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LETTERS: NCT, Nov. 27, 2008
By Readers of the North County Times | ∞
What's with the pricey vino?
At the recent gathering of international leaders hosted by our president at the White House, the menu was opulent. However, that $500 bottle of wine was ridiculous. With our country in deep recession and millions of Americans out of work, this sends the wrong signal about how our tax dollars are being spent.
Bill Wernett
Fallbrook
As traditions change, so must society
The people have spoken! Twice! Gays cannot marry! Final answer? It may seem like the reality now, but considering that the opposition to gay marriage has decreased from 61.4 percent in 2000 to 52 percent in 2008, it is very possible that a proposition in 2012 to change the California constitution that would allow gay marriages would pass by 4 to 5 percentage points.
Would the "Yes on 8" supporters accept that vote of the people? This is not meant to be an "in your face" comment, but more of a reality check.
Traditions change. The will of the majority is not always fair and just. If left to the will of the people, a state like Mississippi or Alabama might still have segregated schools today. It is the job of the courts to protect the rights of the minority from abuse by the majority.
Being uncomfortable with something does not justify discrimination. The courts decided then that separate was not equal. That decision did not automatically change the hearts and minds of the people about blacks, but it did set the stage for change. Because of that, we will soon have a black president, and our society is better for it.
Larry Gerling
Oceanside
Reminiscing about caballeros
What a refreshing jewel was the letter about the caballeros among the letters of Sept. 27. It brought back the wonderful memories of California and the tranquillity of our life before the "progress."
There was another celebration of the yearly San Luis Rey Mission Fiesta Days, where the caballeros would also participate on one certain Sunday in July. The public would assemble on the front ground of the mission, facing the opposite hill across Mission Road.
At 2 p.m. sharp, the mission bells would start to ring the welcome, and the silhouettes of the first caballeros would appear on the top of the hill, led by a padre carrying a wooden cross and leading his burro. The Marine Honor Guard on horses woud start to ride down the hill, the flags fluttering in the wind, and the caballeros, in their beautiful costumes, would follow, switchback and crisscrossed till they reached the mission's front, where the mission's padres and the Indians from the local tribes were waiting to welcome them. And during all this time, the bells kept on ringing!
What a spectacle it was! I still get the goosebumps just remembering.
And not to forget the wonderful smells drifting in from the mission's bakery, where the bread, baked for this occasion, could be bought, and also the other wares offered by the many colorful booths. The Indians would be performing their tribal dances for the admiring public. It was beautiful!
Thank you, Mr. Miller of San Marcos, for bringing up these wonderful memories of the caballeros.
Eve Cole
Vista
Warming report ignores record cold
An article in the Nov. 18 issue states, "Study says county to get hotter, sea to rise 18 inches by 2050" based on a report by the San Diego Foundation. Bill Kuni, the foundation chairman, predicts that unless drastic actions are taken to reduce "greenhouse gases" by 2050, temperatures will climb between 1.5 to 4.5 degrees, and rising sea levels will put beaches and coastal communities at risk.
Mr. Kuni claims the foundation's report is based on solid fact, but he does not reveal any of those facts. One fact not in dispute is that the foundation paid $173,000 for the report. Mr. Kuni ignores established facts.
The winter of 2007/2008 set record cold temperatures and record snowfalls. This fall, records for cold and snowfalls have already been broken.
London was hit by snow in October for the first time since 1922. The Swiss lowlands received the most snow for any October since 1939.
Ocala, Fla., had its second coldest October temperature since 1850. October temperatures fell to record lows in Oregon, and Boise, Idaho, got the earliest snowfall in history.
Mr. Kuni claims he can predict what will happen 30 years from now, but not what the weather will be tomorrow.
Frank Thurlow
Vista
Petition for reasonable rights recognized!
Fun. In the city of no hope. ... Written for any wealth of knowledge discerned for a miracle to arrive in light of art's survival. Called zeitgeist, up against the Downtown Business Association's fees. Well wishing for whomever, however, as this may be a practice in futility. Perhaps I'll get lucky for stretching my neck out, as an artist, for reasonable rights recognized. I just signed a petition called "Merchants Petition for Voluntary Membership: To The City of Escondido."
Steven Drake
Escondido
Real estate in crisis
The finance crisis in real estate has an unpublicized source in lack of care in appraising homes, misuse of computerized multiple listing service of homes to get increased prices, pumped-up values when in an uncaring judicial-legal process, and many lenders refused to perform an analysis of loan capacity of home buyers and sellers.
All of the above misleads home buyers and sellers by the so-called skilled persons in the real estate industry. The home buyer, who is unskilled in the real estate process, is then a sitting duck at the mercy of the real estate industry.
A major wrong is the setting of an old home value to the value of a newly constructed home. That creates a finance problem for the appraiser, the broker MLS, lender, judicial-legal process, buyer and seller.
A similar situation was in the 1980s by fewer real estate practitioners, but in the year 2000 and thereafter, it became a common situation to excessively chase the dollar and collaborate to entice home buyers and sellers, thereby helping to create a real estate crisis nationwide.
Ervin Sommer
Escondido
No logic to car dealership
Why is Escondido going bankrupt? Read the logic of its council on bringing in yet another car dealer ("City approves CarMax lot despite competition concerns," Nov. 21). Daniels likes the fact (?) that Escondido is now a go-to place to buy cars. Forget the fact that nobody's buying, and dealers are in bankruptcy now.
Ex-councilman Gallo says if people don't come here, they'll go elsewhere, and indicated that fear of Carmax is similar to small merchants fearing Wal-Mart. Duh. If his logic isn't loony, why don't we have more porn stores, "massage" parlors, liquor stores and bars, etc.? He's thinking as he votes to close libraries, cancel parades, reduce police and therapy pools for kids/elderly, etc.
Abed/Gallo promised more high-paying jobs when elected and gave us zero. Abed says today Escondido is prosperous, while voting to cut our safety and increase over 170 services we pay for. He now predicts $500,000 in sales tax, as he/they predicted we'd get over $600,000 a year from the new toxic-spilling utility plant they voted for. He predicts we'll get a lot of money while voting to donate $20,000,000 to a developer for a hotel-to-nowhere and votes to send $3,000,000 every year to the white elephant called the Arts Center.
These are the people most Escondidans elected to spend their money.
Perhaps, just perhaps, Olga Diaz will be able to shine a light on financial facts, being the only councilperson with high-finance experience. When/if she does, let's give her some help in 2010 and get rid of the total deadwood that put us in this position with their –– logic?
Gerald Lenhard
Escondido
Extremism is a tool to gain control
Vaclav Klaus, Czech president, knows all about communism, a belief that he recalls once claimed it would "command the wind and the rain." Thus Klaus wrote "Blue planet in green shackles: What is endangered: Climate or freedom?"
Klaus sees no difference between the ideology of communism and that of climate change. He believes that climate change alarmism is nothing but a socialist model for the centralization of economic control, "a false identity for the failed United Nations which seeks power over governments and the citizens of the world."
"Environmentalism has become a quasi-religion; an ideology that shares much in common with Marxism. Climate change is the new recruiting strategy for the anti-capitalist, Socialist, Communist army. They are both monolithic belief systems designed to suppress human freedom."
The alarmists like Al Gore "invoke the image of apocalyptic imminent danger in order to trigger the need in others to have a savior –– a messiah."
Americans need to pay attention to Klaus and understand that today's environmental extremism has nothing to do with saving the environment but is being used as a tool to gain control over human freedom and is a mortal threat to national security, national sovereignty and the future of humanity.
Darrell Beck
Ramona
Thanks to EPD for enforcing traffic laws
With the ongoing bashing and haranguing that the Escondido Police Department and its intrepid chief, Jim Maher, are receiving at the hands of local gadfly Bill Flores and other pro-illegal alien forces desperately trying to scapegoat, intimidate and oppress them for doing their jobs, I feel compelled to thank the EPD for the fine work they are doing enforcing our traffic laws.
Escondido, which is home to thousands of illegal aliens, has one of the highest felony hit-and-run rates in California, not a few of which involve illegals. The police safety checkpoints are reducing these events and saving lives.
Mr. Flores and those holding vigils are using deceptive and divisive rhetoric attempting to make this a racial issue, when in fact it is rightly a law enforcement and safety issue, applicable to all drivers. These advocates of selective enforcement apparently care more about Latino illegal aliens than they do the general safety of all Escondido motorists.
Many Escondido residents would like to know where City Council newcomer Olga Diaz, who has been openly pro-Latino illegal alien, stands on this vital public safety issue. Please call the EPD at (760) 839-4722 to support these safety checkpoints.
Thank you, Chief Maher!
Gary Walker
Escondido
Save Detroit and America; buy American
The free market cannot solve the big problems; there's no foresight.
Republicans define "freedom" as being able to buy any car they want. Republicans fought regulations that would have caused a larger percentage of small cars to be already tooled up and selling. But Republicanism is an aggravated and collective exercise in mass irresponsibility.
Detroit made what sold, enabled by the "free market." So did the foreign manufacturers in our south, making mostly SUVs.
The buy-in or loan, at $75B, is about $250 per person. A $50K Lexus buyer sends about $40K trickling down to Japan, negating the rescue participation of 160 other taxed Americans.
When I see a foreign upscale car with a "Support our Troops" sticker or a flag, I'm seeing a confused person. A destructive person. The buyer sends the money overseas, then generally gets poor mileage, sending more money overseas. If you really believe in trickle down, then do your part.
Republicans say we must attack the workers, lowering benefits, wages and legacies. I say we band together.
Americans should buy American cars. Our national infrastructure, military and middle class depend on it. National health care will help free up American manufacturing. Buying American will save them.
Richard Crews
Encinitas
Benefits are paid with our taxes
The Observer might morph into an Associated Press ombudsman, with attention to the odd cast of AP news. For instance, we have just been treated to a long puff piece for the government's extension of unemployment benefits. It made no mention that these are actually paid by the employer to the government as a tax. The government bureaucrats are paid to occupy paid positions to send smaller checks to the unemployed.
A more sensitive subject are the ruinous pensions paid to Oceanside fire and police retired. As I write, the city of San Diego is likewise being pushed into bankruptcy by the fire and police unions. No mention in our fine North County Times.
Vincent Morrison
Oceanside
Mindless love for country is un-American
Whether or not you love your country is an important issue in America, particularly at election time.
If you criticize the United States for any reason, you will be accused of "blaming America first" and not loving your country in the approved way, and whole sections of the country were labeled less American during the campaign. The presumption is that people who favor America's actions in the world, no matter how wrong, love America more than those who criticize the country for its misdeeds.
This mindless love of country is wrong, destructive and un-American.
If you love another person, you do so in spite of his or her imperfections, but you don't deny the flaws exist. If your son invades other countries without cause, or your daughter enslaves people for generations, you don't ignore it.
When Dad sells out the values he taught you for profit, you call him on his hypocrisy. And when Mom decides everyone must worship as she does, you object. Why should love of country be any different?
At its best, America stands for important human values, and when she fails them, we must speak out, to form a more perfect union. Now that's love!
Paul Cavanaugh
Ramona
Bad economy can cause positive changes
Don't misinterpret me, I feel for the thousands of people who are suffering during these challenging times. But since we are here, I suggest we look around and assess some of the benefits. Perhaps then, when the economy starts to rebound, we can steer it in a new direction.
Today we are driving less, buying less and building less. Thus we are polluting less and causing much less damage to our home, the Earth.
Why don't we just keep it up once we get more money in our pockets? Rather than driving to the grocery store, walk, bike or take public transit. I promise you, you'll feel better getting the exercise.
Rather than producing disposable everything, let's build products that last and can be repaired when broken. Rather than building tracts of poorly constructed new homes on unspoiled land, let's upgrade the homes we have.
All of this will fuel a strong economy –– we will need people designing clean transportation options, engineers creating smart products that don't end up in the landfill, architects and builders designing the zero energy homes of the future.
We have a choice about how we spend our money –– let's do it wisely.
Judy Berlfein
Encinitas
Proposition 8: No intolerance
Those who oppose the "yes" decision of the voters on Proposition 8 are showing their real face as they riot in the streets. Their attacks on individuals, churches and businesses that supported the "yes" vote shows the level of their own hate and deep intolerance for people who believe real marriage only exists between a man and woman.
Current efforts to overturn the democratic voting process with street violence and judicial fiat demonstrates their disregard for the basic principals of democracy.
Those who oppose Prop. 8 try to argue it is a "civil rights" issue in order to obscure their true agenda. It is not, and never was, a civil rights issue.
California Domestic Partnership laws already guarantee the civil rights of those who desire to have a same-sex relationship. If there are perceived inadequacies in those laws, those issues should be addressed as changes to those laws.
It is the right and obligation of parents, not government/public schools, to teach their children moral values which they deem to be in their, and society's, best interest. These parental rights cannot be ceded without dire civil liberties consequences.
G. Ross Johnson
Poway
Prop. 8 opponents don't get it
Proposition 8 opponents: It is not that I (we) don't get it; it is that they don't get it. Most people do not care who lives with each other under a contract. If two gays or two lesbians want to join in a relationship, so be it.
The word "marriage" over the centuries has been defined as a contract between a man and a woman. Leave it that way. Why should I (we) conform to their way of thinking? Leave me alone.
Why doesn't the gay/lesbian community come up with a word that would fit and identify their lifestyle? How about a word such as "couplage" for any couple that wants to commit to a life together. They would then not be offending the definition of the word "marriage." This is what offends most of the objection to their pursuit of happiness.
If necessary, have the laws of the land conform to a new definition of the homosexual lifestyle.
Gordon Cargill
Rancho Bernardo
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But Richard Crews wrote on Nov 27, 2008 4:11 AM:You suggest that we buy cars that are more expensive, less fuel-efficient, are poorer quality and do not last as long as imports so that we can help the American economy?
Let me get this straight: you want us to spend more money, more frequently, use more fuel, pay UAW members' exorbitant pay, insurance and retirement benefits and be at greater risk of breakdown on the road to help the American economy?
Nope, my momma didn't raise a fool.
But Paul Cavanaugh wrote on Nov 27, 2008 4:19 AM:Your letter may fly in the face of the "America, Love it or leave it" people but your letter is spot on.
Greenergy wrote on Nov 27, 2008 6:02 AM:It is truly sad to see how many North County victims are duped by the scare tactics of Big Oil propaganda, as well as somewhat unsettling to realize how far-reaching the consequences of this misinformation have been, as we see today the pitiful letters by Frank Thurlow and Darrell Beck.
Once again, amateurs who know NOTHING dismiss serious, well-documented research by those scientists who do NOT have financial interests in the outcomes.
Thurlow's letter shows he still cannot tell the difference between WEATHER (local, short-term, volatile) and CLIMATE (general, long-term, steady). His flippant comment about not being able to predict tomorrow's WEATHER but understanding long-range CLIMATE is definitive proof of his abject ignorance of this difference. And as I noted yesterday, his recitation of examples of extremes in cold weather (which he tries to isolate from the overall warming trends - what a distortion of data!), are actually validations of the model, which predict exactly that (which Thurlow would know if he read real science instead of Big Oil scare tactic propaganda).
Oh, and Beck, ignoring scientists and shooting the messenger who tries to make their arcane reporting accessible to everyday people, goes so far as to equate "alarmists" like Al Gore with Communist tyranny! Climate science is NOT BASED ON AL GORE. AL GORE IS NOT EVEN A SCIENTIST!
Perfect example of shooting the messenger!
Sad that mature people can be duped so easily.
Scary that these people are eligible to vote!
3D wrote on Nov 27, 2008 6:49 AM:What an astonishing metaphor in Darrel Beck's letter this morning, allegorically comparing Al Gore to a savior or messiah!
Beck says environmentalists "invoke the image of apocalyptic imminent danger in order to trigger the need in others to have a savior - a messiah."
Of course, this is pure hyperbole. No environmentalists worship Al Gore or make him a messiah or savior, any more than any political supporter of Obama calls him a messiah. These are taunts made up by those who oppose Gore or Obama.
Ironically, it is the religious conservatives who DO use the LITERAL threat of apocalyptic "end times" to trigger the need for a "savior" or "messiah" that they literally do believe in! So it seems that these taunts they make are merely their own projections of the worst in themselves and trying to pin those labels on others whose beliefs actually bear no resemblance whatsoever.
Beck further demonstrates the psychology of projection by accusing climate scientists of wanting to tyrannize others, but it is the religious conservatives who want to pass laws to tyrannize the private lifestyle matters of others and force others to comply with their beliefs through government force.
Environmentalists and liberals do not worship Al Gore or Barack Obama at all, but it does seem that religious conservatives who do worship "a savior - a messiah" are eager to crucify both Gore and Obama in a remembrance of bloody Christian human sacrifice mythology.
Blessings,
3D
Wanda wrote on Nov 27, 2008 7:01 AM:While I'm certain Eva Cole enjoys her romantic "reminiscing about caballeros", it's important to seperate truth from fiction. Mission San Luis Rey was only a mission for twenty some years (some 200 years ago). The crowd at Eva's "Fiesta Days" was larger than the population of North County at that time.
DD Wiz wrote on Nov 27, 2008 7:13 AM:"sdraoul" Still Avoids the Issue
The post from "sdraoul" (yesterday 11/26 - 5:28pm) still shows him to be a complete ..., as he distorts and misrepresents my posts and my positions. He further jumps to conclusions and, yet again, GETS IT WRONG.
1. He continues to refer to me as somehow worshipping FDR as my "God." Why do conservatives always do this? I have repeatedly stated that while I respect him on the economy, I disagreed with him on other issues. Just because Democrats support a particular politician as the best choice in a particular election, does not mean they worship that person or make them a "God." We do not worship Bill Clinton, Al Gore, or Barack Obama. They are politicians. Period. Get over it.
2. Since I have specifically and repeatedly cited FDR's failures in the area of racial justice as examples of points where I recognize his flaws, the fact that "sdraoul" keeps returning to this shows he is intentionally LYING about me since he cannot discuss the issues.
3. He cites the bill by "Senator DUNN." Notice the last name, "sdraoul"? Does it ring any bells with any North County people? It is referring to JOE DUNN, formerly State Senator from Los Angeles who tried unsuccessfully for California Attorney General in 2006. I happen to know the guy. I've chatted with him over beer. And I do know of his passion for this issue and have heard him speak about it, and have accompanied him in addressing it before Latino groups. You say, "I'll bet that DD had no knowledge of this." Once again, a bet you would lose. Once again, you are as WRONG as in your utter and complete failure about election results and every other issue you have discussed.
4. While this was unquestionably an egregious violation of human rights, the numbers were miniscule in terms of having any pronounced effect on the Bureau of Labor Statistics I have cited. You absolutely have not made that connection. Your attempt to tie this to the economy is purely your attempt to CHANGE THE SUBJECT because you can't discuss the actual issue on the table.
Peace, prosperity and sunshine to all, DD Wiz
Caro Cogitatus wrote on Nov 27, 2008 7:34 AM:Darrel Beck, wow, what to say?
How's that tinfoil hat working, Darrel? Trying to control the world by convincing thousands of scientists worldwide to participate in a fraud that may benefit them only peripherally while giving complete control to Al Gore is not the way to do it.
You'll have a better chance of herding a thousand angry cats into a dog-filled pen.
The way to control the citizens into fascism is by raw, unreasoning fear. If you get the citizens fearful enough, you can convince them to support torture, secret prisons, pervasive spying, invasions of foreign countries who control strategic resources, McCarthyism, blind support of the ruling class...
I think I've said too much.
Pluto wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:00 AM:G. Ross Johnson continues to display the hysteria and fundamental dishonesty of Prop 8 supporters. There is no "street violence" or "riot(ing) in the streets". Hundreds of thousands of people have demonstrated peacefully nationwide. In San Diego 20-25,000 people demonstrated on 11-15. The only arrest was a Minuteman counter-protester. The so-called "attacks on individuals, churches and businesses that supported the "yes" vote" involve the legal exercise of first amendment rights, exposing those who supported Prop 8. What are they ashamed of?
And Johnson offers no proof or argument for his claim that it's not a civil rights issue. Like heterosexuals, homosexuals were born that way. They shouldn't be ostracized or deprived of fundamental rights because of who they are. The are hurting nobody. They are entitled to equal protection of the laws, just like those who wanted to marry somebody of another so-called "race". Just like other civil rights movements, millions of straights are fighting for/with the "minority". And just like other civil rights struggles, we won't stop until we win. Morals are evolving. History is on our side.
senior wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:08 AM:Gerry Lenhard go easy on ... Your analogy comparing a car dealer (which will not even open until 2010) to porn shops is mind boggling. And in case you haven't noticed the economic downturn is WORLDWIDE not just in Escondido. Also, Olga Diaz has a degree in accounting not finance. There is a vast difference between the two. I just love the way the city contribution for the hote, as an investment in the city's future income, in your mind has risen from $18.6M to $2M. I hope OD doesn't account the same way you finance.
Gary Gary Gary please wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:17 AM:The ongoing bashing and haranguing that Bill Flores and other human rights activists are suffering at the hands of local and outside entities must stop. Chief Mahar uses these checkpoints to scapegoat, intimidate and oppress the Latino community as these check points are held in areas where the Latinos frequent. Also the frequency of the check points must be called into question. Mr. Walker they are not enforcing our traffic laws they are targeting a community and detaining them without probable cause and violating our right to the privacy of our person, papers, and property. I will thank the EPD when they stop this horrible tactic. We all know these checkpoints are the eptiome of racial profiling. The EPD are doing their jobs if their job is to create a police state in the city where I live, and I am against it. I feel compelled to speak to Chief Maher and our City Council and ask how they justify the injustice of these checkpoints.
You say "Escondido, which is home to thousands of illegal aliens, has one of the highest felony hit-and-run rates in California, not a few of which involve illegals." Where is your proof? Words are nice but I like prove rather than rhetoric. You go on to say "The police safety checkpoints are reducing these events and saving lives." Again Gary where is your proof? I like the way you call them "safety check points" nice (wink, wink) but once again empty rhetoric. You encourage people to call the Escondido PD and thank them well just remember folks when you make that call to the Escondido PD you are thanking them for violating the 4th Amendment right of the people.
Can you be certain you won't be next? How can any American be a party in this travesty? How can any American think it is okay to violate the rights of the people? Today the Latino community, when will it be your turn? Open your eyes people and see this for what it is; the beginning of a police state. I shutter to think we are headed in that direction please do all you can before we reach that horrible destination. Yes please do call the EPD and encourage them to stop this shameful tactic. Gary you may feel compelled to thank the EPD for their tyranny but I do not!!
Pluto wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:19 AM:Gordon Cargill says: "The word "marriage" over the centuries has been defined as a contract between a man and a woman. Leave it that way. Why should I (we) conform to their way of thinking? Leave me alone."
The universe is evolving. Things don't stay the same. Words get redefined all the time. We're expanding the word marriage to include gays and lesbians. No worries, heterosexuals will still be included. Why should you "conform" to our way of thinking? Because it's the fair thing to do, and because the equal protection clause demands it. Leave you alone? My pleasure!
Thank You wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:19 AM:Larry Gerling
Great, excellent Letter to Ed. And it is published on Thanksgiving Day.
Your letter is better than turkey and all the trimmings.
Thank You
~Tony
Excellent wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:23 AM:Paul Cavanaugh is indeed an all American citizen.
Thank you for another Thanksgiving Day 'dish' --- your food for thought.
~Tony
Paul wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:24 AM:someone please ask Frank Thurlow to study climate change, so he will stop misrepresenting it. For the last time, climate change does not mean it will be hotter everywhere, always.
Evolution wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:25 AM:Gordon Cargill is wrong when he says:
"The word "marriage" over the centuries has been defined as a contract between a man and a woman." Until the 19th century it was a contract between two families. The man and woman (usually a girl) had little or nothing to do with it. In many countries this tradition endures today. "Marriage" continues to evolve.
Borrego wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:28 AM:To senior
Do you mean $20M instead of $2M?
You might want to do a little proof reading before posting.
Here's what brings it up to $20M, maybe more. In two NCT articles, the motel deal also calls for the city to complete some infrastructure work THAT WOULD COST A FEW MILLION DOLLARS MORE(over and above the $18.9M).
How much is a few? 1 million, 2 million?
Perhaps the ground lease payments will cover those added expenses?
http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/10/23/news/inland/escondido/zfea7554003f8f113882574eb006f8812.txt
DD Wiz wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:43 AM:Further Reflections on Injustice Against Mexican-Americans
The post from "sdraoul" (yesterday 11/26 - 5:28pm) that I addressed in my earlier post (7:13am) invites some additional reflection and contemplation:
To "sdraoul":
1. I fully supported an apology AND REPARATIONS PAYMENTS to the victims of the Japanese Internment. I fully support a full apology AND REPARATIONS for the victims of illegal government violations of civil liberties against Americans of Latino or Mexican descent, most of whom had lived continuously in Southern California from the days that it was known as "Alto California" and was a state in the Republic of Mexico. I repudiate and condemn all racism from which these injustices emanated. If you agree with me on the above points, which are consistent with all of my prior postings, then we do not have any point of disagreement on this matter. That said, it has NOTHING to do with the successful economic policies of FDR that ended the Great Depression and, again, your repeated returning to this point (on which we seem to agree) shows you are trying to --
a) change the subject; and
b) find some basis for slanderous personal attacks against me.
2. Did you or did you not support DEMOCRAT JOE DUNN, State Senator from Los Angeles, in his 2006 bid for California Attorney General (a campaign in which I was actively involved)? Since you seem to think that justice for the victims of Mexican-American oppression in the 1930's and 1940's is the singular and only issue that matters, to the exclusion of all else, if any person did not vigorously support the candidacy of this DEMOCRAT (as I did), who was the strongest voice for justice on this issue, would you say that would make such a person an anti-Mexican bigot? Just asking.
3. Is Ronald Reagan the conservative "God" (despite his record of budget deficits, trade deficits, failed financial institutions and stock market crashes)? Just wondering, since the conservatives are so eager to declare that any Democratic support for any Democratic politician is the equivalent of "worshipping" that person as a "God." Just trying to figure out what troubling character flaw in themselves Republicans are projecting onto Democrats when they do this.
Peace, prosperity and sunshine to all, DD Wiz
Ms M wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:47 AM:Happy Thanksgiving to all. Eat, drink and be thankful. I wish all a very, very special day! A safe one too.
minorities wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:47 AM:"IN A GENERATION, MINORITIES MAY BE the U.S. MAJORITY"
quoted from the NYTimes.
~Tony
To Pluto wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:49 AM:Good point about the only arrest at the Prop. 8 protest was a minuteman. Of course we all know the minutemen are a peaceful non-violent group! I wish this newspaper and others would have given us more details like you know his name, age, race and immigration status.
Karl wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:04 AM:Ms M
[-] wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:47 AM:Happy Thanksgiving to all. Eat, drink and be thankful. I wish all a very, very special day! A safe one too.
Back at you Ms M, have a wondeful day. I've got one bird in the crockpot and one in the oven, boy is smells good.
Peace
Ms M wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:08 AM:jvc
[-] wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:49 AM:..don't forget a nice cold, crisp glass of Chardonnay to wash it all down!
ShawnP wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:16 AM:The letter from Paul Cavanaugh was indeed, spot on---I myself would probably be classified as an "America, Love It Or Leave It" people, but extremism on any view or topic is dangerous and usually wrong.
A blessed and happy Thanksgiving and holiday season to all.
Nuff Said wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:42 AM:ROLL OVER FROM 112608:
Nuff Said[-] wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:39 AM:MarineGunner[-] wrote on Nov 27, 2008 8:08 AM: I do not have a problem with comprehension. My comment was addressed to you because you presented it. It had your identifying moniker. It is your nerve that was hit due to your bombastic remarks. Again, are you going to quote me or not regarding your statements. You know why you can not quote me. I never said or inferred anything to evidence your complaints.
Marines do not make excuses. You made plenty of them.
MarineGunner wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:46 AM:Hey there Greenergy,
You sure like to use the word "flippant".
You do realise that the climate on this planet has been changing ever since this little ball we live on started to spin, don't you?
The planet has gone through periods of extreme heat as well as ice ages. These changes have occured numerous times over the millenia without any influence from us(man). They were going on before we were here and they will continue whether we are here or not. Let's hope it does continue though, if it stops we all die.
What is truly sad is that you have bought into the alarmist propaganda of the "Climate Change" agenda.
You can stick your head in the sand all you want. You can even make yourself feel superior to us by professing from on high that we(man) are the cause of "climate change". There is no doubt that we(man) have had SOME influence, but not nearly to the extent that you would have us believe.
No one advocates irresponsibility when it comes to the environment. We are not fools as you would like to think.
The information to refute your agenda is easily accessable. So, look it up, wait, that is too flippant for you. How about: do some research.
sdraoul wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:47 AM:Poor DD. He continues to waffle and obfuscate my focusing on his deficiencies.
He states that the Mexican round-ups by FDR storm troopers were "miniscule" in numbers. He doesn't cite numbers or a source. My references to books and articles suggest that 500,000 Mexican looking people were deported by the illegal sweeps.
Since when is half a million people miniscule when the population of California in those days was about 12 million TOTAL!
As to Joe Dunn, his only legacy is the bill he introduced that I posted in its entirety. The fact that he was A Democrat trying to apoloigize for FDR is significant to me; not that he ran for some other office when termed out of the senate.
DD continues to slime Ronald Reagan's eight years with little basis in truth. The facts are the country was on its knees under Jimmy Carter. His appointment of former Nixon Under-secretary of Treasury Paul Volcker was
Carter's only accomplishment in office.
Working hand in glove with Reagan, Federal Reserve Chairman Volcker beat back Jimmy Carter's inflation and righted the economy with a positive direction by President Reagan.
The S and L collapse at the end of the Reagan years happened but was solved and handled by President Bush (41).
No democratic administration in modern history ahs solved huge economic problems within a short period of time as President Bush solved the crisis of his administration.
Look how Clinton left office with the economy in recession, with Enron, with MCC, with the dot.com bubble that burst and caused California and other states to plunge into marginal bankruptcy that we still suffer under plus unemployment that rose sharply in 2001.
WELL SAID wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:49 AM:“Once again, we come to the Holiday Season, a deeply religious time that each of us observes, in his own way, by going to the mall of his choice.” – Dave Barry
jvc wrote on Nov 27, 2008 10:01 AM:Why are we surprised with the economic meltdown in this country when we have every computer in use being made in China?
observer wrote on Nov 27, 2008 10:14 AM:to Pluto
You're right. Morals continue to evolve as you say, but whos to say that these morals are evolving for the betterment of our society. My contention on prop 8 which I voted yes on by the way is that if it was trully unconstitional to begin with, why in the world was it put on the ballot to be voted on? My God, what a tremendous example of a waste of time and resources. The gay community must have surely thought this proposition would be defeated or else why not complain with passion before the vote. To me this seems like a classic case of sour grapes.
observer wrote on Nov 27, 2008 11:05 AM:In regards to the letter written by Bill Wernett. You are absolutly right. The arrogance has got to stop in this country. The message this sends to everyone is that they are more deserving and entitled.
Karl wrote on Nov 27, 2008 11:11 AM:Just had to pass this one on. Sorry to those offended, I just think it's funny.
*If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?*
Peace
Floyd The Scientist wrote on Nov 27, 2008 12:07 PM:I couldn't let the day go by without wishing everyone a happy Thanksgiving, especially the long-suffering and beleaguered blog editor. The exchange of ideas and beliefs in here is challenging and refreshing, even with the occasional foray into illogic and ad hominem responses. Now it's almost time to don my WHITE LAB COAT and dissect the turkey, so have a good afternoon!
Mission Watcher wrote on Nov 27, 2008 12:52 PM:There was nothing tranquil about a mission that enslaved Indians and tried to take their language and culture away. Read some more history books. Also, I believe this is still a Mission and religious services are performed there daily as are burials nad etc.
Vote Out Republicans wrote on Nov 27, 2008 1:05 PM:This Thanksgiving, progressives have a lot to be thankful for. Here’s our list:
We’re thankful we’ll soon have a president who will hit the ground running instead of a president who is running the country into the ground.
We’re thankful that Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow are demonstrating every night how strong and intelligent progressive voices can be successful on TV.
We’re thankful we live in a center-left America rather than “Hannity’s America.”
We’re thankful John McCain has more time to spend in the houses he owns…even if he can’t remember them all.
We’re thankful Sarah Palin has more time to watch over Russia and warn us in case Vladimir Putin ever “rears his head.”
We’re thankful that we’re moving closer towards a complete withdrawal from Iraq.
We’re thankful for the thousands of protesters who took to the streets across America to push for marriage equality.
We’re not thankful for neo-McCarthys, neo-Hoovers, neo-Nazis, and neocons.
We’re thankful for Tina Fey.
We’re thankful to be liberal hacks.
We’re not thankful for hack operatives burrowing into career civil service jobs.
We’re more thankful for Vice President Joe Biden and “Morning Joe” than Joe Lieberman and “Joe the Plumber.”
We’re thankful that our troops will be able to get the education they so richly deserve.
We’re thankful for the “Mustache of Justice,” “Rahmbo,” “Axe,” and “Skippy.”
We’re thankful that reality still has a liberal bias.
We’re thankful that there are only 54 days left until the end of the George W. Bush presidency.
We’re thankful for the progressive mandate to govern.
Happy Thanksgiving!
jvc wrote on Nov 27, 2008 2:47 PM:So, now that science is proving that
the sexual orientation of Gays is
caused by genetics, how is our acceptance of them going to change..especially the church?
Gary of Murrieta wrote on Nov 27, 2008 3:36 PM:Go to the California State Webpage for the Office of Traffic safety. Escondido's Traffic accidents in most all catagories are in the top Worst 3% for cities of its' size in California.
The numbers do not lie
More Driver's License checkpoints please!
TO Gary Gary Gary please wrote on Nov 27, 2008 3:49 PM:Your logic is pretty twisted. I will accept what you say of the "Latinos" section in the city, only if you build a fence around that area and not let them out. As soon as they drive out of their little boundary area where ever that may be, they put the American public at risk. So I guess they cannot drive on the 17 or the 78 freeways. They also cannot go to the Mall.
You also forget that the very "Latinos", that you are defending are also put in jeopardy by unlicensed, untraiined, and uninsured drivers. I can read you story of story after story of Latino children killed by Unlicensed drivers. There was also a Latino father of five killed in an Escondido hit and run, a young man who was an agricultural worker killed by a hit and run driver, and the young lady who was engaged at aged 15 but was run over and killed by a hit and run driver. Its just too bad the media does not tabulate the real numbers, but if you read this paper enough, you will see questionable accidents just about every week.
Many many Latinos I know care about the safety of their families and agree on what I say.
No matter how you twist it or try to justify it, the reality is NO LICENSE NO DRIVE. Untill the laws are changed that is the way it is.
R/ Gary in Murrieta
Ms Syl wrote on Nov 27, 2008 3:52 PM:How come so many people push for American Citizens to use public transportation, but these same people argue for the rights of unlicensed Foreign Nationals to be able to DRIVE as they please?
THE NUMBERS DO NOT LIE wrote on Nov 27, 2008 4:07 PM:REGION: Office of Traffic Safety ranks North County cities
THE REAL NUMBERS - ESCONDIDO
Hit and Run 100, 4/52, 2/52,
Total Fatal and Injury 1,095 5/52, 6/52
Had-Been-Drinking (HBD) Drivers
HBD Driver < 21, 20, 1/52 2/52
HBD Driver 21 - 34, 35 7/52 8/52
Pedestrians 76, 8/52 5/52
Pedestrians under age 15, 19 11/52 6/52
Pedestrians 65+, 10 5/52 5/52
Bicyclists 51, 7/52 12/52
Bicyclists under age 15, 13 7/52 8/52
Composite 4/52 4/52
Nightime (9:00pm -2:59am), 95 4/52 5/52
Oh and HIT and RUN
Hit and Run 100, 4/52, 2/52
http://www.ots.ca.gov/Media_and_Research/Rankings/default.asp
Chris wrote on Nov 27, 2008 4:14 PM:I liked Biil Wernetts comments on the $500.00 bottles of wine at the white house.
Just another example of government misuse and waste of funds. Total arrogance. Hey, dont these guys know that Bev Mo is having their 5 cent wine sale right now?
To Cavanaugh wrote on Nov 27, 2008 7:11 PM:Humanity is more important than nationalism. I hope humans will be around if the U.S. were to somehow fall. I don't think the stars and stripes will matter when we are just trying to survive on a daily basis. Patriotism is being used by the KKK and the Minutemen to promote their hateful agenda. I prefer to put humanity above any country's flag.
FDR wrote on Nov 27, 2008 9:25 PM:SDRaoul at 9:47 a.m. is mixing apples, oranges and bananas so fast I think we got us a fruit salad for Thanksgiving!
DD noted that, regarding the year-by-year NATIONAL unemployment figures he cited, the figures of Mexican Americans whose rights were violated over a period of about a decade, were miniscule in relation to those figures.
So what does SDRaoul do?
Still trying (unconvincingly) to pretend that the reason he CHANGED THE SUBJECT was to somehow make a link to those NATIONAL figures, he cites a figure of half a million.
He does not even cite a source. Just a vague reference to "books and articles."
Wow. That sure is specific. Kind of like Sarah Palin's reading list.
One half of one million over about ten years.
Even if those were all in the same year, using SDRaoul's unsupported numbers, and using them apples-to-apples to the NATIONAL figures DD had cited earlier (with a specific, verifiable government source), that would have been far less than one percent of the national total.
While any injustice to one person is too much and should be condemned, apologized for and even compensated for, in terms of the unemployment figures being discussed, I would have to agree with DD that the correct term for something less than one percent, is indeed miniscule.
I do note that DD made a call for reparations to the victims of those injustices.
Can SDRaoul cite which of the many published books and articles of his that he brags so much about have made a similar call for reparations?
to Larry Gerling wrote on Nov 27, 2008 11:59 PM:OK lets vote again in 2012. The third time is always the charm. But if the Yes people win , by the ever shrinking margins you suggest will the No people finally give it up? Or will they at least give it a rest for awhile. The election is OVER. Move on.
To Gary in Murrieta wrote on Nov 28, 2008 5:30 AM:I just saw your post in response to my comment. I am not able to respond at this time as I am off to work. I will respond as you are the one with the twisted logic. Some food for thought; if the accidents you speak about are hit and runs how do you know they were caused by unlicensed drivers? How do you know they were caused by Latinos? 3% what you lost me on that one. TTFN
DD Wiz wrote on Nov 28, 2008 7:37 AM:Real Support -- Not Lip Service -- for Mexican-American Victims
The post from "sdraoul" (9:47am) seems to be moving all over the map. Please help clarify here:
1. Since you have made the issue of injustice against Mexican-Americans the sole basis on which any politician can be judged, please clarify your views on DEMOCRATIC State Senator JOE DUNN (D-LA). You seemed to know enough to cite his legislative efforts in this area, but dismiss the rest of his stellar career filled with tremendous legislative successes in many areas of looking out for the little guy. And since you have made the issue of correcting the injustice against Mexican-Americans, just the one piece of legislation you cited should be enough to make him a hero in your eyes. But it is not just this one piece of legist ion -- you don't seem familiar enough with this issue to know his strong, passionate support for it. Do I need to educate you on this matter?
In any case, since this is the sole issue of importance to you, please cite which other candidate for California Attorney General in either Republican or Democratic 2006 primaries took stronger positions for correcting these injustices so that you could support that person over DUNN, who made it one of the central pillars of his campaign and repeatedly spoke about it with great passion.
Or do you oppose and demonize anyone with a "D" after their name?
Again, if a person gives lip service to making this the sole criterion for evaluating a politician and only one candidate takes a vigorous position, and that person does not support that candidate, would you or would you not say that person is an anti-Mexican bigot?
2. Do you or do you not support REPARATIONS for the victims of this injustice, and have you called for such remedies in the past? If yes, what kind of mechanism do you propose for such REPARATIONS? If no, please explain how this is not an endorsement of the atrocity you have condemned. For the record, I will repeat that I do support such reparations.
3. I stand by my position that, while any injustice, even to one person, cannot be tolerated, as a statistical matter, and even using the unsubstantiated and inflated numbers you have provided, and even applying them all to any one year, even with your figures the effect on the national employment figures I cited from the Bureau of Labor Statistics would be, yes, MINISCULE.
You are backtracking, waffling, treading water and -- IT ISN'T WORKING.
Peace, prosperity and sunshine to all, DD Wiz
Roberto1 wrote on Nov 28, 2008 7:39 AM:to the phobes
I've worked in China for the last 3 years and I don't believe the exchange rate 6.8 to 1 dollar is issue nor much else of what is said. Just about everything here cost more except some food. We should seek reciprocal trade agreements with the world and quit blaming the mexicans for whatever is wrong with America. In fact, without their labour, we would be worst off.
Karl wrote on Nov 28, 2008 8:10 AM:Where have you been Bill Wernett? $500 bottles of wine in Washington are nothing. These clowns have been totally out of touch for years and years. Just wait until the inauguration, that'll really give you something to blow up the calculator.
Peace
Greenergy wrote on Nov 28, 2008 8:12 AM:MarineGunner at 9:46 a.m. addresses the following comment to me:
"The information to refute your agenda is easily accessable. So, look it up, wait, that is too flippant for you. How about: do some research."
OK, just like the other day when I researched your claim about a certain local TV weatherman being a "meteorologist" and finding out that he is actually a college dropout who reads a weather script (but does a damn good job of it) and NOT A SCIENTIST and NOT A METEOROLOGIST (which shows your level of knowledge right there since trying to say that someone is a meteorologist but not a scientist says everything we have to know about your understanding of science), I have again accepted your challenge.
I looked it up.
I did the research.
Only one limitation, though.
Knowing that anyone can publish anything, I limited my search to PEER-REVIEWED scientific and academic research journals.
I found several THOUSAND scientific papers that support a broad consenses on global warming / climate change and the extent of human contribution to it (in conjunction with other factors, both aggravating and mitigating).
I did not find ANYTHING to refute anything I have said in any blog.
So if you say it is so easy to find, here is your big chance to prove me wrong.
Find a PEER-REVIEWED article from a qualified scientific or academic research journal that refutes the consensus view.
To the Garys wrote on Nov 28, 2008 10:10 AM:To Gary in Escondido:
No matter how many times you are corrected in your lies about Olga Diaz and her position regarding illegal immigrants - YOU CONTINUE TO INSIST ON SPREADING LIES. YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED. I FEEL SORRY FOR THE PEOPLE IN YOUR LIFE AS YOU INFLUENCE THEM WITH LIES.
To Gary in Murrietta:
Same old Rhetoric! Why don't you tell us how many legal US citizens killed other people - by car, by knife, by gun, by violence? Why do you always have to be pointing out all the crimes of the illegals? Check out the statistics nation-wide and then report back to us. Until then, give your obsession a break.
BarCode wrote on Nov 28, 2008 10:13 AM:TO J Lenhard,
Gallo went with the Carmax plan.He is lookjing for a used vehicle...he lost his in the election.Joke was on Gallo.
The Council should have asked when it was going to be built BEFORE voting.
The Carmax realtor almost busted out laughing when he was asked that question AFTER the vote.He said, "not in this fiscal budget or in the next."
Making THAT seated Council look dumber than dumb.
OOhhhh yeah that is nothing new!
Maybe Gallo supporters can chip in for some bus or sprinter passes.Go big get him a used Pinto!
MarineGunner wrote on Nov 28, 2008 10:18 AM:Greenergy:
I tried to provide a link yesterday that proves John Coleman is, indeed, a meteorologist but that post was not published for some reason.
Either way, I couldn't care less about what you say about him. I am not the John Coleman Defense Initiative...
You pretty much deny everything else I posted and only focused on that singular aspect to make your point yet dismiss all the other points I made by ignoring that information.
With that in mind, I have one more question for you:
Who is John Galt?
Crews is right wrote on Nov 28, 2008 10:24 AM:American cars are as good or better than the imports, cost less to purchase and maintain. Those that don't know this have just bought the propaganda of the multi-nationals. Import drivers maintain their car and then brag how good it is. Domestic drivers buy the car, drive it into the ground and then complain.
The US economy will never rebound until we start "making things" again. Until then the rich will get richer, chinese workers' lives will improve and America workers will suffer.
TO To Gary in Murrietta wrote on Nov 28, 2008 8:48 PM:What Same old Rhetoric!
The origional post was in support of the Driver's License Check Points in Escondido. You asked for facts to support the problems of unlicensed drivers and I provided them. All of the examples and numbers I posted were for Escondido and no where else.
So with your twisted logic, you are now claiming I am bashing Latinos from all over the country. I am not talking about crime, guns, or gangs. I thought we were addressing the problems of unlicensed drivers in Escondido. It is not my fault that the majority of them are Foreign Nationals. That does not change the problem or change the interpretation of the laws.
Nice try.
R/ Gary in Murrieta
Gary in Murrieta wrote on Nov 28, 2008 9:49 PM:Why do I care if there are unlicensed and uninsured Foreign Nationals driving in Escondido?
Because my wife and daughter drive to Escondido several times a month for Ice Skating Lessons.
Even though the unlicensed drivers are not just in Escondido, because we all know you can drive anywhere you like, the situation still causes me great concern.
sdraoul wrote on Nov 28, 2008 10:13 PM:DD I did respond. The editor of this blog chose not to post the response.
Joe Dunn was and is an inconsequential Los Ageless politician. His bill to formally apologize to the estimated 500,000 Mexican looking people, many of whom were American citizens, who were illegally rounded up by the Roosevelt Administration and illegally deported to Mexico was posted by me to show that I am not alone in knowing about the Roosevelt violation of the Constitution.
I asserted you probably knew nothing about the crime by Roosevelt.
Dunn was not of any consequence as he didn't show well against Junior Moonbeam Brown in the run for AG.
As for "reparations" of course I support them when there are living victims of the crime against them by the government. If you can find a Negro slave who is still living, I would be happy to have the government give him or her a million dollars for their deprivation of freedom.
But, what some define as a government crime of deprivation of civil rights is not always a crime.
For example, I fully support Guantanamo Bay detention of enemy combatants. I don't believe they have Geneva Convention rights as they were not organized soldiers or militia-- they were terrorists -- nor should they have criminal defendant rights in our federal courts. They are prisoners by virtue of being enemy combatants. Military tribunals are the way to handle their cases and I fully support them as I did those constituted during the American Civil War, WWI and WWII.
The last attorney general I supported was Don Lundgren who, as Attorney General, did not support Proposition 187 in 1994. He was followed by Lockyer who was a dismal failure as Attorney General.
Moonbeam Brown is little better given his attempt to gut Prop. 8 when his office butchered the title of the Proposition in an effort to torpedo it at the polls.
Donna wrote on Nov 28, 2008 11:42 PM:The City of Oceanside is a part of the Public Employees Retirement System. A combination of contributions by the employees and the City along with investments made by the PERS System pay for retirement benefits.
San Diego is a Charter City and therefore they self-fund their retirement benefits. They failed to put aside enough and that has caused them to be under-funded. That cannot happen with PERS. The attacks on public employees in Oceanside and in San Diego are not at all alike or fair. People who do not have retirement systems except for 401 K's attack public employees under PERS without reason. And, newspapers, well, I think they just do not want to know the truth. So, Vincent find out more about it and you will understand that the taxpayers are in no danger because of employee retirement benefits in Oceanside at least.
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