cbad wrote on Oct 15, 2008 6:49 PM:The Westfield owners are going to get what they deserve. For years they have remodled their other malls always overlooking Plaza Camino Real. Plaza Camino Real is an embarrassment to our community. I hope the Pavillion comes in big with the high end stores that North County deserves.

Grump wrote on Oct 15, 2008 6:49 PM:We already have a Target and Best Buy, both modern and nice. The last thing we need is more concrete and blacktop, besides I thought the economy sucked.

Bus Rider wrote on Oct 15, 2008 7:23 PM:For years Westfield Mall has dissed bus riders by not having restroom facilities and imposing hardships on riders who frequent their mall, treating them as second class citizens. Too, they are afraid that a mall in northern Oceanside will service the Marine Corps better than they can.

Umm.. wrote on Oct 15, 2008 7:30 PM:The Heck with Westfield! let those carpetbaggers go weep. Plaza Camino Real is a dump anymore. Poor babies. Whats really ironic is the original developer of PCR wanted to place it at this site and instead we got the Drive-Inn's in Oceanside because Carlsbad gave them incentives to build over there. A small part of the mall is actually on City of Oceanside owned land too, thats what they have been trying to get annexed into Carlsbad so they can build housing around the mall. As if we need more houses. Let 'em suffer.

WELCOME PAVILLION wrote on Oct 15, 2008 7:39 PM:Are you kidding me? It seems like the Plaza Camino Real Mall gets dumpier every year. They can't even get a nice tenant for the old Robinsons-May anchor. The owners should spend more time taking care of their own mall rather than worrying about the "flawed analysis" of some competition.
I look forward to a nice, updated local place to take my family.

Good for Westfield wrote on Oct 15, 2008 8:12 PM:What this is about is that the City of Carlsbad wants to place the Westfield Mall into a "redevelopment" area where they can take the property and build high density housing on the property. The land owner is doing everything in their power to keep the city from taking their property through eminent domain. Carlsbad needs to build a certain amount of affordable housing units, and they would LOVE to fill Oceanside's northern border with it; both here and at the Quarry Creek site. Get ready Oceanside, here it comes...another stick in the eye with a sharp stick from C-town. Westfield would like to keep their property as commercial property NOT residential. Fight em Westfield! Do whatever it takes to keep the area from becoming every square inch of housing. We don't need C-town's low income housing impacts.

oside mom wrote on Oct 15, 2008 8:21 PM:that Plaza has a high crime rate, which they don't have to report because they are a private entity. I am not comfortable taking my kids there - too many gangs of kids dropped off by their parents to "mall-crawl" unsupervised. I know of kids who have been attacked by these kids. Mall security is a joke, and the Carlsbad police dept. seems to have limited authority there.

I'm all for something new. If it's successful, hopefully it will raise the Oceanside tax base.

fashion valley simon mall shopper wrote on Oct 15, 2008 9:01 PM:plaza camino real is just plain nasty and awful and does not reflect the community. why should north county residents have to travel to fashion valley to shop. westfield, if you are so concerned perhaps you should look in the mirror. plaza camino real is gross and no shopper in their right mind would shop there.

jvc wrote on Oct 15, 2008 9:13 PM:Enough traffic already!The environmental
fault or impact is toward humans by heavy traffic
by humans!

Wow wrote on Oct 15, 2008 9:38 PM:Westfield Carlsbad challenging the Oceanside environmental document. Just wait until the environmental document is issued on the proposed Westfield expansion of the Escondido Mall. I would just love to see Oceanside challenge the adequacy of their document. Turnaround is fair play.

David wrote on Oct 15, 2008 10:27 PM:Grump - "The last thing we need is more concrete and blacktop"

Yes, because an old, worn down, defunct drive-in - which, if I recall, is a bunch of concrete and blacktop - is *so* much better than retail establishments that actual bring jobs into the community.

David wrote on Oct 15, 2008 10:29 PM:I'm sure that Westfield is challenging the environmental document for the good of the community.

A little bit of a conflict of interest Westfeld?

If there's truly a flawed environmental report, how about an environmental group step forward and challenge this, and not a competitor.

To Grump wrote on Oct 16, 2008 12:24 AM:Grump must be a Jim Wood-Esther Sanchez supporter; opposing a mall in Oceanside. They oppose everything and send our tax dollars to Carlsbad.

How about wrote on Oct 16, 2008 12:33 AM:A Huge GREEN PALACE...
A science center built with all the green technologies...

Stop with the Retail, We have Plenty...to shop from.

I would rather enjoy having a place for the kids to learn, instead of teaching them to buy, buy buy,....and look at our countries way of life now.

Can't make the house payments,,,,but hey they have the newest phones, and 100 plus cell phone bills, and don't forget teh 70 dollar knock off purse...

Can't anyone in Oceanside think outside the BOX and for the future??????????

JimRT wrote on Oct 16, 2008 5:53 AM:If Westfield does not want it built, then, then we should build it even bigger.

FTM wrote on Oct 16, 2008 6:37 AM:Westfield's next step is going to be trying to organize a "grass roots" effort to create a protest against the mall. Westfield will pay a political organazation and thier constituency to file protest.

This action will smoke out the real criminals in North County - WHO WILL TAKE THE MONEY? I can't wait to find out what North County Political Organazation is crooked enough to take Westfields money and protest this.

Whoever it becomes - we will then know to NEVER trust that organazation ever again in the future.

Follow the Money.

Hmmm wrote on Oct 16, 2008 6:39 AM:I'd have to agree with "cbad" that ECM has been neglected for years. It's no wonder they can't seem to retain tenants.

My only concern with the Pavillion is whether the move will result in the closure of the existing Best Buy location on Vista Way. Also, I know many in the 76/Mission corridor were hoping to have Costco bring another location; I suppose this fell through?

Cmon Westfield wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:26 AM:Healthy competition is good. Besides the way this country is going if you run into trouble you will get a bail out!

resident wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:37 AM:Craig,whats with that first sentence?
is this an editorial? If it is,its in the wrong section.

FTM wrote on Oct 16, 2008 8:27 AM:Everytime i predict someone is going to do somthing the stupid NCT deletes my statement.
I predicted Silva would be the one to go to jail and the officer would get off in that SDPD shooting on the first day and NCT never showed my statement.
I predicted one of the Carlsbad Car Dealers was behind the lawsuits against Oceanside's billboard ban - and NCT would not print that.
Now I predict that Westfield is going to organaize a grass roots political effort against the Oceanside Mall and they will not let you in on that!

Wanna know why?

They don't want you to think for yourself! They want you to think whatever they TELL you! They WANT to mae hay with this mall thing because they sell more papers! ALSO-where do you think the westfield mall shops do a lot of thier advertizing??

NCT's needs to come clean when it comes to reporting on stories that involve thier advertizers. Our news is getting edited based on WHO is a potential customer for the NCT's.

NCT - Please proove me wrong.

Follow the Money.

PhD in Shopping wrote on Oct 16, 2008 8:53 AM:It seems the only stores in Westfield Carlsbad now are shoes, jewelry and sportswear. What a boring place. They can't even keep all the escalators running. Even the food choices are limited. Ever hear of a food court like UTC's? They are surely not the ones to tell Oceanside what we can do. They are SO out of touch with their (former) customers. What a horrid mall since Westfield took over.

funny wrote on Oct 16, 2008 8:53 AM:that camino real property would be a nice place for another golf course don't ya think carlsbad?

Richard wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:25 AM:Hopefully, Westfield will do a complete tear down and re-build to compete with the planned center in Oceanside. Why hasn't PCR been remodeled? It's dark and dumpy. They dont even take care of the outside of the buildings. The place is a community eyesore. if the mall closes, maybe Macy's, Pennys and Sears can come to the Oceanside center

DW Martin wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:26 AM:The way Plaza Camino Real was designed reflected 1960's out-dated ideals...in other words, the mall's design reflects the sprawling way developers built back then. Giant black top parking lots, bigger than necessary anchor stores, and no real thought to the flow of pedestrian traffic.
This design can also be seen in UTC and the Mission Valley mall (other Westfield properties) which the developer has similar plans. Specifically, Westfield wants to invest $900 million in UTC and $500 million in MV. The new design will not only provide a more walkable environment, but it will include a residential component. The sea of asphalt will be replaced with more public plazas and open space, as well as additional development. Parking will be provided by new parking structures.
This "new" way of redesigning malls as more livable spaces is the latest and greatest commercial trend...

John from Vista wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:28 AM:Hey! Where will we have the swap meet -- that's jobs, ain't it?

The Dirve-in should either be a Drive-in or be gone -- it sucks now.

PCR really is a pit. Have you been inside some of the lower level stores when it rains? Leaks like a sieve. As noted, Westfield has done little to improve the place. Maybe a nearby competitor will make it better for all.

Supporting How About wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:39 AM:I agree with How About. Does anyone really think another mall is going to do anything positive for our community? There are vacancies all over the place, so even with the current out-of-control spending, consume at all costs, mindset of most people, there still isn't enough money being spent (borrowed?) to support what is already there. And, consumer retail spending just took another huge nosedive for September!

Sure, get rid of the drive in. No question a dump at best (although I have fond memories of going there in high school to "watch a movie"). But to replace it with something that will just lead to 1) More vacant commercial buildings around town and 2) Encouraging parents to put another pair of shoes on the credit card, just seems a little...I don't know...wrong maybe?

oceanside man wrote on Oct 16, 2008 10:01 AM:Westfield is in carlsbad not oceanside.Westfield should use the time and money and make that mall look good. leave oceanside alone. look at the malls in LA, PALMDESERT, ORANGE COUNTY AND SAN DIEGO. our mall sucks. ......
COME ON WESTFIELD STEEP UP.....

La Costa Jay wrote on Oct 16, 2008 11:12 AM:The Westfield Mall is a dump. Bring on the competion to force Westfield to either remodel or sell PCR who will do so. North County residents are really getting the shaft from Westfield remodeling its other malls at the expense of Cbad and Oside.

Osider wrote on Oct 16, 2008 11:18 AM:I sure the planning commission has made this project go green. Every building now a days is built with the green mentality and so should this. I know our planning commission doesn't even think along these lines. Wake up Oside Planning Commission, we want our buildings to be green and if you dont know what that means, you shouldn't be working there. Qaulcomm is a perfect example with all of their building being built green with solar power, lighting and many other aspects of enviromental issues at the forefront.

Lee wrote on Oct 16, 2008 11:18 AM:The way the economy is going it isnt going to matter who gets into the new Pavillion center. No one will have the money to buy retail hence no one will be able to survive their rents.

No Grump wrote on Oct 16, 2008 1:34 PM:it's only you!

Tommy wrote on Oct 16, 2008 1:46 PM:Ever since they took out the two-story clock I've had no interest in Plaza Camino Real -- I spend my money elsewhere.

Funnier wrote on Oct 16, 2008 3:35 PM:"that camino real property would be a nice place for another golf course don't ya think carlsbad?"

There's always one idiot in the crowd.

FTM to HOW ABOUT wrote on Oct 16, 2008 3:42 PM:AND TO SUPPORTING HOW ABOUT:

WHAT BIGGER GREEN SPACE CAN YOU GET THAN THE EL CORAZON???

Oceanside is commiting more acers to green space right in the middle of the city than any other town in North County!

What part of Westfields payroll are you on? Are you employees of the mall? Or are you just hacks for the corporation???

Have you not seen all the letters here???

100% of ALL LETTERS have been AGAINST the Westfield Mall!! You and your "supporter" are the only two people who think it's okay for Carlsbad Mall to threaten Oceanside for building thier own mall!!!

Carlsbad has been sucking taxes out of Oceanside for 20 years with that crummy mall!

And as for the economy: the demograpgics are quite clear: there will be a HUGE population bubble surging through our entire country in three years as the larges baby boom in the history of the US begins to work it's way through our economy. The peak of that boom was last year. The beginnings of the boom start to hit us in 2010. It takes two years to build a mall.

The people building this mall have the timing just right.

Thanks to NCT for printing stuff that could lose them advertizing dollars. It takes some guts.

Schrooms wrote on Oct 16, 2008 3:44 PM:How dark and dank is PCR? So much so that it's ideal for growing schrooms. Love the orange tiles outside the macys.

Boycott Westfield wrote on Oct 16, 2008 4:05 PM:Hey Westfield

There is a gonna be plenty of business in your shopping center. Carlsbad needs a good in-door swap meet.

former mall security wrote on Oct 16, 2008 5:06 PM:westfield malls are dumps. i used to work at north county fair. westfield will let anybody move in as long as they get their dime. doesnt matter if its legal or illegal. the malls were better when the hahn corp owned them. westfield is the worst thing that has happened to these malls. i do all my shopping at simon corp owned malls. mall security is a joke now. just a bunch of 18 year olds actin like they are cops. security will hire anybody who walks in the door. i urge all to boycott wesrfiwld malls.

Devil Dog Mall wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:01 PM:This is a dump for a mall. It is always too warm in the mall and there aren't many good stores. Why does Westfield ignore North County? We don't have nice stores like those in UTC. So build another mall so we can save gas and shop in North County. Turn Devil Dog Mall into a park.

Grump wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:10 PM:How About, you have some great ideas! I guess all of these "build it and they will come" backers for more concrete and blacktop have never sat in traffic on 76.

yoli wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:01 PM:They are kidding, right? That mall is a disgrace! If they could call it a mall. I could see if it was serious competition. Maybe they could learn a thing or two from UTC.

Supporting How About wrote on Oct 16, 2008 9:20 PM:It get's tiring reading how those that might disagree with an opinion are labeled as being "on the payroll" of some party or another. Where is this "payroll" everyone keeps talking about? Is there really a way I can get paid for expressing my opinion here? Because if there is, sign me up!

Did anyone write anything about a big park? Did anyone say it's OK for Westfield to "threaten" the Pavilion developer? In reality, did Westfield "threaten" anyone, or did they just do what corporations do, playing legal games with each other, usually at the expense of the rest of us?

The point is, specifically for FTM who apparently missed it entirely (or can't read), that we have plenty of malls, half of them are at least partially vacant, no one has any money to spend, and quite honestly spending all that money at malls has mainly just helped increase consumer debt.

This mentality of borrowing one's way to prosperity is killing this economy. Demographics might indicate the population will grow, but what FTM fails to say is this "boom" will be made up of mostly poorer immigrants. Think they'll have a bunch of cash to blow at the new Pavilion? I think not. The only way all this new population will buy anything there is 1) If it's at a dollar store or 2) if the charge it. But I guess that's OK, right? Run out of room on the old credit card. No problem. Just get a new credit card! Minimum payments aren't that much anyway. And a bankruptcy cures all!

So tell me FTM, when does Westfield send me the check? Because if they do, I owe you a beer!

dewey wrote on Oct 16, 2008 10:59 PM:shop online

FTM to SHA wrote on Oct 17, 2008 6:49 AM:I use inflammitory terms often as a way to tease people into giving me more information about thier opinion. I usually find that when i do that the person responding actually has more in common with my position than one would think by reading thier inital blog. It's a rude trick I use to smoke out a persons true feelings. Anyway, as you pointed out - everyone who disagrees is not on the Westfield payroll - so I owe you a beer. You also made some really important comments like agknowleging the green space argument is not really appropriate to Oceanside (because we have the El Corazon) and that it really does suck the way Carlsbad busineses threaten Oceanside everytime Oceanside tries to do anything godd for Oceanside! La Costa lawyers have helps block a nice hotel in Oceanside for years. Carlsbad puts gravel pits and trinket malls and sewage spills right on it's boarder with Oceanside while closing off streets like Cannon causing all kinds of detriment to Oceanside residents. All that is turning around now and I think turnabout is fair play.
Carlsbad tried to move the power plant to the border of Oceanside!!! They are not going to get away with any tricks anymore. As for the "we have enough malls" you right! PAVILLIONS is not a mall! It's more like the Trader Joes and Barnes and Noble marketplaces on Fire Mountain, (which are AWAYS PACKED). The new way to build shopping is to open air the buildings so they can be torn down or replaced quickly. No more 'permanent' covered mall structures. The Immigrants you refer to are not the boom, it's thier KIDS! And thier kids are not spanish speaking gardeners. Because your electing Obama they will be highly educated and well endowed with all kinds of entitlements (with YOUR tax dollars) so they will be buying 'stuff' like crazy (on YOUR dime!)
Anyway, thanks for responding, your second blog makes you look much more intelligent and makes me look dumb so good job.
Thanks to NCT for publishing stuff that could cost them - it takes guts to do that.

Aussie invasion wrote on Oct 17, 2008 7:54 AM:Westfield is an Australian corporation with very very deep pockets. They hire high-end representation. They take this threat to their market share very seriously. Do not underestimate Westfield, they usually get their way.

Robert wrote on Oct 17, 2008 9:04 AM:Westfield needs to give it up. They let this mall go down hill. Had they taken better care of it and put good tenants in place there would be no concern for them. But instead Robinson's goes out of business and they put some crappy furniture store there? give it a rest. Besides that they are worried, rumor has it that the city of Carlsbad has to build more "affordable" (low income) housing and they are looking at the property adjcent to the mall, which will finish to run it into the ground, this is what the real issue is. I think the mall should be torn down since Carlsbad can't keep it up.

Supporting How About to FTM wrote on Oct 17, 2008 10:38 AM:I'm only going to buy you that beer if I get the check from Westfield, so don't hold your breath (ha, ha).

Your right about the whole Carlsbad vs Oceanside thing. They've been kicking our butts here when it comes to making the right development decisions for so many years my Grandfather can give me examples. And I have to admit that seeing OHS hand CHS their heads in football (or any sport really) still puts a huge smile on my face even after all these years.

Maybe if our City Council wasn't constantly trying to tear each others throats out, and actually worked together to come up with a PLAN, we could turn that around. Ever see the Carlsbad City Council out making fools of themselves this way?

Nancy wrote on Oct 21, 2008 10:09 AM:I can't believe that Westfield is doing this. The Pavilion isn't even comparable to the El Camino Shopping Mall. I live in northeast Oceanside and have been waiting for a nice entertainment/shopping experience since I moved here. I don't even go to that mall; it is a joke. All they need to do is remodel their mall and they would'nt have to worry about anything. I am also looking forward to driving 5 minutes to Target instead of 15 minutes.

New O-sider wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:47 PM:From what I hear the El Camino Mall is a dump. Haven't had the chance to see the place but sounds like a terribly kept Mall. I'm use to Fashion Island, Newport Beach and South Coast Plaza type malls so to hear the horrible reviews, why would I go?! Westfield owners should be ashamed of themselves to let that mall get that bad! It's a joke! The "new" Pavillion will be the place to go! It will give family's a place to shop and be entertained. It will bring in new jobs and raise the cities economy! It will definitely take away the "Eye sore" that was once a drive in. The Swap meet can prolly move to the beach and become a weekly "beach themed" swap meet event. If El Camino Mall is really in Carlsbad...Then why the heck are they "butting in" Oceanside affairs? For example, I've never heard of Irvine against any changes Newport Beach wanted to make! You know what I'm saying....El Camino must REALLY be worried/anxious about the competition! LOL...As they should be! Look what the Irvine Spectrum did for Irvine! This will definitely put Oceanside,CA on the Map! I am really looking forward to this Venue! C'mon City Council...Make it happen!