to people, and then seem to back off on your claims of some horrible, dread, illness is spilling over in China and certain to spread.

John Limpus wins the "I didn't think that through very well" award.

John paints a picture of the unacceptablity of windmills, and the cost of running cables. But in the next breath he says "Strategically located nuclear energy plants can provide all the energy at fractions of the cost..."

Evidently the electricity generated by new nuke plants, according to John, can be transmitted through thin air and a spared the expense of infrastructure needed for power transmission.

Richard Sauerheber wins the "I don't have a clue how the military works" award.

Although the header is written by editors and not by letter contributors themselves, anyone believing,"Our military supported invading Iraq, in part because they were told stories", doesn't understand what the military's duty is.

Members of the military swear to, among other things, "obey the orders of the President of the United States, and all officers appointed over [them].

No where does it ask the military to "support" anything. They are only bound to do their job.

And finally, William Ramsey wins the "Someone finally go one right" award when he concluded, "Why doesn't he [the governor]cut the pay of the nonworking people, namely the legislators?"

Court is in recess until late this morning when the rest of the letter writers will be tried.

E-comments will be judged in session late this afternoon.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:23 AM:I was just wondering how everyones tire pressure is today and if we are energy independent yet??? We must not amke Hussein, our savior, angry.

sdraoul wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:26 AM:Oil companies made 8.33% on their investment lat year. Microsoft and other computer companies made 14%. Pharmeceuticals made 18%.

Nonetheless, Barry Obama wants oil to be forced to pay a "windfall profits tax."

Obama is an idiot if he thinks oil is making too much money. Who pays to find oil, dig for it, pump it out, transport it to refineries, refine it, move it to market, truck it to gas stations and make it available to you and me. All this and they make money at 8.3%.

Obama simply doesn't know what he is talking about.

Even Bill Clinton argues that no one is ready to be president, especially when he is asked if Obama is ready.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:29 AM:>>>Who knows if it might be brought back to the U.S.? Have a wonderful Olympics!>>> Well, Mr Brown, where were your protests during the selection process. You must know that the USOC is as corrupt as Pelosi, Reid and Hussein, and Peking was a pure money grab. China had grabbed $20 billion out of the Kyoto accords, and instead of cleaning the environment, they've built a fleet of nuclear submarines. Do you think the Chinese submaries in the Panama canal right now are offloading bananas??? Only the liberals think that

Ron wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:38 AM:I'm noticing the left is beginning to understand that we are winning in Iraq, the war is coming to a close, and that now we begin the long term work of maintaining, rebuilding, and making sure that Iraq remains a stable country. People like Richard Sauerheber
Realize this, so they are returning to describing Iraq as "the war that should have never been fought." It's really all they got left to complain about.
It's really too late for that, we broke it, we own it, as Colin Powell would say. And most grown up's agree, that if you break something, you have a responsibility to make it right.
So, what these bitter people are left with is complaining about a win, that they believe we should have never had. They will attempt to taint the win, because like all bitter people, it's all they really have to hold onto.
Sad really. Can't even happy for the Iraq's who can now walk down the streets without being kidnapped by Oday or Qusay to be raped, or killed, without cause.

But, it does strike me as odd, that the Left is now a believer in "picking one's self up by your own bootstraps.?"
We are literally lectured on and given day about how people struggle and need the government to help them, for without it, they might even die.
Well, what better example of our government helping? But not to the Left, they insist, NO they DEMAND the Iraqi's do they things without our help.
Ah, but that's where the selfishness begins. You see, to them, we should have never been doing those things THERE, but only HERE.
It gets back to what I described early on, as a type of racism towards Iraq's, because they so hated this war & GWB.
I think, they hate GWB so much, they are perfectly willing to sacrifice the Iraqi people. It's really a two pronged approach. One, they hate Geoerge Bush so much, he should be denied any victory, even if it cost the Iraqi people decades more killing. And two, All the money spend in Iraq, according to the Left would have been better spent here, on Americans.
Just listen to em, cause that's exactly what they are saying.
And in this one man's opinion, that makes them a sad excuse for a human being.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:42 AM:sdraoul is right. If Hussein is lected and doubles the tax on oil companies, guess what will happen to the price of gas - a small consequence the liberal air-heads havent thought of.
The other thing you might consider is Husseins proposal for one-time 15% grab of all the pension, 401-K and IRA's in this country

Political Cynic wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:02 AM:I nominate Richard Sauerheber as the spokesperson for Liberals everywhere, unless the County Medical Staff discovers his address and gets him back under control, first.

Everyone around him should wear masks like they do in China. Paranoia may be airborne, and it may be contagious.

There is just enough truth in his ravings that he sounds almost rational, but only if you believe that Bush/Chaney are so vile as to be anti-American and criminal, instead of just wrong.

The anti-Clinton crowd had a similar strain of Paranoia just a few years ago, mistaking error for criminality and ascribing the most base intentions to flawed individuals who were doing what they believed were in the best interest of the nation.

Only history will decide who is right, but in a nation almost equally divided on all issues it is hard to go too far wrong. It is only when there is so much unanimity as to silence all dissent that a nation can go completely wrong.

We are far from that.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:03 AM:Discount Tires is handing out free tire pressure guages with the purchase of 4 tires, if you have a Hussein or Obama bumber sticker on your bumper

Ron wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:04 AM:You know me, always looking for the next good investment that's going to make a pile of cash down the road.
Starting eyeballing this one company, First Solar. In 2007, on revenues
of $638 million, their Net income was $105 million, or about 16.5%. Not bad.
Certainly better than the return of Exxon-Mobil at 8.5%.
So, I'm looking at the company profile, and I see that they are expanding, and expansion is good, because it shows they have potential growth.
They've outsourced to Malaysia because they apparently have an RoHS problem with their facility in both the United States & Germany. RoHS, for those who don't know, is a toxic standard and a provision to move toward more non-toxic.
Anyways...
First Solar uses a substance: Cadmium telluride, very toxic to human beings in their thin film process.
Of course, I'm also looking at Nanosolar, not the same process, a little more expensive but safer process.
Plus, they've just risked $100 million in a new manufacturing facility in the Bay area.
Any thoughts?

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:18 AM:Well, "Ron" at 8:38AM, you say "if you break something, you have a responsibility to make it right".
If that's the way it is, then
WHY are people complaining that Iraq isn't doing their "share" with the proceeds from the sale of their oil?
You can't have it both ways,
EITHER we broke it so we fix it, with ALL, every single bit, of the financial responsibility that is entailed,
OR they are responsible to pay part of what WE SCREWED UP.
Will the people who are griping about Iraq not contributing enough get their collective acts together?
They and/or you can't have it both ways.
Regards, Alf.

Reardon wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:38 AM:To gain perspective, may I recommend an article in today's NCTimes section "Your Health" page H1, The Girl in the Window...

The article will never leave you, and make today's "News," particularly political news, seem worthless.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:41 AM:>>First Solar uses a substance: Cadmium telluride, very toxic to human beings in their thin film process>> In Oct '06 that stock was $24. It ran up to $317 in May and has now settled at $257, on low volume. I like stocks that correct on low volume, as it may indicates profit taking instead of a trend change, but who knows? As for what they do, who cares. Trade the trend and the volume (I guess, thats what my broker tells me)

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:47 AM:I see Iraq now wants a definite timetable for a US exit, so they can ranp up business with China. I have an absolute finite date- It will be that date that Iraq had paid the US, in oil, for every cent it has spent on the war, plus $250,000 for every soldier killed or wounded in Iraq

Tire Checker wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:48 AM:Chuck: A tire gauge is worthless without an Alf Recommended Tire Pressure Recommendation, which depends upon car make and model, tire make and model, driving habits, etc.

We hope that Alf will publish soon, but in the meanwhile you might post on-line and seek information.

Alternately, you could just for safety sake, temporarily look on you driver's side door jamb.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:53 AM:Insults, gotta love 'em.
"Judge Jury and Executioner" at 8:01AM with his
"tin foil hat award",
"I didn't think that through very well",
"I don't have a clue how the military works".
Then -
"sdraoul" at 8:26AM with his
"Obama is an idiot".
It's unusual that he has only one in any given post.
Amazingly -
"Chuck" at 8:29AM has none,
BUT WAIT -
"Chuck" at 8:42AM has -
"liberal air-heads".
The worst that "Ron" at 8:38AM had was -
"selfishness" and
"racism".
Meanwhile, the worst that "Political Cynic" at 9:02AM has is -
"ravings" and
"Paranoia".
You see, it is possible to discuss the subject without attacking the person, if you are willing to try just a little.
Regards, Alf

DD Wiz wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:12 AM:The published letter from John Limpus continue the almost daily repetitive repetitive mantra about nuclear that has been repeatedly debunked. People keep on bringing up how safe it is, but the fact remains that the private sector, the god of unregulated "free markets" so worshipped by the far right, does not support that conclusions.
How many times do I have to respond to these stubborn obstructionists who want to ram public money down our collective throats for the benefit of a few investors whose profits are guaranteed by government-enforced monopolies?
There are three issues these obstructionists continue to ignore:
Safety: Commercial insurance companies are in business to make money by insuring against manageable, predictable risks. Companies that produce solar and wind generating sources have no trouble getting normal commercial liability insurance. Yet not one private insurance company will insure nuclear plants, which have to operate under federal guarantees. When commercial companies agree that this is safe enough to profitably manage the risk, I'll be willing to listen to the safety issue.
Cost: Limpus claims that "can provide all the energy at fractions of the cost of other" energy sources, but that is only after the initial enormous costs for these behemoth plants, and NO electricity even begins to come online until the entire plant is operational. In contrast, solar, wind and other clean, renewable sources are cost-effective NOW, and begin to gradually come online as soon as implementation begins, as each on-site unit is completed.
Hazardous Waste: Aside from the safety issues are the FACT that nuclear generates huge mountains of waste that remain toxic for tens of thousands of years, and they have to be disposed of somewhere. The people of Nevada understandably don't want them at Yucca Mountain. Will nuclear supporters accept packages of toxic radioactive waste buried under their houses?
Peace (and sunshine) to all, DD Wiz

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:15 AM:>>>You see, it is possible to discuss the subject without attacking the person, if you are willing to try just a little.>>> Yea, but it takes all the fun (and truth) out of it.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:17 AM:Something that I said yesterday about the murder of an illegal alien bears repeating today -
"We, as civilized society, are supposed to deal with someone whose crime was being on the wrong side of a line on a map by putting them on the correct side of the line, not by murder."
Regards, Alf.

Political Cynic wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:24 AM:Please note that the paranoia was applied equally to Bush haters and Clinton haters, and by inference to Obama haters and McCain haters.

Political cynic is an Equal Opportunity cynic.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:30 AM:Well, "Tire Checker" at 9:48AM,
the "Alf Recommended Tire Pressure Recommendation" is -
are you ready for this?
The pressure that is on your door jamb or in your handbook for starters and then, just for the heck of it, add 2 or 3 p.s.i., if you are feeling frisky.
BUT, NEVER, EVER exceed the maximum pressure that is embossed on the sidewall of your tire.
Then see how evenly your tire wears.
Regards, Alf.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:35 AM:Um, "Chuck" at 9:47AM,
IF Iraq haq invited us to invade and occupy their country and then told us to leave, then they just might owe us something, maybe.
They did not,
so they do not.
Send the bill to GWB and The Cheney Branch.
Good luck trying to collect.
Regards, Alf.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 10:40 AM:Well, "Political Cynic" at 10:24AM,
so noted.
One must spread the joy, as it were.
Regards, Alf.

Objection your Honor wrote on Aug 10, 2008 11:06 AM:Judge Jury and Executioner
[-] wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:01 AM: Although the header is written by editors and not by letter contributors themselves...

Why do people continue to say this? I've been writing letters for years and nine times out of ten the header is exactly what I put in the subject line of the email.
Perhaps some contributors need to be a little more creative.

Judge Jury Executioner wrote on Aug 10, 2008 11:29 AM:Chuck (9:03am) is the winner of the "I am a bald faced liar, and if even I post it, and it appears on the net, it must be true" award:

I contacted Discount Tire, who Chuck claims,

"Discount Tires is handing out free tire pressure guages with the purchase of 4 tires, if you have a Hussein or Obama bumber sticker on your bumper,".

So, Chuck lies, you must decide!

Judge, Jury, and Executioner will continue to dispute the crap displayed here, without impunityy!

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 11:51 AM:I really enjoy playing golf, but I can't figure out how Tiger Woods can win the US Open with a broken leg, and a gentleman named Kenny Perry can withdraw from the PGA major because his contact lens scratched his eyeball??? I guess thats the difference between an athlete and a golfer??

jvc wrote on Aug 10, 2008 12:11 PM:Alf...what are you talking about?
We are suppose to be a Christian nation
with a biblical command of thou shall not kill,yet, we fry our monsters that
commit horrible crimes just for revenge...
a most unlike thing to do as a Christian nation!Forgiving Christian nation,indeed!

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 12:49 PM:Well, "jvc" at 12:11PM, two things -
I don't know about the revenge part, at least totally for revenge.
Do we reward murderers with free room and board for life?
OR Do we make sure that they never do it again?
(Hey, they can still murder in prison.)
Are we a "Christian" nation?
By the percentage of people who say they are Christian,
the answer is yes.
By the number, as a percent, of people who act in accordance with the teachings of Christ,
the answer is no.
Talking the talk is easy,
walking the talk is far more difficult for many.
Regards, Alf.

the girl in the window wrote on Aug 10, 2008 1:47 PM:If you cannot find Reardon Aug 10, 2008 9:38 AM report in NCTimes, please GOOGLE

Lane DeGregory the girl in the window st petersburg times

[this info is for those that cannot find the report in the NCTimes]

Very Extreme. NOT political.
This msg is from Reader R.

Paul wrote on Aug 10, 2008 2:50 PM:To DDWIZ, The only part of your argument I agree with is the disposal. The rest is inflamatory, created by politicians, and burecrats. But you have to agree (hey with your own argument) nuclear power is not "Finite Filthy Fossil Fuel" (you revise at your pleasure). And please, enjoy the sunshine provided by a nuclear fusion reaction from the sun.

Focl Point wrote on Aug 10, 2008 3:03 PM:Chuck[-] wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:47 AM:
Agree with you on this one except instead of $250,000.00 per deceased, it should be 3 million bucks.

stop hate wrote on Aug 10, 2008 3:06 PM:"Daphne wrote on Aug 9, 2008 6:54 PM:Thank you Alf for your comment. It is true that it is not a far leap from vandalism to murder. ..." I agree with most of Alf's and your blogs.

Your rational writing continues below. Thank You.

"I also detest the SDMM and Jeff Schwilk in particular. The day of reckoning will come and they and he will have to answer for all of his evil actions.

I desire secure borders and I want our immigration laws enforced but we can't become inhumane, and treat the illegal immigrants as if they are animals. I am disgusted by anyone who actually feels that Luis Ramirez got what he deserved.

Tom Metzger was held responsible when his group of skin heads murdered Mulugeta Seraw.

It is never okay to hurt, injury, vandalize, and certainly not murder anyone just because you think they don't belong here. Intolerance is a violent mindset. ..."

Unfortunately the PARENTS very often teach their children to hate. Because their PARENTS taught them to hate. Because the Leader of the House of Worship taught them to hate.

Wanted to quote a song from South Pacific. Amazed that we (2008) are not much better off tolerance-wise than the opening year of South Pacific (1949).

Background info found:
"South Pacific is a musical, with music by Richard Rodgers, lyrics by Oscar Hammerstein II, and book by both Hammerstein and Joshua Logan.

The story is based on two short stories by James A. Michener from his Pulitzer Prize-winning 1948 book, Tales of the South Pacific.

The musical won the Pulitzer Prize for Drama in 1950. The issue of racial prejudice was sensitively and candidly explored, particularly for a 1949 stage work."

Focal Point wrote on Aug 10, 2008 3:06 PM:jvc[-] wrote on Aug 10, 2008 12:11 PM:
The Untied States of America has no established religion. There are Americans who profess Christianity. That does not make this a Christian nation.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 3:20 PM:>>biblical command of thou shall not kill,yet, we fry our monsters that
commit horrible crimes just for revenge...
a most unlike thing to do as a Christian nation!Forgiving Christian nation,indeed>>> Gee, I wonder why you didnt use abortion on demand as your arguement???? Well, I really do know.

Alf wrote on Aug 10, 2008 5:03 PM:Well, "Focl Point" at 3:03PM, if my buddies and I go into your house, destroy some of your things, kill a few of your relatives and one of us gets hurt or killed in the process-
Are you saying that you should pay me for the damage to my buddy?
Are you saying that you should pay me to fix those things of yours that I broke?
Wasn't it just a few months ago, and even a few days ago, that one of the many excuses for why we are still there is to "fix what we broke"?
As far as I know, Iraq never asked us to invade their country.
I do not, did not and will continue not to support the proposition that we had any business going to Iraq or that Iraq owes us anything except a swift kick in the pants to get the hell out of their country.
I find the mere idea that "they (Iraq) owe us" anything to be absolutely repugnant.
We have no right, NONE AT ALL, to mess with another country's government unless we are in imminent mortal danger from that country -
AND Iraq was not even close to being a threat no matter what GWB said.
Regards, Alf.

TFB wrote on Aug 10, 2008 5:14 PM:Chuck at 3:20 p.m. refers to another blogger's reference to the Biblical injunction "Thou shalt not kill" and asks why the blogger did not mention abortion.
Um, Chuckie, it's because it was referring to killing a human person, not a clump of cells occupying the most private part of another person's body *IF* she decides she wants it there (which have NONE of the actual attriubtes of a human person but have the potential to develop into one *IF* a number of conditions get satisfied - compare the relationship of an acorn to an oak, or a set of blueprints to a house).

Apollo wrote on Aug 10, 2008 5:55 PM:Re: The Girl in the Window (1:47 p.m.)
For those unable to find the NCT article (reprinted from the St. Petersburg Times, therefore not on the NCT website), it is on page H-1 (Health) of this morning's Sunday NCT.

I agree with the writer (hello, Reardon), that it is extreme and moving.
I disagree that it is "NOT political."
"Politics" is from the same root word as "policy" and refers to public policies.

The tragedy of this moving story shows what happens when we have a public policy that cuts out social services, channels funding into "law and order" and ends up with police officers as the first line of defense in matters of child welfare and safety.
Solutions are to PREVENT problems, not just react to them.
This is the difference between liberals and conservatives.

Sorry, Reardon, it is not just the haunting tragedy of one little girl.
It is the failure of modern conservative public policy.
Thank you for bringing it to our attention.

Chuck wrote on Aug 10, 2008 6:26 PM:>>>That does not make this a Christian nation.>>>>There are Muslims, too and that doesnt make us a Muslim nation. There are global warming worshippers too, that doesnt make up a global warming nation. Both of the above are to the disgust of liberals

DD Wiz wrote on Aug 10, 2008 6:29 PM:The post from "Paul" (2:50pm) is correct that nuclear energy is not "FINITE FILTHY FOSSIL FUEL," nor did I say it was.
I identified specific problems regarding nuclear in my post at 10:12am this morning.
"Paul" calls my points "inflammatory" but does not actually say why any of them is wrong.
He does not address the issue of cost that I raised regarding the expense of constructing huge plants that take years to come online, with no energy generated until they do, nor the issue of safety -- I note he didn't tell us which private insurance carrier will agree to provide coverage -- but did concede the issue of hazardous waste, though he did not explain why this should not be a deal-killer when we have clean, renewable alternatives that can be brought on line much faster.

As for the "sunshine provided by a nuclear fusion reaction from the sun" -- yes, that is how I want my nuclear energy: produced 93 million miles away with no hazardous waste on earth.
Peace (and sunshine) to all, DD Wiz

Nick wrote on Aug 10, 2008 6:31 PM:I have to agree with your post "Paul" about "The Whizzers" rant about nuclear energy.
You see, that's one of the funny things about LIberal Dems.
-They want the price of gas to go down, but they want to tax the oil companies.
-They want the price of gas to go down, but they oppose any new drilling.
-They want alternatives to oil, but they oppose any new nuclear power plants.
-They want to socialize Medical Care like the Socialist European Countries they so admire.
Funny, the medical coverage in those European Countries is so wonderful to these Liberal Dems, but the nuclear energy that most of them use isn't good enough for them...lol.

You see, Liberal Dems only want you to have the things that THEY approve of. They would love it if we could all live in a Government sponsered, nanny welfare state that runs on wind and solar power. Oh yeah, and you can forget about any fresh water from up North of from the ocean, the fishies are far more important.
Have you hugged a Liberal Dem today and thanked them for looking out for your best interests?
Cheers, Nick.

stop hate part wrote on Aug 10, 2008 6:45 PM:"YOU'VE GOT TO BE CAREFULLY TAUGHT."

""The birth of prejudice lies in teaching"

15 January 2008

You've got to be taught before it's too late,
Before you are six or seven or eight,
To hate all the people your relatives hate,
You've got to be carefully taught!

So sang Lieutenant Cable in the Rodgers and Hammerstein Musical South Pacific, neatly compressing for an earlier generation the argument that racism is not something you are born with, but something you learn.

And if racism can be taught, then it follows that it can be un-taught. Accordingly, many schools across the US nowadays use various anti-racism curricula. But very few of these programs have undergone rigorous evaluations, so their worth remains unknown."

[For an unexpected sidelight on the song “You’ve Got to Be Carefully Taught” and the politics of race in Rodgers and Hammerstein’s musical South Pacific, see the essay of that name by Andrea Most in Theatre Journal, 2000, Volume 52, Number 3, pp307–337.

She writes: “During a touring production of the show in Atlanta in 1953, the song again raised hackles, this time offending some Georgia legislators who introduced a bill to outlaw entertainment having, as they stated, 'an underlying philosophy inspired by Moscow.'

State Representative David C. Jones claimed that a song justifying interracial marriage was implicitly a threat to the American way of life."

She also quotes Hammerstein's retort: "I am most anxious to make the point not only that prejudice exists and is a problem, but that its birth lies in teaching and not in the fallacious belief that there are basic biological and physiological and mental differences between races”.]

Karl wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:11 PM:Alf @ 9:53 AM, I'm on the same page with you Alf. It's kind of like the courage one gets when behind the wheel of a car, anonymous courage backed up someone surrounded in a steel fortress. The only way that some (bloggers and drivers) can muster up enough courage to name call or flip the bird is if they are totally anonymous.

SOLONG
Peace Please

Karl wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:20 PM:"You see, Liberal Dems only want you to have the things that THEY approve of." Right on Nick but you should have included the Republicans (not Conservatives) of the last seven years also. They my friens are just as guilty if not more.

Peace Pipe to All

Focal Point wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:40 PM:Alf[-] wrote on Aug 10, 2008 5:03 PM: Tsk Tsk Alf. Address your comments and questions to Chuck, the author of the original post. You know my opinion from my previous posts about Iraq. My point is that if you are going to extort a nation or government for a timetable then you should go for the big bucks for compensation.

Focal Point wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:48 PM:Ron: I am an independent and centrist. I agree with the left about the Iraq war.
The liberals or left do not complain about the win and bringing the Iraqi War to a close. I and they are all for it. What we object to is the amost 4200 American dead, over 30,000 wounded and billions down the toilet for a war that should have never been fought. In my opinion, the right tends to say forgot about all the deaths, wounded and spent treasure. We won. We won. Gleefull shouts of victory do not excuse those culpable for the war regardless of party affiliation.

Reardon wrote on Aug 10, 2008 8:58 PM:APOLLO: I suppose that every ill and sin in the Western World could be cured with more money for social services in your opinion, and that makes this tragedy "political" in your view.

And, in some ways this could be mitigated by placing a social worker in every home with "at risk" children, and a policeman in every home with real and potential felons, but that is not a society either of us wish.

Perhaps that is a step too far. It is not a society I wish.

Society tries to balance its needs -- protection, fire, roads, social ser vices -- with the need not to kill that goose that lays the Golden Eggs of taxes. It is a delicate balance, and some pot-holes remain in the roads, some crime still exists, some homes still burn and some children drop through the cracks.

Your blaming a lack of social service money for any single case -- particularly the child of a 77 IQ mother -- defines your priorities, not societies.

There will never be enough money to solve every problem, but you are free to send every dime you have to whatever cause you believe in. There is no law against their accepting the money, and if you believe they are underfunded, write a check.

Please write back and tell us you have sent every dime in all of your bank accounts and I will be the first to stand and applaud!

Apollo wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:23 PM:Re: Reardon (8:58 p.m.)
As usual, Reardon, you are the perfect example of extremism in conservatism.
Your view on meeting social services is the same as you have repeatedly espoused on energy:
If you can't solve the whole thing 100% then you shouldn't do anything at all.

No, Reardon, we will never solve all the problems. But year after year of cutting back services that prevent problems and diverting them to those who respond reactively to the problems that could have been prevented, and you end up with social services being provided by police officers. God bless 'em, they are the ones who are there, but they shouldn't be the ones to have roles thrust on them that they aren't prepared for.

The failures of conservatives on Katrina, which was the 3rd largest natural disaster in the history of this nation - a national catastrophe, not a local matter - is the same manifestation of the abrogation of public administration of public issues.

People like you, Reardon, seek to run away from accepting responsibility for the consequences of your hateful, malicious, selfish ideology, and then you expect us to be moved (as we, in fact, are) when you remind us of the tragic, haunting consequences of what your ideology has bequeathed.

To Merrill wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:41 PM:It's actually pretty easy Merrill. If you don't want to breathe the polluted air or swim in the contaminated waters of China - DON'T GO to the olympics! No one is forcing you to do anything and you are free to do as you wish so stop whining!

Nick wrote on Aug 10, 2008 9:43 PM:My apologies "Karl". My rant was more in response to "The Whizzer's" diatribe and picking on The Dems more than anything(I rather enjoy it). Let me see if I can make it right.
All you lousy Republicans who have been marching in step with the fool GWB and are actually thinking of voting for McIdiot are just as much to blame as anyone. Pouring money into the abortion in Iraq that we don't have and need to borrow from the Chinese. The only thing more foolish than voting for McIdiot would be voting for Obama, the man doens't even have a full term in The Senate under his belt and not the foggiest clue how to actually implement and fulfill his hollow promises and ideas.

Hows that "Karl"?

The Campaign for Liberty!
Cheers, Nick.

Karl wrote on Aug 11, 2008 7:29 AM:You never have to apologize to me Nick (at least not yet). Most of your posts are right on the money including both today. I knew where you were coming from, just trying to add my 2 cents.

Keep on keepin' on Nick

Peace

Alf wrote on Aug 11, 2008 9:04 AM:Well, "Focal Point" at 8:40PM,
you said "My point is that if you are going to extort a nation or government for a timetable then you should go for the big bucks for compensation.".
I'm shaking my head because, if I understand that sentence correctly, we are extorting Iraq by demanding compensation for our outlay.
Unless I am missing something here, that sounds like the old mob "insurance" or "protection" racket, I come in, do damage to your store and demand "insurance" to keep me from doing it again. If you're lucky, for an additional "fee", I'll "protect" you from others as well.
If that's what you meant, then you chose the perfect word, "extort".
Regards, Alf.

Focal Point wrote on Aug 11, 2008 10:01 AM:Alf
[-] wrote on Aug 11, 2008 9:04 AM:
Absolutly correct. There are bigger and badder things going on here that are just coming to the front. I suggest the Bush/Cheny have been planning a major insertion of American power into the Middle East. The real target is Iran. That is why Bush and his crowd want 57 bases in IRaq and a long term states of forces agreement in Iraq. They have been extorting this during the negociations and have a heavy hand since our armed forces are in the country. The Iraqis are being braver as times passes. We need to understand negociating about the Middle Easterns. They know how to bargain and to negociate. Interesting to see what happens when the UN mandate expires and there isn't any agareement or status of forces agreement. What will Johnnie McCain say then?

Alf wrote on Aug 11, 2008 11:56 AM:Wanna bet, "Focal Point" at 10:01AM, that it'll be "Stay the course"?
Then there is that nasty NSPD 51 to worry about.
Regards, Alf.

oscar wrote on Aug 11, 2008 2:07 PM:More students from Palomar College have now been killed in Iraq than all students lost in the entire 10 year Vietnam War. Just visit the memorial at the school if you want their names. Most servicemen understand that military code allows one to disobey any order considered in error, but with the proviso he could be courtmartialed to get to the bottom of it. It's his risk. In the Navy there have been several mutineers that were tried and found to be justified. But the point is that most of our military were told lies about who they were fighting and this explains why only a few obejcted. Pat Tillman was one, who demanded to be transferred form Iraq to Afghanistan, where he was killed by members of his own unit. In Vietnam the Medina-Calley situation comes to mind, where anyone who would have objected to killing civilians intentionally would have been exonerated for disobeying such orders. The problem comes when the original orders given by the highest commander were themselves lies, like Cheney's claim "9/11 is the work of Hussein" and Hussein can mount an attack on the U.S. East Coast and has mass weapons to do so, and the anthrax attacks on senators Daschle and Leahy were from Iraq, etc.

oscar wrote on Aug 11, 2008 2:44 PM:Articles 90, 91, and 92 in the uniform code of military justice require the obedience of LAWFUL orders from the President and superior officers. An order which is UNlawful that is obeyed can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts hold that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders if the order was illegal. The United States is not in a Coengressionally declared war against Iraq and it is prudent for all in the military to carefully consider every order they're given. In Vietnam the same circumstancse occurred and vast numbers of trials took place for servicemen who believed they were 'just following orders'. This is not fun and games here. When Bush altered intelligence documents, authorized torture, and spread the rumor that anthrax attacks were the fault of Hussein to start a war, even though it was altruistic and was his belief he was helping the country, this makes the Iraq conflict not an invasion based on self defence and is thus possibly subject to future investigation.